Old Discussion Thread for all 3 motion controllers

[cbarcus]

Natal's computational requirements

In order to have some idea of the actual cost involved in the Natal accessory, it is necessary to estimate the computational requirements of 3D full body motion capture. So far I've only heard guesses that they are substantial (requires a modern CPU), and I read somewhere (some academic paper) that facial recognition at around 24 fps with the PSEye was not trivial. Does anyone at Beyond3D have a better sense of what is involved here?

My guess is that the sensor data (audio & video) should be able to fit within the bandwidth limitations of USB 3.0 (~400 MiB/sec), if at some point Natal's sensors are separated from the processing package, or if Sony wants to release a PSEye2 with multiple higher resolution sensors.

 

[patsu]

http://www.vg247.com/2009/09/15/moo...lam-tennis-will-be-released-with-motion-tech/

EA Sports is still planning on releasing 360 and PS3 versions of Grand Slam Tennis, division boss Peter Moore’s told VG247, but only when motion controllers have launched for both systems.

Moore delayed the games in August following the release of a MotionPlus-compatible Wii version.“You will do on the new motion technologies,” Moore said when asked if we’ll see the 360 and PS3 SKUs actually make it to market.“One thing that becamse glaringly obvious is that once you started playing Wii MotionPlus tennis and then you go back to [traditional controllers].”

Moore added that MotionPlus had “ruined” tennis games on standard controllers for him, but reiterated that the success of EA Sports Active had been an equal part of the decision to slip.

EDIT: Another recent augmented reality app. This is a simpler example compared to Toshiba's Magic Mirror:

 

[patsu]

Pre-TGS: Five Questions With Capcom's Jun Takeuchi

http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3176056

1UP: Do you think Japanese developers will embrace Natal more or less than Western developers?

JT: I haven't heard much about how Western developers have reacted to Natal so I can't really talk about that, but I've heard a lot of people in the industry in Japan respond to it like it's a new problem that they have: "How are we going to develop games for this? What are we supposed to do with this now?" I can say that the developers in our offices back in Osaka have been very receptive to Natal and are looking forward to hopefully coming up with some good ideas for it.


1UP: What about Sony's motion control device?
JT: Well just being from Capcom, I can tell you that we have a lot of good ideas on how to make use of that technology and we're looking forward to putting them into practice. However, speaking to other developers in Japan, I've heard a few of them say they were delighted by the Sony motion controller because they can just port over their Wii titles to the PS3.

 

[holsty101]

1UP: Why do you think we see fewer downloadable games from Japanese developers than U.S. developers?

JT: I think one of the main reasons is the number of users who have consoles but are also connected to the Internet is very, very low in Japan compared to North America and Europe. If you're not connected you can't download those games.

Is that correct? I was always under the impression that Japan had the better infrastructure, which in my mind leads to more people online. I guess there are many factors I'm unaware of, I still find it surprising though.

 

[Arwin]

Is that correct? I was always under the impression that Japan had the better infrastructure, which in my mind leads to more people online. I guess there are many factors I'm unaware of, I still find it surprising though.

In Japan everyone is connected through their mobile phone. This is their primary method of connecting to the realm of online. That's what makes for the strange discrepancy. Hopefully they fix this sometime ...

 

[JPT]

Is that correct? I was always under the impression that Japan had the better infrastructure, which in my mind leads to more people online. I guess there are many factors I'm unaware of, I still find it surprising though.

According to Akamai the avg broadband connection speed in Japan is 8 mpbs, the world average is about 1.7 mpbs, the USA is 4.2 mpbs. South Korea is #1 with 11 mpbs, Japan is #2.

http://www.akamai.com/stateoftheinternet/

 

[Arwin]

According to Akamai the avg broadband connection speed in Japan is 8 mpbs, the world average is about 1.7 mpbs, the USA is 4.2 mpbs. South Korea is #1 with 11 mpbs, Japan is #2.

http://www.akamai.com/stateoftheinternet/

I also just read that Japan has the second highest average internet speeds, but higher than Akamai figures - these figures from end of August 2009 (very recent in other words) quote 15,8 Mb for Japan. Only Korea is higher, at 20,4 Mb. The Netherlands is 9th, the U.S. 28th (!).

But how many have internet in the home, vs access to the internet in general (i.e. including phones)?

