Saddest for Sony, I'm sure these same Wii fans stoked by Natal would have been stoked for EyeToy if Sony had really developed it (and marketing it outside of Europe).
Old Discussion Thread for all 3 motion controllers
- Thread starter betan
- Start date
- Status
Whats the saying again? The only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about. I suspect the executives at Microsoft are grinning their heads off when they get told that there are a bunch of people talking about Natal, they probably don't care about the nature of that conversation, just that its happening.
They haven't spent a cent on marketing and now a large proportion of the gaming audience knows what Natal is. Mission accomplished?
They haven't spent a cent on marketing and now a large proportion of the gaming audience knows what Natal is. Mission accomplished?
I honestly doubt it would have been a major hit. It would probably have sold decently with good marketing. But the hand waving interface for on screen choices was a bit tiresome and the lighting was very important, it would hardly sustained the sales of the Wii.
Natal will be much better as it doesn´t depend on the lighting, flipping through menu choices may still be tiresome if it involves moving hands and arms but MS is good at user interfaces so they will hopefully have a good solution for that.
eyeToy sold 6 million in the EU, one the strength on pretty much one title, EyePlay. If they had offered more variety and experiences of the 'Natal' sort (somewhat guessing what Natal will provide and what is technically possible on EyeToy+PS2), and actualy marketed it, I don't see why Eyetoy couldn't have done 20+ million worldwide, and most importantly stolen Natal's thunder so it isn't seen as the latest, greatest thing of the new age of gaming (unless of course they really do achieve some amazing new things in software!).
Yeah, it probably would have removed some of the novelty surrounding Natal.
Anyway, though I am not that enthusiastic about EyeToy type of games I´ve got to give credit to the Sony London Studio for the introduction sequence with the old lady demonstrating how to set up the EyeToy camera, it was absolutely brilliant.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
I'm with Shifty that Sony missed out on a big opportunity by not pushing EyeToy more. Of course, there's also the possibility there was a complete lack of interest from 3rd parties and in the end Sony just decided to cut its risk exposure of having to be the only party developing titles for it (something that hasn't hurt Nintendo overly much). We'll never know.
I disagree with Crossbar however. Any success of EyeToy would have primed the market for Natal. So rather than having this nebulous controllerless crowd they are targetting (I suppose a bit of overlap with the Wii crowd also) would instead be a rather solid market segment already used to at least a limited form of controllerless control.
A segment that right about now would be ready to jump on the next evolution of it. Plus Sony's own efforts in the space would have made them better able to compete in that space. In other words with more experience putting out EyeToy software products, they would have been in a better position to transition from a 2D controllerless system to a 3D controllerless system. As well as having a better idea of what titles work and what titles don't.
It's a missed opportunity all around IMO.
Regards,
SB
I disagree with Crossbar however. Any success of EyeToy would have primed the market for Natal. So rather than having this nebulous controllerless crowd they are targetting (I suppose a bit of overlap with the Wii crowd also) would instead be a rather solid market segment already used to at least a limited form of controllerless control.
A segment that right about now would be ready to jump on the next evolution of it. Plus Sony's own efforts in the space would have made them better able to compete in that space. In other words with more experience putting out EyeToy software products, they would have been in a better position to transition from a 2D controllerless system to a 3D controllerless system. As well as having a better idea of what titles work and what titles don't.
It's a missed opportunity all around IMO.
Regards,
SB
They'd also have faith in it! Sony have been working on these novel controller systems for years, but never really backing them. It's taken Wii and probably Natal for them to stop entertaining their RnD department as a curiosity and actually look to it for significant revenue generating opportunities. They should have started that 8 years and be the major player in novel interfaces by now. I remember when 'EyeToy' in every PS3 was a possibility...
There was little 3rd party interest in Eyetoy on PS3 partly because of the PS3's high price point, it cast doubt that casuals would spend that kind of money. Add Sony's past legendary apathy to 3rd parties and the result is that no one bothered with it. The PS3 wand is having a similar problem due to price because in the eyes of 3rd parties a $199 Natal is a possibility, along with future $149/$99 Natals not being that far away. Contrast that with the PS3 where at this point it's anyone's guess when a $99 price point will be reached (if ever).
But this was partly because there were three Sony's. There was SCEJ, SCEA and SCEE. And the latter is the one being successful and taking risks with stuff like the EyeToy, and being very successful in Europe. But SCEJ and SCEA failed to pick up on this, as we all know.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
I'm assuming when you say Natal at those price points you mean Natal + X360 (arcade)?
And in regards to EyeToy (PS3 Eye?), no argument with regards to PS3...
