PS4 Pro Speculation (PS4K NEO Kaio-Ken-Kutaragi-Kaz Neo-san)

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The leaker who revealed PS4 slim two months ago, also said that another heavy PS4 is 3cm thicker than current model.

If this is also true than SONY really seems to make a console with everything to the limit (operating frequency, cooling solution,etc.).

How fast can SONY push with 170W power consumption and TSMC 16nm FF? 2.5 GHz Jaugar? 6TF GPU? Better RAM?
 
BRiT said:
Sure, Sony can do anything you desire, including getting an extra 50% performance out of a 4TF design with a mere 3cm to hit 6TF.

Come on, be realistic.
Click to expand...
4.2 TF to 6TF is 43%.

PS4 is only 5.3cm thick with roughly 150W. 3cm thicker indicates more power consumption.

And using TSMC 16nm instead of 14 nm of RX 480 means more power efficiency.

What is the reasonable estimation with the above changes?
 
RDGoodla said:
4.2 TF to 6TF is 43%.

PS4 is only 5.3cm thick with roughly 150W. 3cm thicker indicates more power consumption.

And using TSMC 16nm instead of 14 nm of RX 480 means more power efficiency.

What is the reasonable estimation with the above changes?
Click to expand...

6 TF with AMD's currently released GCN cores (Polaris) is going to be at least 170 watts on its own. The Rx 480 with less than 6 TF is already ~170 watts. Now add in the rest of the systems components and a 6 TF PS4 is likely to be over 200 watts.

I'd say there's a much better chance of Sony releasing a 4.4 TF Neo around 150-160ish watts.

Regards,
SB
 
RX480 is in 14nm, however TSMC 16nm seems to have more power efficiency than 14nm.

I think the problem is that how much power of RX 480 in TSMC's process.
 
RDGoodla said:
RX480 is in 14nm, however TSMC 16nm seems to have more power efficiency than 14nm.

I think the problem is that how much power of RX 480 in TSMC's process.
Click to expand...

AMD hasn't said anything with regards to TSMC for their Polaris architechture. They've stated that virtually all GPU production for the Polaris architecture will be at Global Foundries with certain trigger events that could allow them to produce Polaris GPUs at Samsung (same 14 nm technology).

So to use TSMC, either Sony has paid them extra to do the work to get Polaris working on TSMC 16 nm FF or Sony would have to use the older GCN architectures which according to AMD are significantly worse WRT power efficiency. As well, any efficiency gains for TSMC versus GloFlo/Samsung aren't very significant (IE - you aren't going to go from 170 watts to sub 150 watts for the GPU alone).

So, again, it doesn't really change much.

Regards,
SB
 
Grall said:
Nobody's said anything about it so far - strange! - but here's a whole bunch of pics of what's claimed to be a PS4 Slim, complete with box and everything. http://kotaku.com/apparent-ps4-slim-leaks-on-auction-site-1785564272

Looks super genuine, tbh. If it's a fake it's a frighteningly well-made one.

Interesting stuff to consider: Push buttons for power, eject. No fancy schmancy capacitive stuff (sadly!) Also, still offering internal power supply. Of course. :LOL:

Appears to feature three USB connectors on the front. Also, wired ethernet jack on the back. So not exclusively subject to the wifi gods quite yet, thank goodness. (Here's looking at YOU, nintendowuu!)
Click to expand...

It's all in the other thread. :)

Regards,
SB
 
The Neo will be supposedly 3cm thicker than the current Ps4, not the slim. That is interesting, could be because of polaris, cooling solution, could be because of any other reason. We'll know soon enough, the reveal is very close anyway.

Although, the 10lbs weight (og Ps4 is 6.1lbs) is pointing towards a better cooling solution as that is the easiest way i know to increase the weight of the device, that and the psu most likely.
 