 

[JPT]

I also just read that Japan has the second highest average internet speeds, but higher than Akamai figures - these figures from end of August 2009 (very recent in other words) quote 15,8 Mb for Japan. Only Korea is higher, at 20,4 Mb. The Netherlands is 9th, the U.S. 28th (!).

But how many have internet in the home, vs access to the internet in general (i.e. including phones)?

I'd guess the difference is that its based on d/l speeds from Akamai servers.

Anyway its always a guesstimate, my former employer has done a lot of VDSL business in Japan. And are now doing quite well with PON over there.

I assume there are some goverment statistic burea or FCC type of thing in Japan also, that got the figures.

But I assume that most japanese home are quite small, so staying home and playing might be less attractive than being out with a group of friends that all got mobile phones for fun and games.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Japan has a very good internet infrastructure, however... For example, with contract you can get 100 Mbps FTTH for around 60 USD a month. Well at least last winter you could. Not sure what the prices are now.

Japan doesn't have very many internet users per capita compared to all other high tech countries. However, that's been going up over the past few years.

On the flipside however, they probably have significantly more people connected online by phone per capita than any other country.

Japan telco's also greatly limit transmission speeds of any connection leaving the country.

Regards,
SB

 

[wco81]

Maybe they're referring to few Japanese gamers bothering to connect their consoles to the Internet, not Internet access in general.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

No, it's still rare to find a Japanese person connected to the internet. Heck, it's somewhat rare just finding a Japanese person with a computer, although again, that's been going up a bit the past few years compared to say the early 2000's.

One of the big things that hampered Japanese adoption of computers in the household was that for much of the 90's DOS and Windows based computers were mostly non-existant with the Japanese companies each putting out their own proprietary computer standard.

So the Japanese computer industry didn't have a unifying force (Microsoft) like the rest of the world, and it just floundered and thankfully died. Now that Windows is driving computer use there, uptake is gradually increasing.

I think I still have a NEC PC98 around here somewhere.

Regards,
SB

 

[patsu]

Motion Controller Update Part III: Deep Dive into the E3 Demo

3rd part of the interview with Sony R&D people:

http://blog.us.playstation.com/2009/09/motion-controller-update-part-iii-deep-dive-into-the-e3-demo/

In the third part of the motion controller Blog series, Richard Marks and Anton Mikhailov break down their E3 on-stage demo in more detail. From plasma whips and drawing, to abstract domino snakes and real time strategy-style games, you’ll see some things you’re already familiar with, as well as some never before seen applications that didn’t quite make the show.

EDIT: Just finished watching... cool snake demo. The rest has been shown before or inferred by forumites correctly at this point.

 

[wco81]

Then what are the Japanese using with the fast and cheap ISPs, if not computers?

 

[patsu]

May be they use the net more at/from work ?

 

[ShadowRunner]

I liked the baseball bat demo shows off the accuracy of the device well, also shooting the pseye from the tv was very precise. Nothing really new though, will have to wait for TGS i guess.

 

[Rurouni]

I just watch part 3 dive into the E3 demo on the ps blog (which is the only psmc that I have ever watch)... the accuracy is nice, but what about the lag? do you think they can fix that?

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Then what are the Japanese using with the fast and cheap ISPs, if not computers?

They are using it at home too, just that computer's aren't as prevalent and people on the internet through computers aren't as prevalent.

As I said though it's growing slowly but steadily ever since the Japanese stopped doing proprietary computers and embraced MS Windows. But it's mostly the younger generation, and as such, I expect adoption to speed up as more and more of them become wage earners and thus there's more and more Japanese with experience with computers.

Then again, computers are quite definitely in the luxury category in Japan. So it's one of the first things cut if budgets get tight as things are over there at the moment.

Regards,
SB

 

[ShadowRunner]

I just watch part 3 dive into the E3 demo on the ps blog (which is the only psmc that I have ever watch)... the accuracy is nice, but what about the lag? do you think they can fix that?

What lag? i didnt notice any at all and i was looking out for it. There may well be a little but its certainly not noticeable and nothing that would cause much issues.

 

[obonicus]

Then what are the Japanese using with the fast and cheap ISPs, if not computers?

Cell phones?

 

[Rurouni]

What lag? i didnt notice any at all and i was looking out for it. There may well be a little but its certainly not noticeable and nothing that would cause much issues.

The easiest place to spot it is when they about to try that writing stuff... just see the person and the tv, you'll notice some lag in there. You can also notice it somewhere else as long as the person demoing and the tv is on the same frame.