Cyan's *Must-Have* Skyrim Mod Recommendation Super-Gush Thread - daily updates

The creation of new beautiful speed painting videos ensues:


There is a correlation between this second video and the video I posted in the previous page, because it features the bard song the girl -malufenix- with an awesome voice has on Youtube --the song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4z9TdDCWN7g reached more than 1,000.000 views already :oops:

This second video shows real-time places and nice landscapes of the game. I had to blink back tears watching this one:

 
Billy Idol said:
try using the consol commands (see skyrim wiki) to get over quest bugs (you can jump through quests and all the stuff to "heal" the game!)
I used this to finish the conjuration master spell quest, after the game did not recognize properly a kill!!
Click to expand...

I'm playing on 360, so no console commands.


On the plus side, the patch appears to have fixed the thieves guild, and reloading from an earlier save fixed the imperial legion.

So now it's only the Bard's guild that is broken. It appears to be a pretty common bug, so maybe they'll fix it in a later patch.


I was also happy to find out that a bunch of obsolete useless quest items were permenantly removed from my inventory at one point when I got arrested, so horray for not having to carry as much junk around.
 
patsu said:
An interesting speculation on Skyrim PS3 woes:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=33181475&postcount=1

I suspected there are concurrency issues in the game. Overgrown delta save seems to match what people are seeing too. After the latest patch, some people have their game save reduced by 1Mb.
Click to expand...
I love Skyrim, the Elder Scrolls series, and I haven't suffered any bugs. (fingers crossed) Even so, Bethesda have to improve their testing, because for many users the game is a bug fest,

If you are going to make one of the biggest games ever made, the most reasonable thing to do is having a QA department to match.

It's been almost 6 years since Oblivion... Oblivion was made in 4 years and was a huge game, but nowhere near as bug-ridden as Skyrim.
 
Cyan said:
I love Skyrim, the Elder Scrolls series, and I haven't suffered any bugs. (fingers crossed) Even so, Bethesda have to improve their testing, because for many users the game is a bug fest,

If you are going to make one of the biggest games ever made, the most reasonable thing to do is having a QA department to match.

It's been almost 6 years since Oblivion... Oblivion was made in 4 years and was a huge game, but nowhere near as bug-ridden as Skyrim.
Click to expand...

I'd also like to see them increase their staff of human animators from 1 person to 2, maybe even 3 or 4 people if they're feeling daring. Holy Stiff Robots Batman! I was immediately pulled out of the intro (distracted) as soon as the first person started to walk (a few minutes into the opening carriage ride, IIRC).

I know there are probably technical reasons (like memory constraints given the open world nature of the game?) that are responsible for this and not the animators themselves. And I got use to it quickly, but, that's still pretty much my first memory of the game (bad human animation) and it was quite jarring. I'll say this, though, there's a rare few games that I will actually try and sneak a few minutes of gaming in the morning with, and this is one of them.
 
I've noticed that all the bodies and things that were left lying around now actually disappear, which is a good thing. After all if you left a body out in the wild it would get consumed fairly quickly and wouldn't just stay forever in the same place.

And in towns there were always the odd dead guard or npc lying around. How they got there I don't know... But it makes sense for them to disappear as I'd assume people would tidy up things like that.

So in that respect it made it much better, though it now has problems in towns some times with stuttering etc.
 
Cyan said:
It's been almost 6 years since Oblivion... Oblivion was made in 4 years and was a huge game, but nowhere near as bug-ridden as Skyrim.
Click to expand...

Oblivion got many bugs, many freezes, and personally more than Skyrim and there more quests and things in Skyrim than Oblivion. For example my wife got one of the most present bug in Oblivion in the Magicians Guild Quest: the immortal Archi Necromant, so you don't be able to finish it. And this was never resolved two years after.
 
RobertR1 said:
My goal today was to go from Whiterun to the Mage's college on foot. I quickly got arrested and ended up at Dawnstar. Long story short, 5 hours later and I'm no closer.

I have no idea how I'm suppose to ever finish this game.
Click to expand...

That was my aim one day.. managed to get there eventually, ignoring most stuff on the way.


*minor spoilers follow*

Did *some* mage college stuff then took part in a drinking contest in Winterhold... well my char got wasted and is no longer in Winterhold and wont be getting back for a LONG time. Sure I could just fast travel back but where's the fun in that. Actions have consequences and I found it quite amusing.
 
