Next Generation hardware release strategy *spawn

[Deleted member 13524]

I think it's obvious that game publishers and platform holders will adopt games-as-a-service as soon as they possibly can. Just imagine how much money platform holders will save on not having to research&develop, mass produce, market and worldwide distribute high-performance computers that sell with negative to small profit margins. Imagine how much publishers could save if they didn't have to pay platform holders to adopt their games and just use their own streaming apps on PCs, smartphones and Smart TVs.

I also think Yves Guillemot is being completely naive regarding the time needed to evolve communication infrastructures to the point of easily foregoing local processing for videogames, especially on a global scale.
On VR/AR, even with reprojection done locally we'd need to have networks with a maximum period of ping+rendering lower than 20ms at all times. That's what, 4 to 5 times faster than what 90% of internet connections manage to do nowadays?

Then again, we've seen executives from the videogame market saying "the next generation is the last" ever since the PS3 came out. One would think these people would be a bit more well informed.

 

[JPT]

Releasing multiple SKUs at launch has been done, to my knowledge at least once.

PS3 60GB and 20GB, the SKUs had no impact on gameplay performance, the diff was in HDD size, number of io ports and one had WiFi.
X360 and X360 Arcade, again no difference in performance, but one had HDD and the other did not, which lead to some game experience differences, ie not being able to download larger game patches and maybe some smaller games.

Was that a success?

Add the fact of manufacturing different SKUs and the logistics and potential confusion on the market about what does what?
Then I sincerely doubt that any of the vendors want to go down that road again.

Regardless of the number of 4K TVs in the market, I doubt MS/Sony will release a none 4K SKU, the hassle is just not worth it. Will they launch with a 8K device or will that be the next midlife upgrade?

I am betting on 1 SKU per vendor, makes the purchase decision easier for the consumer, makes the logistics easier for the vendor, makes the development easier for the developers.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I think it's obvious that game publishers and platform holders will adopt games-as-a-service as soon as they possibly can. Just imagine how much money platform holders will save on not having to research&develop, mass produce, market and worldwide distribute high-performance computers that sell with negative to small profit margins. Imagine how much publishers could save if they didn't have to pay platform holders to adopt their games and just use their own streaming apps on PCs, smartphones and Smart TVs.

More like imagine how much more money they can make by holding your games hostage because you can bet your ass on it they will make sure it earns them more money, not less. Subscription based, deleting games after x amount of time, surcharges for new games & playing during peak hours etc. Of course that is ignoring the potentially additional cost at the consumer side for a better connection and whatever cost there will be for a streaming box because no way every tv/tv platform is going to be supported for ~ 10 years.

Of course, now you are just shifting cost from hardware for the home to maintaining and constantly upgrading many many data centers all around the world.

 

[BRiT]

This isnt the thread to talk about GaaS.

 

[DieH@rd]

Internet connections may be coming to more people, but distance to servers is problematic. PSNow coverage of Europe is poor, and I don't belive anyone will be willing to invest a lot to bring a lot of gaming servers to for example Balkans [my region].

The only solution for perfect streaming coverage is to stick with consoles, but enable users to toggle them into full sharing mode - to be able to wake from sleep on request stream SharePlay to anyone [for a slice of a $ pie]. That way, servers will be everywhere.

 

[wco81]

Anecdotal, but around here everyone using a 4K TV also has the AVR or SoundBar setup that does far more than PCM, notable focus is on Dolby Atmos now.

I have to think people with a Dolby Atmos compatible speaker setup is a subset of those who have 5.1 systems, which is a subset of people just using TV speakers or a sound bar.

That said, movie disc sales are plummeting while streaming is growing. Does Netflix or Amazon stream Atmos?

I would still prefer to have UHD Blu Ray drives in at least some of the SKUs -- if nothing else, it will still be the best way to get games for some people -- but wouldn't be surprised if Sony repeats what they did with the PS4 Pro.

 

[Karamazov]

interesting that MS hinted at next gen already, and all those games releasing at the begining of 2019.
Sounds like great things might happen at the end of 2019 !

 

[dobwal]

I can imagine a near future where actual hardware is still available to purchase but not necessary for some in countries where bandwidth and latency is not a problem.

I can see a ton of gamers being amenable to a streaming only option where you get to skip the part where you shell out $400-$500 for the hardware.

Plus a streaming model has its advantages. You don’t have to want to play Halo enough to spend $100s on hardware. Just whatever the subscription or direct purchase of the game will cost. Just download the respective app to whatever device, own the requisite accessories (like a controller) and off you go.

To put it another way, I quite enjoy Netflix and see the utility in a Netflix box where I can download content to enjoy offline and with higher fidelity, but I doubt I would spend anywhere near console prices for the hardware.

 

[Karamazov]

Https://www.roadtovr.com/carmack-oculus-5k-x-5k-mobile-vr-playback-henry-re-release/amp/

Maybe this kind of video format could also suit game streaming services

 

[Deleted member 11852]

interesting that MS hinted at next gen already, and all those games releasing at the begining of 2019. Sounds like great things might happen at the end of 2019 !

