Image Quality and Framebuffer Analysis for Available/release build Games *Read the first post*

[AlNom]

Lemme guess, QAA again?

While the source is somewhat questionable considering how compressed it is, there is a notable and consistent difference once you start scrutinizing:



That said, meaningful conclusions should be made with lossless captures, and the use of this video is dubious for the purpose of this thread. About the only real conclusion that could be made is that the shadow maps can be low resolution in both editions.

 

[Turok]

While the source is somewhat questionable considering how compressed it is, there is a notable and consistent difference once you start scrutinizing:

That said, meaningful conclusions should be made with lossless captures, and the use of this video is dubious for the purpose of this thread. About the only real conclusion that could be made is that the shadow maps can be low resolution in both editions.

But unless they used two distinct capture methods for each console, isn't it safe to assume that the PS3 version has QAA, temporal AA, or just a fullscreen blur, even with the compression?

 

[GarretASUS]

Both appear to be using the same amount of AA. PS3 could be using QAA. Difference in levels has to do with PS3 Limited/360 Extended settings. I find it odd there would be a full screen blur because I haven't seen it on the Ps3.

 

[Gitaroo]

any update on the RE5 demo, it looks crazy clean, must be atleast 2X AA? Now Im worry about the PS3 version, hope they wont use temporal AA because its a 30 fps game and might ended up like a mess like Lost Planet Sony need to share what they have learnt from their first party games with 3rd party, too many of them ended with no AA when they use HDR.

 

[AlNom]

Screen tearing is Framerate territory. Wakarimasu-ka?

 

[assurdum]

any update on the RE5 demo, it looks crazy clean, must be atleast 2X AA? Now Im worry about the PS3 version, hope they wont use temporal AA because its a 30 fps game and might ended up like a mess like Lost Planet Sony need to share what they have learnt from their first party games with 3rd party, too many of them ended with no AA when they use HDR.

I think that capcom has find the right way, so don't worry...forget the special case of lost planet, a porting realized in few months, resident evil 5 is in develop to several years...

 

[Gitaroo]

unless they use nao32 for the PS3 version I dont think there is a way.... or the game doesnt even use HDR at all; I am pretty sure it does since they mention it in one of the old video..... if there any other format that allows HDR and AA running on the RSX?

 

[dah145]

unless they use nao32 for the PS3 version I dont think there is a way.... or the game doesnt even use HDR at all; I am pretty sure it does since they mention it in one of the old video..... if there any other format that allows HDR and AA running on the RSX?

I dont, but what type of HDR do games like Motorstorm and Gran Turismo use? becaues there is also AA on those games.

 

[Blade47167]

I think that capcom has find the right way, so don't worry...forget the special case of lost planet, a porting realized in few months, resident evil 5 is in develop to several years...

Didn't they say they have also removed the engines need to install data? I think Capcom has it figured out by now.

 

[vanquish]

Is RE5 720p with up to 4xAA like the other Capcom titles?

 

[el_rika]

MGS4 has both HDR and AA.
It may have been an issue before, but it isn't anymore.

 

[GarretASUS]

Is RE5 720p with up to 4xAA like the other Capcom titles?

AA seems quite clear, so 4xAA is a good assumption, but we'll see.

 

[Gitaroo]

MGS4 has both HDR and AA.
It may have been an issue before, but it isn't anymore.

no it does not, the MGS4 tech article stated that they can not get AA and HDR to work, most if not all 3rd party games dont have HDR and AA on the PS3. Some JP games use temporal AA, which really isnt the best solution because it actually ruined the image quality if its poorly used and I dont consider is as true AA personally. All the first party game use nao32 I believe, we will see how the PS3 version of RE5 goes when the demo comes out on the 18th in JP PSN. Don't have high hope for it tbh. I dont want to pick up the game for 360, because my friends only have a PS3 and I also dont have xbox live for co-op.