BoardBonobo said:
I've noticed that all the bodies and things that were left lying around now actually disappear, which is a good thing. After all if you left a body out in the wild it would get consumed fairly quickly and wouldn't just stay forever in the same place.

And in towns there were always the odd dead guard or npc lying around. How they got there I don't know... But it makes sense for them to disappear as I'd assume people would tidy up things like that.

So in that respect it made it much better, though it now has problems in towns some times with stuttering etc.
Click to expand...

There are still a couple of oddities that carried over from Fallout 3. Use of energy based weapons in FO3 eventually led to thousands of persistent goo puddles that never ever disappeared (unlike the bodies and blood stains if you fancied regular bullets). In Skyrim it's the ashes of mages, necromancers, vampires, ice elementals, that sort of thing. Those never ever vanish. (and that, among other things, is why blaming this debacle solely on the PS3 hardware is an even bigger load of bs than it already was)
 
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rekator said:
Oblivion got many bugs, many freezes, and personally more than Skyrim and there more quests and things in Skyrim than Oblivion. For example my wife got one of the most present bug in Oblivion in the Magicians Guild Quest: the immortal Archi Necromant, so you don't be able to finish it. And this was never resolved two years after.
Click to expand...

Oblivion had one completely broken major questline, Skyrim has at least 4 (bards, companions, imperial legion, and main quest).

I believe that the reason for this is threefold:
1. Skyrim has many more quests, including dynamic quests that send you to random dungeons so that you frequently clear them before actually getting a story quest that requires you to do something there.
2. There are many side-quests that are supposed to be locked out when you pick up a specific quest.
3. The quest programmers were very sloppy and didn't consider that the above could happen. This results in bugs where if you cleared something early, a quest is broken, or if you pick up quests in the wrong order, NPC's bug out.


There are of course some things that are just straight up bugs (Bard's Guild questline bug, Winterhold side quest debuff bug, crashes, etc). But many of the quest bugs are simply due to design failures.
 
dlm said:
Oblivion had one completely broken major questline, Skyrim has at least 4 (bards, companions, imperial legion, and main quest).

I believe that the reason for this is threefold:
1. Skyrim has many more quests, including dynamic quests that send you to random dungeons so that you frequently clear them before actually getting a story quest that requires you to do something there.
2. There are many side-quests that are supposed to be locked out when you pick up a specific quest.
3. The quest programmers were very sloppy and didn't consider that the above could happen. This results in bugs where if you cleared something early, a quest is broken, or if you pick up quests in the wrong order, NPC's bug out.


There are of course some things that are just straight up bugs (Bard's Guild questline bug, Winterhold side quest debuff bug, crashes, etc). But many of the quest bugs are simply due to design failures.
Click to expand...
Sounds like an excellent explanatiobn to me. I don't know if it was just my (feminine? I am male) intuition, but I decided since the very first day not to enter dungeons just in case a NPC told me to go there. I did this not to spoil the treasure that might be in a chest when finishing a quest because I thought that if I went into a dungeon before a quest appears to clear the same dungeon, the second time I wouldn't find the treasured item which might be there.

Seems like some people went into a dungeon and haven't returned :p because of a bug.

I also like wandering around the Skyrim soil.

Bethesda has to find out where the game breaks and the steps leading to those bugs, now that there are a lot of people playing the game.

Gradthrawn said:
I'd also like to see them increase their staff of human animators from 1 person to 2, maybe even 3 or 4 people if they're feeling daring. Holy Stiff Robots Batman! I was immediately pulled out of the intro (distracted) as soon as the first person started to walk (a few minutes into the opening carriage ride, IIRC).

I know there are probably technical reasons (like memory constraints given the open world nature of the game?) that are responsible for this and not the animators themselves. And I got use to it quickly, but, that's still pretty much my first memory of the game (bad human animation) and it was quite jarring. I'll say this, though, there's a rare few games that I will actually try and sneak a few minutes of gaming in the morning with, and this is one of them.
Click to expand...
Also dpn't get me started on the horses animation when jumping, it's so Atari 2600 that I got used to it and find it amusing.

1000% agree with the last two lines of your post. I could express the same about this game.
 
