Revolution and HD: Do your part.

[AlNom]

but 8x FSAA at 640x480 takes ~18.8MB (extrapolated from the values in Dave's table.)


as for 853x480 with 6xFSAA.... I'll just say more than 14MB

edit: should be around 18.75MB


edit2: WxHx32bpp/(8b/B)x2 (include 32bit Zbuffer)xN(FSAA)/1048576B/MB

853x480x32/8*2x6/1048576=18.7426....MB

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I'd have thought the downsampling would produce comparable/better looking results if the bsae level of AA was enough. ie. 720p @ 4x AA downsampled to 480p > 480p @ 16x AA. 4x AA is four samples for each pixel, and downsampled that'll be near the equivalent of 2x (2 squared)supersampling = 16 samples per pixel. Supersampling has less artefacts than randomised multisampling.

 

[Teasy]

but 8x FSAA at 640x480 takes ~18.8MB (extrapolated from the values in Dave's table.)

640x480 x8 using two tiles per frame is 9.4MB though.

 

[PC-Engine]

as for 853x480 with 6xFSAA.... I'll just say more than 14MB

As long as it's less than 16MB of eDRAM then it should be fine.

 

[AlNom]

check my edit


It's 18.75MB


Personally, I can't tell the difference between 4x and 6x on my video card. Well, that's not entirely true. I notice just how much slower it is.

 

[Ty]

First let me reinforce this point first: HD TV, for all its merits, is a side note compared to a feature like online gaming. HD TVs have ~10M install base in the US with I believe 15M projected in the next year.

Just wanted to point out that in the space of a year, going from 10mill to 15mill is a 50% increase. Certainly in terms of absolute #s, HDTV penetration won't catch up to broadband but I just wanted to give food for thought. . .what happens the year after that as HDTV prices continue to fall? Will it only be another 50% increase? Naturally the state of the economy will largely dictate the actual adoption rate but just consider the absolute amount of HDTVs by the end of 2-4 years; which is well within the lifespan of the Revolution.

15 -> 22.5 -> 33.75 -> ???

Secondly the broadband market was pretty damn large when the GCN came out and Nintendo eschewed it then. Not sure why it matters to them now other than they see the potential their competitors are utilizing.

 

[AlNom]

Naturally the state of the economy will largely dictate the actual adoption rate but just consider the absolute amount of HDTVs by the end of 2-4 years; which is well within the lifespan of the Revolution.

Just wanted to add that you also have to consider whether people are willing to replace their regular TVs that work just fine.

 

[Teasy]

I'd have thought the downsampling would produce comparable/better looking results if the bsae level of AA was enough

Possibly comparable, I'm not sure I haven't read that article yet so I don't know if that explains how HDTV games work when played on a normal TV with 360.

720p @ 4x AA downsampled to 480p > 480p @ 16x AA

Just FYI 480p with 16x FSAA would look a lot sharper then 720p 4xFSAA downsampled to 480p. Even 480p 8xFSAA would look sharper (or maybe I'm misunderstanding you there?..)

 

[Teasy]

Do my part?...how stupid is that? If I think HD is that important, how about I just buy a different product? What do I care who provides what I want as a consumer? Very fanboyish heh.

Its not fanboyish for people to want a console that supports HDTV and plays all the new Nintendo games. Buying a 360 or PS3 isn't going to allow you to play Zelda in HDTV resolution so its hardly a satisfatory alternative.

 

[Magnum PI]

[t just consider the absolute amount of HDTVs by the end of 2-4 years; which is well within the lifespan of the Revolution.

15 -> 22.5 -> 33.75 -> ???

there is more than 350 million tv sets in the US.

i think that if the lack of HDTV can damage revolution sales only in the beginning of its lifespan. at its end, les jeux sont faits, if revolution is successfull it will continue to be successful, if it isn't...

and the rate of hdtv equipment won't be strong until some years.

Secondly the broadband market was pretty damn large when the GCN came out and Nintendo eschewed it then.

judging by the number of live subscribers it seems that most of broadband equipped xbox owners weren't motivated enough by online to subscribe..

 

[mckmas8808]

and the rate of hdtv equipment won't be strong until some years.