 

[GarretASUS]

no it does not, the MGS4 tech article stated that they can not get AA and HDR to work, most if not all 3rd party games dont have HDR and AA on the PS3. Some JP games use temporal AA, which really isnt the best solution because it actually ruined the image quality if its poorly used and I dont consider is as true AA personally. All the first party game use nao32 I believe, we will see how the PS3 version of RE5 goes when the demo comes out on the 18th in JP PSN. Don't have high hope for it tbh. I dont want to pick up the game for 360, because my friends only have a PS3 and I also dont have xbox live for co-op.

I was under the impression MGS4 was temporal AA + HDR.

 

[vanquish]

I was under the impression MGS4 was temporal AA + HDR.

That's what the list says:
Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriot = 1024x768 (2xAA, temporal)

Now if only I could get my MGS4 demo to work and see for myself, I keep getting an error code, PS3 firmware has too many bugs.

 

[Gitaroo]

temporal NOT = MSAA, you will get alot of side effect if it isn't done properly. It works ok for DMC4 because its a 60 fps and fast pace game, it hides jaggies in static screen and also help hiding alot of the texture shimmering, but it also introduce a ghosting effect if you pay close enough attention, also blur the IQ quality quite a bit. Lost Planet is also using the same trick on PS3, because its a 30 fps game, the trick doesn't blend well enough and makes everything looks horrible, not because its a low budget 6 months port .

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1244934&postcount=2

"1) On RSX, FP16 buffer + MSAA is not available, and the jaggies were deemed unacceptable for the final image quality wanted for MGS4."

MGS4 using a smarter way to do it where it turns off the effect when the camera move, so the game doesnt have the same ghosting effect; I believe this has already been discussed.

Temperal AA works good in very high frame rate, when ATi use it the effect only kicks in when the frame rate is above the V sync and also have atleast 2X AA turns on I think. RE5 is a much slower pace game and only run at 30 fps, that is the problem, if Capcom use it the same way as DMC4, it would ended up looking just like Lost Planet. Unless they can get RE5 to run at 60 fps on PS3 or does it the same way as MGS4, turn it off when there is fast camera movement, but that would be basically no AA, compare to the clean 360 version look. Unless Capcom go the same route as the Sony 1st party and use nao32 HDR + MSAA, both version might ended up looking a bit different.

 

[assurdum]

temporal NOT = MSAA, you will get alot of side effect if it isn't done properly. It works ok for DMC4 because its a 60 fps and fast pace game, it hides jaggies in static screen and also help hiding alot of the texture shimmering, but it also introduce a ghosting effect if you pay close enough attention, also blur the IQ quality quite a bit. Lost Planet is also using the same trick on PS3, because its a 30 fps game, the trick doesn't blend well enough and makes everything looks horrible, not because its a low budget 6 months port .

http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.php?p=1244934&postcount=2

"1) On RSX, FP16 buffer + MSAA is not available, and the jaggies were deemed unacceptable for the final image quality wanted for MGS4."

MGS4 using a smarter way to do it where it turns off the effect when the camera move, so the game doesnt have the same ghosting effect; I believe this has already been discussed.

Temperal AA works good in very high frame rate, when ATi use it the effect only kicks in when the frame rate is above the V sync and also have atleast 2X AA turns on I think. RE5 is a much slower pace game and only run at 30 fps, that is the problem, if Capcom use it the same way as DMC4, it would ended up looking just like Lost Planet. Unless they can get RE5 to run at 60 fps on PS3 or does it the same way as MGS4, turn it off when there is fast camera movement, but that would be basically no AA, compare to the clean 360 version look. Unless Capcom go the same route as the Sony 1st party and use nao32 HDR + MSAA, both version might ended up looking a bit different.

Well will see...I don't understood the sense to worry about that when capcom to now on ps3 has doing an excellent work ....

 

[2real4tv]

I don't know if has been answered but how does GTP use HDR + AA.

 

[Nesh]

magic

I think its the SPU's that can help in achieving both. Then again I am not a tech guy and I could be wrong.

 

[Arwin]

I don't know if has been answered but how does GTP use HDR + AA.

Check out some of the tech sheets / presentations on Naughtydog's website for Uncharted - Uncharted does HDR and AA too, and it's very clearly and precisely explained how they do it (logluv, basically)