RobertR1 said:
My goal today was to go from Whiterun to the Mage's college on foot. I quickly got arrested and ended up at Dawnstar. Long story short, 5 hours later and I'm no closer.

I have no idea how I'm suppose to ever finish this game.
Click to expand...

Haha, finishing the game is a seconday goal in Elder Scrolls games. I put 100+ hours into Oblivion, then went back to the main quest and finished the game. Then there's all the dlc :) There really is so much to do in these games it's just amazing.



rekator said:
Oblivion got many bugs, many freezes, and personally more than Skyrim and there more quests and things in Skyrim than Oblivion. For example my wife got one of the most present bug in Oblivion in the Magicians Guild Quest: the immortal Archi Necromant, so you don't be able to finish it. And this was never resolved two years after.
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm lucky but for me Skyrim (pc) has been 100% solid, not one crash or bug, it's been rock solid gaming. Oblivion (360) had a few bugs and a couple of lockups but still pretty good considering how much game is packed in there. Morrowind (pc) had far more issues and Daggerfall (pc) was a total crashfest. So to me the Elder Scrolls games have just been getting more and more solid over time to where Skyrim has had zero issues for me.
 
rekator said:
Seem there more than one thing who cause the PS3 Bug.

http://www.bethblog.com/2011/12/01/skyrim-what-were-working-on/

And no fix in the 1.3
Click to expand...
I think this post (below) of another forumer in the Technology forum might help to find a fix. Maybe the solution is reducing the numbers of days before items or NPCs, creatures, disappear. I would rather have that that some console gamers complaining and saying that after they release a patch the game and Bethesda have hit a new low, etc etc.

I am level 15 and I remember moving a cart close to the river in Riverwood the very first day I played the game, and the cart is still there. :oops: It's amusing. The wolves I confronted and went sprawling that day, are lifeless in the same place.

N_B said:
Oblivion didn't suffer noticably from this because the world had far less persistence. As long as 3 days have passed, most cells will reset (dead npcs are removed, new ones are spawned, containers have their contents reset, moved objects are reset) when you enter it. In Skyrim, its 10 days, and a ton of things (including entire cells) are set to not respawn. Additionally there are more interactive objects that can be moved around (especially accidentally, with a explosive spell or something). The save file grows a lot larger much faster. With Oblivion you would have to play 80+ hours to even reach 5mb.
Click to expand...
 
Why the hell didn't they reduce the refresh time then? Given the size of the game, visiting every single dungeon only once is already an enormous undertaking. 10 in-game days in Skyrim is complete overkill. How long is a Skyrim day? An hour maybe?
Anyway, glad the bitching and moaning finally set something in motion.
 
RobertR1 said:
My goal today was to go from Whiterun to the Mage's college on foot. I quickly got arrested and ended up at Dawnstar. Long story short, 5 hours later and I'm no closer.
Click to expand...

Don't give us some innocent act like you were just merrily skipping along, minding you're own business, when you suddenly got arrested. :p You were pillaging and murdering, weren't you?
 
Honestly, the only way they can possibly really fix all of the quest issues in this game is to go through every quest 1 by 1 and find every single event-based trigger in every quest and add either state-based or time-based triggers as failsafe mechanisms for every one.

Not only is their event model clearly flawed (many quest bugs appear to be the result of events not triggering properly), it is extremely fragile because in an open game, it is easily possible to cause an event-based trigger to become unreachable via completely innocent means.


One example could be having the companions questline that is broken for many people have, in addition to the "X person dies" trigger event completing the quest also complete on the state-based trigger "X dungeon in flagged clear or Y person is not alive in X dungeon".

I'm also suspicious that in the quests based on time (there are a few, like the one I'm on that permenantly debuffed my 1H skill), they are still using an event-based trigger that fires after a certain period of time has elapsed instead of a state-based trigger which is continuously set after a period of time is over. This results in fragile behavior when the player does things like wait or sleep, where the game's eventing can go really funny (you've probably noticed that if you sleep between the hours of 6am and 10am, some shops will simply never open that day because the NPC's wake-up trigger never fired).

It's mostly conjecture, although I suppose we'll know a lot more about what's going on under the covers once they ship the tools in the next patch.
 
OK, I've just hit ~11Mb with my save game and the outdoor sections are all. in. stop. go. motion. It's reaaaaaaally annoying.
 
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