I'M LEGIT NOW! Bought Doom3 today.

[Florin]

Look at it the other way round -- the pirates will continue to thrive. I suppose what I'm talking about is a matter of principles, which requires discipline if we want to uphold such principles.

I have bought pirated software in the past but the last instance was too long ago for me to remember what that piece of software was.

Ok right I would actually agree that there's something fundamentally wrong in supporting and rewarding people who *make a profit* off ripping off other people's work. I know that the sale of illegal software is epidemic in many countries particularly in areas like south-east asia and eastern europe. The topicstarter was talking about downloading it off the net though and buying it as soon as it became officially available. Personally, I'd consider that a victimless crime but perhaps others have a different point of view.

 

[Reverend]

Whoops... again, I don't live up to my words about not following up on certain issues!

I played Sim City 4 for 4-5 months using a pirated version when it came out. Then recently when I got out of school and got a job I bought it, I havent really played it after I bought it. Maxis just deserved the money and I finally had them.

Btw ID software has given an exuse and fair reason for the late european launch.

Missed this post of your's earlier. If it's true, it's commendable... but you committed a crime before, er "repenting". Please don't mind my use of the word "If" though....

Please take no offense by what I have to say in the para below.

It's your word. It's a stranger's word.

"I didn't buy a pirated game" post on the Internet has as much credence as Bush saying "I can't tell you specifically what I know but I know I am right when it comes to my decision regarding Iraq".

Folks, "just don't support pirates" is my message, knowingly or unknowingly (if you get what I mean), that's all. I KNOW how difficult it is to wait for games/apps to arrive in your stores but like I said, it's a matter of discipline.

An unofficial copy of the retail version of Doom3 was made available on B3D's FTP -- via email, I said that I would not download it, "reprimanded" the guy that provided it and, later, asked that it be removed from our FTP .

Anyone who disagrees with all that I have said is simply saying "Piracy is OK as long as I eventually buy the game officially...". Kinda like saying "Commiting rape is ok... as long as I eventually surrender to the police". The rape/crime had already been commited but is eventually punished... which misses the point completely, isn't it?

Does that sound right to you?

 

[kyleb]

it doesn't sound right to me Rev; where is the victim? i mean, with rape there is an obvious victim; but i don't see where the victim is when someone downloads a game before it is avalable to purchase and then pays full retail price for a legit version when it becomes available. where is the victim in that?

 

[Guden Oden]

Downloading pirated copies and then buying official copies mean only one thing to me, and that is not supporting the gaming industry even though you bought an official copy.

The fact that you downloaded it means you're supporting piracy.

So by jaywalking you support criminal activity? Come ON dude, that's an insane way of looking at things. If I'd downloaded the game WITHOUT paying for it, THAT would have been supporting piracy, but now I paid for what I downloaded so the ones I *actually* supported was the game devs. And the leeching middle-men too unfortunately, but that's stuff we just have to live with I guess.

If I am able to resist buying a pirated copy of the game

I didn't buy my pirated D3 copy, I'd never pay for pirated stuff, because that would be supporting piracy. I never even created any physical copies of the discs, I installed it from harddrive using daemon tools, and I even uninstalled everything and erased all the save games and config files before putting in the genuine CDs in my optical drive.

 

[epicstruggle]

Does that sound right to you?

No.
If i pre-pay for a game, then download the game because it wont be out for weeks/months in my homecountry. I have no problem.

epic

 

[Guden Oden]

Kinda like saying "Commiting rape is ok... as long as I eventually surrender to the police".

Not at all like committing rape! Jeez. Why not go all the way and say pirating a game that can't even be bought for weeks and then bought when it CAN be bought is sort of like starting world war two and thereby causing the deaths of 20-30-odd million people?

The rape/crime had already been commited but is eventually punished... which misses the point completely, isn't it?

Look man, if you rape someone you at the very least rob that person of their dignity, but when you pirate a game that can't be bought, you don't rob ANYONE of ANYTHING.

 

[epicstruggle]

Look man, if you rape someone you at the very least rob that person of their dignity, but when you pirate a game that can't be bought, you don't rob ANYONE of ANYTHING.

ive agreed with most of what you have said in this thread. But i do take issue with the last part of this quote. Although you dont _rob_ the person you do deprive him of income. Im not phrasing it right, but its still theft even though what you steal isnt really taken.

epic

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

The point is that you either belive in the law or you don't. You can't break the law when it's convenient or with your own justification eg "I didn't like the reason Activision gave for the delay", and then say what a good boy you are for doing the right thing after you violated ID's copyright.

If it's not morally/legally right to break the law, then it doesn't matter whether you pay up after the fact. You still broke the law. Don't pretend you have some kind of moral high-ground because you made restitution after the fact.

 

[John Reynolds]

The point is that you either belive in the law or you don't. You can't break the law when it's convenient or with your own justification eg "I didn't like the reason Activision gave for the delay", and then say what a good boy you are for doing the right thing after you violated ID's copyright.

