Forspoken (Project Athia) [PS5, PC]

[Inuhanyou]

What did I say that was so wrong exactly? What warring am I doing? By pointing out that PS5 runs this game at lower resolutions and framerates than typical games released on PS5.. and that it doesn't look particularly special while doing so??

And what the hell are you talking about... we got the recommended specs with performance figures... what do you mean we shouldn't be talking about hardware requirements and potential performance about this game yet??

You are misunderstanding me intentionally

Forspoken isn't anything special looking or appears to be doing anything special technically outside of loading quickly.

I mean, the PS5 version runs at what like ~1200p at ~60fps.. and yet there are other games which are more graphically impressive, technically demanding, which run at higher IQ and framerates.

It's more like console players are going to have to get used to last gen resolutions like 1080p... or ~30fps framerates

There is no need for you, nesh, and smc to be stooping to this pathetic level of sniping back and forth.

This game, is not representative of wider market. So no one needs to get used to anything. Publishers and devs in general need to start taking pushing mediocre products seriously. Downgrade the scope of the project to what the team can efficiently do or get bent. both PC and console players are tired of getting shafted.

This game is part an unfortunate growing trend of badly optimized messes and nothing more

 

[Remij]

Can everyone please take a breather before thinking of replying? Also take the time to reread your text before posting it to make sure it doesn't come off the wrong way? I think part of the discussion is getting lost in the rather flat text aspects leading to misunderstandings.

I'll just stop altogether. I'm so tired of not being able to say anything without it hurting someone's feelings and then have them project their insecurities onto me.

 

[Inuhanyou]

Thanks, everyone kindly shut up about their biases. Ssd technology is not unique to console(especially with direct storage) and while earlier generation tech will become outdated due to inherent architecture limitations in the future(like basic RT support) it's nothing to do with consoles outstripping PCs.

Unless and and Nvidia just stop supplying driver updates PC gamers are not in any danger. Relax

 

[Globalisateur]

Something I noticed in the demo is how far ungodly amount of vegetation are displayed, never seen it in any game so far. I think this could eat a lot of GPU rendering. There is some LOD but is very well hidden (behind existing vegetation) contrary to Elden Ring where there is very few amount of vegetation and with awful LOD, particularly on the PS5 version (which runs pretty bad anyways with bad motion blur, blurry chromatic aberration, well an awful IQ similar to Bloodborne for me and can give me headaches).

The game is doing plenty of things actually impressive (like the particles effects) but it's wasted by bad environment / monster design and generic / uninteresting artstyle.

And about the resolution, since when a 1200-1440p 60fps is a shame? And please don't tell me the ~50fps drops of Forspoken in cherry picked hectic moments are a disaster, it's a demo and most games nowadays have drops in cherry picked moment (some games even run constantly at ~50fps...). Most of the time the game is solid at 60fps.

I feel like competent technical people are suddenly tricked by artstyle and mirrors of some others games and fail to recognize objectively what the game is actually rendering.

Saying that I don't like the demo at all. It's uninspired like hell, main character + AI are uninteresting and annoying, you do not want to engage in its world and stories, combat and character motion are uselessly complicated, like in FF15 combat is unappealing and a chore. there are plenty others problems like the fact that the character can only jump normally up to 30cm without much energy and has trouble stepping on 30cm ledges while it can also special jump up to 100m, fall from 100m without a bruise and run faster than Usain Bolt.

 

[iroboto]

Something I noticed in the demo is how far ungodly amount of vegetation are displayed, never seen it in any game so far. I think this could eat a lot of GPU rendering. There is some LOD but is very well hidden (behind existing vegetation) contrary to Elden Ring where there is very few amount of vegetation and with awful LOD, particularly on the PS5 version (which runs pretty bad anyways with bad motion blur, blurry chromatic aberration, well an awful IQ similar to Bloodborne for me and can give me headaches).

The game is doing plenty of things actually impressive (like the particles effects) but it's wasted by bad environment / monster design and generic / uninteresting artstyle.

And about the resolution, since when a 1200-1440p 60fps is a shame? And please don't tell me the ~50fps drops of Forspoken in cherry picked hectic moments are a disaster, it's a demo and most games nowadays have drops in cherry picked moment (some games even run constantly at ~50fps...). Most of the time the game is solid at 60fps.

