Playstation Move Games

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Is the Fighting AI good ?

Too early to tell after basically one career fight! Your stats definitely are important though.

Also, what songs are in SingStar Dance ?

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/09/16/singstar-dance-track-list/

*N Sync – Bye Bye Bye
Black Eyed Peas – Shut Up
Blondie – Heart Of Glass
Chris Brown – With You
Cyndi Lauper – Girls Just Wanna Have Fun
Diana Ross and The Supremes – Baby Love
Gloria Gaynor – I Will Survive
Gossip – Standing In The Way Of Control
Gwen Stefani – What You Waiting For?
Jamiroquai – Cosmic Girl
KC & The Sunshine Band – That’s The Way (I Like It)
Kid Cudi vs Crookers – Day ‘N’ Nite
Kool And The Gang – Celebration
La Roux – Bulletproof
Lady Gaga – Poker Face
MC Hammer – U Can’t Touch This
New Kids On The Block – Hangin Tough
Outkast – Hey Ya!
Paula Abdul – Straight Up
Pitbull – I Know You Want Me (Calle Ocho)
Reel 2 Real feat. The Mad Stuntman – I Like To Move It
Ricky Martin – Living La Vida Loca
Run DMC vs Jason Nevins – It’s Like That
Salt N Pepa – Push It
Shaggy – Boombastic
Sir Mix A Lot – Baby Got Back
Soulja Boy – Crank That
The Backstreet Boys – Everybody (Backstreet’s Back)
The Jackson 5 – I Want You Back
The Pussycat Dolls – Don’t Cha
 
:LOL: Yeah the game can be humiliating when the opponents are too good.
It wasn't that. I could play quite well near the end often coming in the upper quarter of scorers and achieving some useful objectives. It's that the game was, IMO, fundamentally broken. But I covered all that in the MAG thread!
 
gluv65 said:
Thanks for the impressions, I'll be picking this bad boy up in the states next week.

Ok, had another session. First note of business though - I set up my fighter with 23 points for technique, almost nothing for heart and chin, and 10,7 and 6 for strength, speed and stamina. I think the 23 points for technique were a bit much - Trejo mentioned something like 'I see were going for 'experimental' here'. :D

I found out quickly in my second match though in the first set of fights that adding some chin and heart are worth it. Basically you'll want to have at least everything at 10 as soon as possible, and take it from there. After 10, it starts taking more points to upgrade your fighter (first 2 ability points for 1 rating point, then 3, etc.). So I used my ability points to set everything at 10 at least.

This of course invited doing some more practice. This time I went for target practice first, which is the type of sparring you do with someone who has punch gloves for you to bash into, as you've seen in a tonne of boxing flicks. It's actually very good, and should be one of the first things you do to test whether or not you're being tracked right and you understand how to control your fighter. I found out for instance that the way I was hitting my left hook, I was reaching out of the camera range (because I also lean forward a little), which basically broke it. So this exercise quickly got me understanding the limits of my field of view (remember, my 'wing-span' is 2m, and I'm standing at less than 1.6m from the TV with my calves pressed into our couch - I actually placed the camera a little upwards and back behind the TV this time so I could actualy reach out my arms completely which just about fits exactly into the field of view).

So once I got that figured, it was actually pretty easy to do this exercise. For as far as I played it, it asks for uppercuts, forward jabs, and hooks. You don't have to hit them hard, and it doesn't really matter with which arm you for instance manage to hit the glove (the forward jabs are easily reachable with both arms for me). It feels good. So far I'm really digging the exercises. If you get these type of hits down, you can win a fight at least in theory. ;) It's good to be aware of at least these types of hits, though if you want to win a fight you also need to work the body, which not much of the exercises pay attention to so far. It is a fairly easy excercise, so good for earning some ability points too. The first exercise which I tried again also (the punching bag), remains a tough one, though I still enjoy it a lot and the physics on them are cool - I just wish you could play it without a fail-state.

I then (after losing my fight again) proceeded to do the other exercises as well. Endurance asks me to fight one opponent after the other, and is hard to keep up with long enough to score points (at least I couldn't do it after two or three times, but I did at least pass a bunch of rounds after the first attempt). You have to stick close to your fighter you lose, so you're going to track your fighter if he moves away from you. Finally, I went to basic sparring, which is actually good and a place that you should spend some time in - you need to at least be able to take this guy down on default settings, and then you can basically measure your efficiency by how many calories you burnt. For instance, after a few tries I got him down from 29 to 14 calories.