But Shifty and I were speculating if they had been able to push it in the PS2 era where the console was cheaper and there was no competition all the area of "motion" or "novelty" controls. Had they done that they would be onto their second generation of software/hardware. And in a better position to counter MS's Natal. At the same time Natal would have a larger and more known market segment to target without having to guess at whether their market research will lead to a "new" market or not.
Regards,
SB
Just curious, have you played any original Eyetoy games?
Nintendo Details Upcoming Game Plan
http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/01/29/nintendo_game_plan/
Among other interesting things (like Mistwalker's game), "The company plans on showing software for the Wii Vitality Sensor, a peripheral that first saw its debut at last year's E3. Super Mario Galaxy 2 and the new Zelda will also be shown at E3."
http://www.andriasang.com/e/blog/2010/01/29/nintendo_game_plan/
Among other interesting things (like Mistwalker's game), "The company plans on showing software for the Wii Vitality Sensor, a peripheral that first saw its debut at last year's E3. Super Mario Galaxy 2 and the new Zelda will also be shown at E3."
Silent_Buddha
Legend
In Best Buy and other stores yes. It wasn't something I was particularly interested in spending money on at the time however. This was before I regularly watched nephews and nieces for relatives. And those are the kiddo's that I now buy most of my casual stuff for.
Also, another reason I'm so interested in hands free control schemes. Not having to worry about them breaking/hiding/trying to eat the controllers.
Regards,
SB
corduroygt
Banned
In Best Buy and other stores yes. It wasn't something I was particularly interested in spending money on at the time however. This was before I regularly watched nephews and nieces for relatives. And those are the kiddo's that I now buy most of my casual stuff for.
Also, another reason I'm so interested in hands free control schemes. Not having to worry about them breaking/hiding/trying to eat the controllers.
Regards,
SB
Which controller tastes the best?
Young kids would be the ultimate testers (Those who eat controllers). The small ones can't relate to the distance and would crowd around the screen. So much so that the camera won't be able to see them properly (May be the belly button ^_^). They also like to block or intercept other people.
I think the initial release will be quite controlled.
I think the initial release will be quite controlled.
Same for Arc. The sphere will either be off screen or filling the whole FOV!
My observation is that kids (well, at least those I saw) would tend to stick too close to the screen when they become too enthusiastic. I would think the Arc would be similar to Wiimote+ and Natal would be similar to PSEye in terms of use case. The actual performance may vary.
For kids who are so young that they attempt to eat the controller, I'd say just use the light ball to do a mini-game (e.g., Flashing light). They are usually attracted to red color. The issue is whether the controller is hardy enough to withstand abuse.
I think all these motion games are designed for kids/people who understand and follow instructions.
For kids who are so young that they attempt to eat the controller, I'd say just use the light ball to do a mini-game (e.g., Flashing light). They are usually attracted to red color. The issue is whether the controller is hardy enough to withstand abuse.
I think all these motion games are designed for kids/people who understand and follow instructions.
Arc requires the camera to see the controller to guage distance. It's as dependent on the FOV as Natal. As is Wiimote, which, if it's using the IR sensor to determine distance, needs to be a minimum distance from the TV.
As for kids so young they eat the controller, why even write them computer games?! Aren't there othe activities they'd rather enjoy that will be generally more developmentally focussed? If you want computer games for < toddlers, you'd really want a specialist controller with multi-material touch pads and widgets IMO.
As for kids so young they eat the controller, why even write them computer games?! Aren't there othe activities they'd rather enjoy that will be generally more developmentally focussed? If you want computer games for < toddlers, you'd really want a specialist controller with multi-material touch pads and widgets IMO.
Ah, I was thinking the Arc has built-in gyro and accelerometer like a Wiimote+. It's the absolute positioning that will screw up if it's out of the camera's view from time to time (or suddenly). So we'll have to pull the kid back into view. Will have to see how well it tracks. May also be possible to do a toddler's game without absolute positioning ?
To keep them quiet sometimes. I gave my kid an old Windows laptop when he was two.
They can start to learn at that time (YouTube, Internet Flash games, interactive CD titles) although they may still stick stuff into their mouths.EDIT: Once they stay in the camera's view, you may be able to get the kids to do simple exercises and postures together for fun. e.g., Form a circle by holding hands, follow the leader's movement/gestures, pretend to be an animal -- like an Octopus with 2 kids, play a templated skit, etc.
Silent_Buddha
Legend
Hehe, very true. I have my neices and nephews well trained though to stay back from the TV a few feet (for the health of their eyes). But they can still sometimes get carried away and go up to the TV to point and touch things they see (mostly the really young ones).
Regards,
SB
- Status
Similar threads