I feel like competent technical people are suddenly tricked by artstyle and mirrors of some others games and fail to recognize objectively what the game is actually rendering.

Saying that I don't like the demo at all. It's uninspired like hell, main character + AI are uninteresting and annoying, you do not want to engage in its world and stories, combat and character motion are uselessly complicated, like in FF15 combat is unappealing and a chore. there are plenty others problems like the fact that the character can only jump normally up to 30cm without much energy and has trouble stepping on 30cm ledges while it can also special jump up to 100m, fall from 100m without a bruise and run faster than Usain Bolt.

Artistically may not be great. But I agree with you, it does look taxing and rendering does look good imo. Art may be lacking however. There could be multitudes of bottlenecks being hit especially during high speed traversal. View distances are far, very far.

Curious to see the DF on this one. I’m in full agreement. More than the eye can see. Done right some set pieces with this type of setup could be a sight to behold.

 

[Nesh]

There is no need for you, nesh, and smc to be stooping to this pathetic level of sniping back and forth.

I made a secret sauce joke about a game that looks mediocre even on PS5 and the dude got trickered. I abandoned this lunacy early
Leave me out of this.

 

[chris1515]

Something I noticed in the demo is how far ungodly amount of vegetation are displayed, never seen it in any game so far. I think this could eat a lot of GPU rendering. There is some LOD but is very well hidden (behind existing vegetation) contrary to Elden Ring where there is very few amount of vegetation and with awful LOD, particularly on the PS5 version (which runs pretty bad anyways with bad motion blur, blurry chromatic aberration, well an awful IQ similar to Bloodborne for me and can give me headaches).

The game is doing plenty of things actually impressive (like the particles effects) but it's wasted by bad environment / monster design and generic / uninteresting artstyle.

And about the resolution, since when a 1200-1440p 60fps is a shame? And please don't tell me the ~50fps drops of Forspoken in cherry picked hectic moments are a disaster, it's a demo and most games nowadays have drops in cherry picked moment (some games even run constantly at ~50fps...). Most of the time the game is solid at 60fps.

I feel like competent technical people are suddenly tricked by artstyle and mirrors of some others games and fail to recognize objectively what the game is actually rendering.

Saying that I don't like the demo at all. It's uninspired like hell, main character + AI are uninteresting and annoying, you do not want to engage in its world and stories, combat and character motion are uselessly complicated, like in FF15 combat is unappealing and a chore. there are plenty others problems like the fact that the character can only jump normally up to 30cm without much energy and has trouble stepping on 30cm ledges while it can also special jump up to 100m, fall from 100m without a bruise and run faster than Usain Bolt.

They wanted to be able to render more vegetation than in Horizon Zero Dawn and they used deffered texturing and a visibility buffer. And this is what they can do in a cross gen title... And the density, the number of polygons pushed and tons of other things looks much better on Horizon Forbidden West.

We create awe-inspiring worlds - Guerrilla

Guerrilla is one of Europe's leading game companies and a wholly-owned subsidiary of Sony Interactive Entertainment Europe. We started in 2003, and have pushed the boundaries of technical and artistic excellence in our games ever since.

www.guerrilla-games.com

To accelerate its foliage and alpha tested geometry Horizon Forbidden West implements a novel loosely tiled deferred texturing system. A visibility buffer is drawn as a pre-pass followed by analysis and shading steps which run entirely in compute shaders. The use of compute shaders also provides extra flexibility that allows for the implementation of a software variable rate shading solution. Due to being able to run on the compute pipes on PS4 and PS5 it is able to overlap both the G-Buffer rendering and the rendering of cascaded shadow maps meaning that analysis and shading typically have very little overhead. This presentation describes the details of the system, and the optimizations and design choices made to integrate it into the Decima engine.

 

[pjbliverpool]

I think one thing we all have to remember here before taking these specs too seriously and drawing any conclusions from them is that they literally don't make any sense.

Even within vendor. They say you need a 6700XT for 1440p/30fps, but only a 6800XT for 4k/60fps. A 6800XT is obviously not 3-4x faster than a 6700XT.

In fact 4k/60 on a 6800XT is fairly modest when you consider the PS5 does 60fps with DRS that averages below 1080p and can drop as low as 720p.