After last fight, for I'm not sure what anymore (but it tells you - I think it's actually for not doing the finishing move on him when he was reeling, which gave me the 'Saint' achievement), I also earned a first 'dirty' move, a hammer fist. Trejo explains how it works, and it's pretty good - however, since you're awarded more for fighting clean, it does make you only want to use it if you're getting desperate (at least for me). Now for the second fight, the setup was different - you start with an 80$ counter, and the faster you beat him, the more of that cash is left for you to take. However, crucially, you also earn cash for hard hits and such - for instance, a hard hit gives you $5. So you usually take enough away from a fight to at least heal yourself and do some more training. On the other hand, each battle you lose takes away rating points and after three losses I was back to zero (so again, exercise early, exercise often).

So when you're preparing for this fight, what's the key thing here is that you time your shots, and spend your energy wisely. Look for a good opportunity and land one or two hits. When he's reeling a little you can get a few more hits in, but your energy for hitting runs out fast enough so you'll want to go back into cover and position. When he's defending his face and or is close to you, go for body blows and if he goes out of cover when he's still close, time for an upper-cut. Most of this stuff makes a lot of sense, though I would have expected perhaps some more training on boxing technique. And I think the earlier you make yourself comfortable with walking and moving (dodging left and right) around, the better.

Also, when you sustain injuries, you have to heal them or pay the price in terms of shorter stamina in the next fight.

Right now this game is not easy. This is not a 'casual' game, unless maybe you're a casual boxer. But so far I'm enjoying it a lot and can heartily recommend it if a game that forces you to really box AND train (training is the only way to improve your stats, after all), it's worth it.

So I managed to win my second fight, and this game me another award that gives me a money boost for winning against players ranked higher, and a silver trophy. This was for beating someone who is ranked more than 50%, so that either means that there's an advantage to losing a bunch of times first (kills your ranking to zero), or perhaps I've picked my second fight unwisely.

I'm going to bed now happily exhausted, and so far the game seems to be what I hoped it would be. Will keep you guys posted if I make more progress this weekend. And if someone wants to try this online, let me know. ;)
 
Noob question incoming:

why needs The Fight to be a 60Hz game??

from what I saw, it is rather slow paced, thus super fast reactions are not needed (nor possible)!

I rather have a transparent character than 60Hz in this game, right?!?
 
Right now the framerate feels just barely sufficient to keep up, though I expect the game is fairly physics heavy and its framerate also matters. I think fighting games do really need 60fps to be honest. Of course they are also doing 3D, but now that I have the game I'm sure they needed the 60. Still at times the game feels slower so I hope someone does a proper framerate analysis. Again, it could be the physics.

Ironically, so far the lack of a transparent player isn't bothering me at all. Perhaps I don't know what I'm missing though but seeing your own arms at the very least is crucial. But I think a transparent body could definitely help.
 
The head-tracking doesn't work for me, as more or less expected. I may try again during the day, but the developers themselves basically indicated that they couldn't really do it for this game,...
If they used the same background removal tech of the KungFu game, lighting shouldn't be an issue, unless your room really is terribly dark. I dont know how much processing overhead that would have though.
 
If they used the same background removal tech of the KungFu game, lighting shouldn't be an issue, unless your room really is terribly dark. I dont know how much processing overhead that would have though.

In my case I get excellent rating on two out of three factors, but I have a really complex set of posters behind me, and that trips it up.
 
See, that sort of static background should be 'easily' removed from the video source. I believe Kung Fu Live uses the Virtual Air Guitar Company's proprietary library (what the company is built around) and maybe there's nothing similar in the standard PS3 SDK. At which point, Sony should buy it!
 
Noob question incoming:

why needs The Fight to be a 60Hz game??

from what I saw, it is rather slow paced, thus super fast reactions are not needed (nor possible)!

I rather have a transparent character than 60Hz in this game, right?!?

Because when you are dealing with motion controls 60FPS is really important because you want the controls to feel smooth and not chunky
 
See, that sort of static background should be 'easily' removed from the video source. I believe Kung Fu Live uses the Virtual Air Guitar Company's proprietary library (what the company is built around) and maybe there's nothing similar in the standard PS3 SDK. At which point, Sony should buy it!

I been thinking the same thing since I 1st seen the Kung Fu Live website where they was talking about the tech used to make the game.
 
Today a lot more working out. I got a few training sessions in where the trainer actually didn't diss me as the training ended, but sort of nodded a 'good job'. One of these was target practice, which is becoming a favorite quickly. It's actually making me a better fighter, making different types of hits for my forward side and my backward side (standing left/front) to reach the targets. It also clearly notes how well you land your punch and if you've got some power behind it, as this influences how much is added to your 'continue' meter (or whatever it is called).

However, this session I had messed around with my camera placement a bit and also started leaning forward a little more, and this time I started getting a lot of calibration issues - whenever my arms go out of range too much/too often, one of my arm would get out of calibration and basically hang back or something like that, rendering me unable to use that arm efficiently anymore. Specifically haymaker type hits can cause this. I've had to work on this issue for a bit before I could get on and beat my fourth and fifth opponent.