I missed that. All those games they showed, including Halo Infinite and Gears 5, are releasing early next year?

 

[Karamazov]

No sorry i Was not talking about all games shown at MS conf. But there is à lot of games announced releasing either at the end of 2018 or early 2019.

 

[ultragpu]

Sony might escalate their "Vision" situation in their conference at this rate. Who knows.

 

[eastmen]

No sorry i Was not talking about all games shown at MS conf. But there is à lot of games announced releasing either at the end of 2018 or early 2019.

MS right now has the most powerful console. I am sure they are building their next hardware but they will wait and react to sony because they don't have to do anything else in terms of hardware right now. Let sony move and then move with something more powerful even if it is a little later. The xbox one x has some time to breath

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Because being the most powerful == win?

I really don't understand the lines of discussion going on. They completely ignore all of gaming history in forming ideals and business plans.

 

[Entropy]

MS right now has the most powerful console. I am sure they are building their next hardware but they will wait and react to sony because they don't have to do anything else in terms of hardware right now. Let sony move and then move with something more powerful even if it is a little later. The xbox one x has some time to breath

I can’t see this being the case even with these more PC-standard consoles.
The purpose of a new "generation” is to establish a new baseline for developers to target. If Microsoft waits for Sonys’ plans to be finalized, and then decide on the configuration of their console, they are going to be a year or more late to a volume launch (APU design -> console volume manufacturing!). It merely means that Sony gets to dictate the baseline, and have the next-gen console market to itself for a year or more. And if Sony doesn’t screw up their design, how much will Microsoft actually be able to improve on it without having to raise the price point? For how much benefit since multiplatform games will target Sonys first-out-of-the-gate device?
Does’t seem like a way for Microsoft to grow their market share from where they are right now.

 

[iroboto]

MS right now has the most powerful console. I am sure they are building their next hardware but they will wait and react to sony because they don't have to do anything else in terms of hardware right now. Let sony move and then move with something more powerful even if it is a little later. The xbox one x has some time to breath

I think anyone can look at all three players and see that for the first time, they are all diverging in their strategies of what they think gaming should be. This is probably the most separation we've seen and that gap in direction is likely to increase by next gen.

Aside from needing to pander to the audience to quell fears about the future of Xbox, I think MS is pretty set in pursuing their original concepts and ideas of 2013 but executing much better on it. Expecting more connected experiences not less. Expecting more GaaS not less. Streaming services, more online stuff. AI stuff, any device stuff, game pass etc. It's going to be very much a Microsoft console, where all of MS gets to put their input into how the console experience can get better and how it might fit with their entire product line, where previously it was just xbox division doing their own thing.

Sony has their strategy with VR and next generation experiences and Nintendo theirs with their mobile strategy.

So I disagree with having to react. It's going to be about how well each platform executes on their vision.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

You can't react with hardware. The timelines to design and create at too long. If you look at last-minute machines, throwing hardware at a problem out of a desperate fear of being the weaker console, they've done terrible business. the only way to effectively run a product like these is to have your vision and implement it. If it's a good vision, it'll be competitive and secure some of the market. That's how Nintendo have managed to survive. The only people who care about having the more powerful machine are fanboys, representing a small part of the market.

Hypothetical (un)reality check - let's imagine PS4 and XB1 launch in 2013 as they are now hardware wise, except XB1 is priced as is now same as PS4 and launches with HZD, GOW, The Witcher 3 exclusively, and Zelda:BotW. Which one will sell the most - the most powerful console or the one with the defining software library?

 

[ultragpu]

Going forward I think it is indeed the more attractive game library both in quantity and quality dictates the majority of the market share. We will be soon dealing with 12 -14 tf machines with enough ram to store an army, games will look by default stupendously good and no one would have trouble of running out of power any time soon (just don't be stupid with native 4k). So releasing a console with amble amount of AAA exclusive titles is absolutely imperative to differentiate yourself from the competition. Budget, talent and time people, invest them!

 

[rokkerkory]

Can we look at the Halo Infinite tech demo as a way to guess next-gen?

Based on what DF said, it's running around 4k60 with much higher fidelity textures, lighting, DOF, etc... perhaps launch title for next xbox?

 

[iroboto]

Going forward I think it is indeed the more attractive game library both in quantity and quality dictates the majority of the market share. We will be soon dealing with 12 -14 tf machines with enough ram to store an army, games will look by default stupendously good and no one would have trouble of running out of power any time soon (just don't be stupid with native 4k). So releasing a console with amble amount of AAA exclusive titles is absolutely imperative to differentiate yourself from the competition. Budget, talent and time people, invest them!

After these e3 presentations.

i'm not sure what we would consider as being next generation games. the lines are blurring for me at this point.

from the exclusives we saw yesterday, to an evolving dynamic world like FH4, one could easily say that this gen has really arrived on its own as a true departure from last. Not really sure what next gen is supposed to be.

The midgen refreshes have been very good at moving the needle forward even though the base machines are still plugging along themselves.