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Let's assume a 14nm APU first. In fact RX480 has poor power efficiency after 1075 MHz which means 5TF.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/d...-sony-upgrade-playstation-neo-specs-in-theory

In the power state curve, 4.2 TF & 5TF stay at the same curve while 5TF to 5.8 TF requires another 4 power state. That means we may assume only 10~15W diffenrence from 4.2 TF to 5TF. Along with some CPU overclocking (2.1 GHz to 2.5 GHz) which means 5~10W. Neo may only need 20~25 W more power from 2.1 GHz CPU & 4.2 TF GPU to 2.5 GHz & 5TF. This can explain why Neo is thicker from 5.3 cm to around 8.3 cm.

Besides if SONY finally tapes out Neo APU at TSMC I would expect another 20% of power efficiency.
 
BRiT said:
Sure, Sony can do anything you desire, including getting an extra 50% performance out of a 4TF design with a mere 3cm to hit 6TF.

Come on, be realistic.
Click to expand...

Wasn't it already discussed almost at the first Neo leak that it could be 4TB or 5.5TB, depending on the clock they chose? Now knowing what Microsoft will do, and having its own slim, it is not impossible they went for the 5.5TB alternative. Of course they could also have thought - if necessary, we'll just release a 5.5TB version late 2017 when Microsoft does, but who knows.
 
RDGoodla said:
Let's assume a 14nm APU first. In fact RX480 has poor power efficiency after 1075 MHz which means 5TF.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/d...-sony-upgrade-playstation-neo-specs-in-theory

In the power state curve, 4.2 TF & 5TF stay at the same curve while 5TF to 5.8 TF requires another 4 power state. That means we may assume only 10~15W diffenrence from 4.2 TF to 5TF. Along with some CPU overclocking (2.1 GHz to 2.5 GHz) which means 5~10W. Neo may only need 20~25 W more power from 2.1 GHz CPU & 4.2 TF GPU to 2.5 GHz & 5TF. This can explain why Neo is thicker from 5.3 cm to around 8.3 cm.

Besides if SONY finally tapes out Neo APU at TSMC I would expect another 20% of power efficiency.
Click to expand...
I think the most cost effective would be Jaguars at 2.5ghz. 5tf instead of 4.2tf won't make the games run at 60fps, it'll just slightly improve image quality and fidelity (because of diminishing returns and all). But 2.5 ghz CPU (56% more power) could be enough to make current 30fps games like UC4 run at 60fps with some tweaks. Image quality and fidelity of UC4 (or Horizon and God of War) is good enough IMO (now that they gave us the ability to remove the motion blur).

And also no need for a faster, more power hungry and more expensive ram with only the CPU OCed.

They would be stupid to not overclock more the CPU IMO when most of their first party devs never stopped to tell them that the main bottleneck was the CPU (from the start with Sucker Punch and even recently with ND talking about Uncharted 4).
 
Arwin said:
Wasn't it already discussed almost at the first Neo leak that it could be 4TB or 5.5TB, depending on the clock they chose? Now knowing what Microsoft will do, and having its own slim, it is not impossible they went for the 5.5TB alternative. Of course they could also have thought - if necessary, we'll just release a 5.5TB version late 2017 when Microsoft does, but who knows.
Click to expand...

Wasn't the 5.5TB version a premium they were probably not going to go with because it was a new CPU and cost too much?
 
What's with the 5.5TB, shouldn't it be TF? Anyway at what point does the increase of teraflops becomes bottlenecked by the memory bandwidth? Assuming Neo doesn't get a ram boost, what's the optimal number? My gut feeling tells me Sony is gonna play it safe by sticking with 4.2tf (perfectly reasonable) and not even surprised by a slight bump to 4.5tf. I'd rather they devote all the resources on the PS5 with beefy specs for proper 4k AAA gaming with next gen graphics at this point. Neo should wrap up gen 7 quite nicely however you look at it.
 
I'd say price will be the most important factor for Neo, not the specs. Let's not forget, it wasn't specs that killed the X1 (in relative terms), but the price ($100 more than the Ps4). If the Neo costs more than $449 i can't see it being as successful as the original Ps4. But then again it's up to the consumer to decide if they find value in the product so who knows.
 
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