The names for the first set of fighters by the way seem to indicate what kind of stat will be attacked. For instance, Glass Jaw means that you'll have an opponent who deals hard damange, and you'll need to have your Chin stats up sufficiently to make it (or fight really, really well of course). Because I got annoyed at not beating a certain opponent I kept playing for more than the 90 minutes I wanted to do max, and now I'm totally soaked and knackered. If you're looking for a game to give you a workout, this is definitely one ... :)
 
In my case I get excellent rating on two out of three factors, but I have a really complex set of posters behind me, and that trips it up.

maybe they should have released the game with a headband with AR code on it like the cards from Eye of Judgement & the card that use to come with Eyepet that way it would know how far your head is from your fist at all times and wouldn't lose calibration.
 
Nah, if the game wants to track the players' head, the system needs better tech to perceive the user. The card is rather limited in application. Or they can add emitter to 3D glasses, and reduce their weight at the same time (so that they can be fitted to, and like, normal eye glasses).

Further out, more reliable facial expression analysis and especially retina tracking can be very useful too.
 
A few new PS Move stats:
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2010/11/08/playstation-move-by-the-numbers/

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Some useless stats. Interest doubled since May - could be doubled from 1 in 1000 to 1 in 500! The 30% are female seems a bit worrying too versus female interest in other motion platforms. That suggests the library isn't appealing, or something.
 
I love my PS3 and hope Sony gains some success from the Move, but this stuff isn't fooling anybody. MS spent half a billion dollars and targeted every other demographic outside the usual 14-25 male audience.

If Sony wants to make PS Move move of the shelves, they can't show some statistics and a PS Eye ad on the internet, or an occasional Kevin Butler TV commercial. They need to be smarter with their advertising and increase the budget a bit. Sure MS may have more money, but making some of these dumb marketing cost them.

Oh and they should've had some more interesting games out by now. I may not a give damn about Kinect's Dance Central, but the novelty of it will be eaten up by the casuals, and the PS Move needs one really strong game to rely on until better games are released next.
 
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When I was shopping around today I saw that most of the stores I went in had big 3DTV setups with the PS3 in their television sections, but pretty much just stuffed the Move in with the PS3 accessories. Has Sony chosen to focus on 3D rather than motion gaming this holiday season? Maybe there is better money by driving sales in the 3DTV business, but it seems like accessories are always a nice way to turn a big profit, and I'm surprised there wasn't a heavier in-store presence. I don't have any television service, so I have no idea if they're flooding the tv with ads and feel they don't need the big displays, in prime locations, in the big box stores.

It seems there are a lot of games, and the stores are well stocked with Move bundles and controllers.
 
Some useless stats. Interest doubled since May - could be doubled from 1 in 1000 to 1 in 500! The 30% are female seems a bit worrying too versus female interest in other motion platforms. That suggests the library isn't appealing, or something.

They are not useless. :)

One can see both vendors using different marketing platforms. Sony leans more towards tactical interactive marketing, while MS uses more traditional, mainstream marketing (Mostly above-the-line TV advertising).

When an organization uses interactive marketing, they usually track responses and stats in a more fine-grained and more real-time manner. In interactive marketing, the marketer would spent a very controlled budget to maximize the sales. The medium -- in this case, the Internet -- enables them to track their marketing $$$ spent carefully.

The marketer will review these stats and adjust their campaigns along to way to grow their base.

e.g., The PS Blog linked to their social marketing effort in October:
http://www.yoursocialweb.com/in-the-news/socialmediabattlexboxvsplaystation

This is one of the reasons I mentioned Sony is still using the same earn-as-you-go, profit-first strategy. Xbox continues to use their market-share-first approach. Their corporate cultures and business models are opposite to each other (Unless Kutaragi runs Sony. :)). MS has a cash cow software business, while Sony increasingly leverages on its risky content business with multiple CE device access.

Which marketing approach is more effective ? If you have a lot of cash and a good product, MS's shock-and-awe approach would gain traction faster and bigger. I don't think Sony is willing to invest so much up-front. Hence they adopt interactive marketing, which is usually more efficient. They did put out some TV ads. But I think they should have consolidated the message, rather than let individual countries and regions ran wild with it.

The real difference is in the product conceptualization and design. In this area, I think Sony missed the mark big time. Have been complaining that the Move user experience is piece-meal, and uninspiring (just feels like the Wii last few years ago ! ^_^). The management only sees "precision" in Move. They have good demoes and great technical concepts, but none of them made it to mainstream use cases (XMB and apps). You practically have to dig into the games to see the exciting stuff.

From the outside, it looks like a failure of the development team and marketing team collaboration. They still work separately even though Shuhei touted cross organization collaboration (That's only backend development). The engineering people have not worked with the strategic marketing people yet.

EDIT: I think this is the part where I miss Phil Harrison -- the product visionary.
 
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