I think the 4080 recommendation can be roundly ignored as again, at 1440p/30 the NV/AMD match up makes perfect sense with only a 3070 being needed on the NV side which is pretty much in line with the 6700XT.

 

[chris1515]

And the performance mode is on average 900p not 1200p, the quality mode is 1296p on PS5. After maybe the final version will be better but I don't see anything impressive out of the particle in Forspoken. And the framerate is inconsistent for performance mode it is going down to 40 fps during combat.

The Forspoken demo: six graphics modes to choose from but what do they do?

All quality modes in the Forspoken demo tested.

www.eurogamer.net

Performance mode is typically around 900p internally, RT mode is usually around 1000p or so, and quality mode clocks in at about 1296p in most shots I tested. The pixel count did seem to vary on a frame-by-frame basis so dynamic resolution does seem active as well.

EDIT: After this is the same demo than the one at TGS. Generally demo aren't from the same month build. It is probably a July/August 2022 build. I think final version will perform much better(better resolution/framerate)

Amid fan feedback, Square Enix says Forspoken demo's side quests and tutorials aren't reflective of the final game

The new demo's side quests were constructed specifically for the playable slice

www.gamesradar.com

 

[orangpelupa]

im just baffled why they chose that boring region for the demo.

FFXV demo was great, in duscae.

EDIT:




very hard "spot the difference" game

 

[JoeJ]

Hmm, whenever i see this, i wonder: With all the work spent on fancy dynamic cloth, why still those sneakers?
I have to look at those sneakers all the time. Neither special effects nor overexposed grading can distract me from staring at the sneakers.
1984: Regular next door guy Eddie Van Halen gets insane guitar tapping skills from wearing sneakers.
2023: Regular next door girl gets quaternion fighting skills from wearing sneakers.

But ofc. i wonder even more why i would need a whopping RTX3070 and 24GB Ram to play this at 30fps?
At least this answers my question if it's fine to keep my 16GB sticked in in case i buy two more RAM sticks with 64GB.

 

[London Geezer]

So apparently they updated the demo. Did they fix the HORRIBLE colour issues? ie lack of colour, and what's there just looks wrong?

 

[troyan]

Something I noticed in the demo is how far ungodly amount of vegetation are displayed, never seen it in any game so far.

The Witcher 3 Next Gen?! Final Fantasy 15 on the PC with tessellated grass?!

 

[mr magoo]

I think it looks medicore however it seems that either settings or rendering solution may be very stressfull for hardware as game has rather high demands on PC. Anyway it will be interesting title to watch DF analysis regardless, maybe not everything worked out for the best but to me this game was very experimental from beginning.

 

[orangpelupa]

btw what make forspoken much more heavier than FFXV?

surely its not just due to the vegetations?

 

[Globalisateur]

The Witcher 3 Next Gen?! Final Fantasy 15 on the PC with tessellated grass?!

Yes, more than TW3 next gen. The draw distance of grass combined with the number displayed beat everything I have seen on console. Also the FOV is quite generous for a console game, in some areas it looks like a game set for high end PC.

But they should have used that draw distance rendering elsewhere! like adding more interesting details in the environements because most people won't care about that grass. This is what Elden Ring does and it looks much better in the end.

I haven't seen FF15 on PC though.

 

[chris1515]

I have seen the full video leak video and this is without the day one patch and the game looks ok and better polish than the demo. They have a problem of art direction but the textures and geometry complexity are much better than FF15 on old gen consoles. LOD management is good for example.

In city they can have tons of NPC at the same time.

 

[snc]

I have seen the full video leak video and this is without the day one patch and the game looks ok and better polish than the demo. They have a problem of art direction but the textures and geometry complexity are much better than FF15 on old gen consoles. LOD management is good for example.

In city they can have tons of NPC at the same time.

did they fix hdr ?

 

[chris1515]

did they fix hdr ?

I don't know, it is a youtube video and I did not watch it on my TV.

EDIT: I think the color palette of the game is bad and maybe for the world building hey maybe use too much procedural stuff. The individual assets are not bad but the building of the world looks very bad from a visual point of view.

 

[orangpelupa]

Yeah there doesn't seem to be a rhyme to the design.

FFXV got lots of vista's that looks great close up and when far away, they sings together beautifully.