If it's not morally/legally right to break the law, then it doesn't matter whether you pay up after the fact. You still broke the law. Don't pretend you have some kind of moral high-ground because you made restitution after the fact.

Exactly. It's just all one big slippery slope.

 

[Guden Oden]

The point is that you either belive in the law or you don't.

Don't give me that self-righteous bullcrap please, it's nothing but PATHETIC.

Let me know when you stop throwing cigarette butts in the street, or speeding when you drive, or jaywalking, or a million other minor (or not so minor) illegal things many people do EVERY DAY.

And Epic:
I don't deprive anyone of any income if I can't buy the game.

Like, if I play Escape from the Planet of the Robot Monsters in MAME, am I then depriving Atari Games of any income? No, because there's no arcade in this whole country with that game, and even if there was, the money wouldn't go to Atari Games.

 

[Reverend]

Er, so I have to remember to pick up every cigarette I throw on the streets everytime and put them in a trash can, to make things "right"? (analogy : illegally d/l game, buy game later)

Correction is better than prevention? You're saying what you did (download Doom3) is wrong and you "righted" it by buying the official copy? Is that it? If that's it, EOS as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Reverend]

Okay, last post on this matter.

As in all aspects of life, practice self-restrain. That's the problem to begin with wrt this topic.

You couldn't and wouldn't wait for an official copy of Doom3. Hence you d/l the game.

The problem with you, and many others, is that you don't have willpower, discipline nor self-restrain for what I think is a hobby of yours.

Deep down, you know you shouldn't d/l Doom3. That's the main point.

Damn the Internet. Many wouldn't have d/l Doom3 if they didn't feel the need to join in discussions of Doom3 from legitimate Doom3 owners (they don't want to miss out). They can't wait. Oops... lack of self restrain again.

 

[Bouncing Zabaglione Bros.]

The point is that you either belive in the law or you don't.

Don't give me that self-righteous bullcrap please, it's nothing but PATHETIC.

Let me know when you stop throwing cigarette butts in the street, or speeding when you drive, or jaywalking, or a million other minor (or not so minor) illegal things many people do EVERY DAY.

The point is regardless of my views on piracy (which I have not given in this thread), I did not break the law, and then sactimoniously and hypocritically come to a public forum asking for a pat on the head for doing so after making restitution.

If I get caught speeding, I get caught speeding. I don't proudly proclaim that I drove legally today, so my speeding last week was okay.

It's not your piracy I object to - it's the fact that you have convinced yourself that you did nothing wrong. If you are going to break the law (which is what you did), and help spread a pirate copy (which is what you did if you used any of the filesharing networks), then don't pretend it was alright because you finally ponied up for a game that you had no right to steal in the first place.

You disdain piracy, but at the same time you pirate games and then claim it's okay for *you* to do so because you paid up after the fact. You claim it's fine for *you* to decide what you are allowed to steal, and how you pay for it. You claim it's right for *you* to decide if it's okay to break the law because *you* don't like a regional delay or the reasons given.

I couldn't care less about your piracy. It's your hypocracy and self-righteous attitude that's offensive - but that's par for the course for most of your posts.

I'm done here "Mr. Legit".

 

[Florin]

Your opinion has been noted but I believe there's a minor inaccuracy in there; 'piracy' is not in fact stealing or theft. It's copyright violation or breach of contract. Public vs private law etc.

I'm also still a bit bemused at how we ever got to a situation where the same word is used for copyright violation and for murder, rape and pillage on the high seas. :?

 

[Guden Oden]

Er, so I have to remember to pick up every cigarette I throw on the streets everytime and put them in a trash can, to make things "right"? (analogy : illegally d/l game, buy game later)

It was just one example (assuming you smoke). The point is, you can't go all sanctemoneous on me if you at the same time casually break laws also. Copyright infringement is amongst the most non-damaging crimes there is to begin with; even assuming I pirated the game (or any other piece of software) and DID NOT pay for it, that still doesn't mean I would have bought it instead had I not managed to lay my hands on an illigitimate copy.

I can pirate a game and then buy it and it's NO HARM DONE. I can't drive for 10 minutes at 110km/h in a 90km/h zone and then "reverse" it by driving for 10 minutes at 70km/h on the same 90km/h road. What's done is done when it comes to tangible crimes, while no harm whatsoever is done by pirating a game first and then buying it later. It may be illegal, but nobody was harmed by the crime.

You're saying what you did (download Doom3) is wrong and you "righted" it by buying the official copy?

I'm saying it's not wrong to download it (other than in the eyes of the law) if the game is bought as soon as it is possible to do so. Wether it is alright to download and run games and then wait some arbitrary period of time before buying it, but still finally buying it in the end, well that is more debatable. But that's not what I did. I bought it on the 13th, first day it was available to buy in stores where I live (they got the games on thursday, but they refused to sell me a box... ).

 

[John Reynolds]

I predict this is the last time Guden starts a thread on any similar topics. 8)