Depends on what you call strong. To some people thats 25% of the nation. To me its anything over 50%. Once you get half of the nation on HDTV then I consider that strong. Thats like the PS2 selling 150 million consoles in America alone. 50% of the nation is alot. The CEA suggest that the 50% mark will be hit in 2007.

Thats around the same time that the Rev. will be released. So to me as soon as the NR is released half of the U.S. will have HDTVs somewhere in their homes.

Thats pretty important if you ask me. :?

 

[gurgi]

Do my part?...how stupid is that? If I think HD is that important, how about I just buy a different product? What do I care who provides what I want as a consumer? Very fanboyish heh.

Its not fanboyish for people to want a console that supports HDTV and plays all the new Nintendo games. Buying a 360 or PS3 isn't going to allow you to play Zelda in HDTV resolution so its hardly a satisfatory alternative.

I guess so, if you are so tied to the Zelda games. I enjoy them myself, but there are other games out there where you run around with a sword, and they will be playable in HDTV on other consoles. If you're more impressed with graphics, a compromise in gameplay probably wouldn't kill you anyway.

 

[DuckThor Evil]

Exactly and as I already said EDTV (852x480) with very good AA would make this whole HD thing moot.

Well that weird resolution which is supported even less than 720p displays is crap, normal ntsc Widescreen is 720x480 which is quite close to that and Pal widescreen is 720x576, which probably looks better than 852x480. I'd say that even if they support that res, it certainly doesn't make 720p moot, the difference is huge.

edit: with X360 I get 720p with 4xAA, there is no amount of AA for REV to make that up.

edit fixed some bugs.

 

[BlueTsunami]

Exactly and as I already said EDTV (852x480) with very good AA would make this whole HD thing moot.

Well that weird resolution which is supported even less than 720p displays is crap, normal ntsc Widescreen is 720x480 which is quite close to that and Pal widescreen is 720x576, which probably looks better than 852x480. I'd say that even if they support that res nobody else does, it certainly doesn't make 720p moot, the difference is huge.

edit: with X360 I get 720p with 4xAA, there is no amount of AA for REV to make that up.

The Doctor has a point about the 720p with 4xAA compared to (Possible) higher AA at standard resolutions for the Revolution....

 

[AlNom]

Well that weird resolution which is supported even less than 720p displays is crap, normal ntsc Widescreen is 720x480 which is quite close to that and Pal widescreen is 720x576, which probably looks better than 852x480.

853x480 is closer to true 16:9 ratio. That's where you get the weird number even though things are rendered at 720x480 for widescreen (on the Xbox, at least).

 

[Teasy]

edit: with X360 I get 720p with 4xAA, there is no amount of AA for REV to make that up.

Good for you if you have HDTV.. Though 480p with 8xFSAA would look very close if not as good I think (higher source resolution then 720p with 4xFSAA).

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah but Teasy will Nintendo really put in a GPU that can display 8xFSAA? Seriously? :?

 

[Teasy]

As I said that's something to consider mckmas8808, I don't know and we won't know until the end of the year.

 

[AlNom]

Good for you if you have HDTV.. Though 480p with 8xFSAA would look very close if not as good I think (higher source resolution then 720p with 4xFSAA).

hm... I suppose you could just take a couple screenshots from Doom 3 and scale the 640x480 pic (while keeping aspect ratio) to the size of the 1280x720p and take different AA samples during the screenshot to illustrate...

screenshot 640 480 8

r_aspectratio 1
screenshot 1280 720 4 (don't know if setting the aspect ratio beforehand makes a difference to the screenshot command, otherwise do the r_mode -1 stuff)

 

[PC-Engine]

Exactly and as I already said EDTV (852x480) with very good AA would make this whole HD thing moot.

Well that weird resolution which is supported even less than 720p displays is crap, normal ntsc Widescreen is 720x480 which is quite close to that and Pal widescreen is 720x576, which probably looks better than 852x480. I'd say that even if they support that res, it certainly doesn't make 720p moot, the difference is huge.

edit: with X360 I get 720p with 4xAA, there is no amount of AA for REV to make that up.

edit fixed some bugs.

It's not a weird resolution. It's EDTV resolution.

In fact it has the same aspect ratio as 1280x720 and 1920x1080.