Current Generation Games Analysis Technical Discussion [2022] [XBSX|S, PS5, PC]

[davis.anthony]

Reinstalled TW3 with the update and in typical fashion Rivetuner Statistics nor FRAPS is working to give me my frame rate

 

[yamaci17]

The DX11 new gen uses less LOD, less draw distance and less NPC count than the DX12 new gen, it also has less shadow casting lights. That's what Alex is telling you. The DX11 new gen uses the old config files from the old gen version, so it's visual makeup is less than the DX12 version.

Here's DX12 LOWEST vs DX11 Ultra+

Imgsli

Here in this comparison, DX11 has %20 better CPU bound performance while having;

More shadows cast
Better LODs
More NPCs

 

[see colon]

Here's DX12 LOWEST vs DX11 Ultra+

Imgsli

Here in this comparison, DX11 has %20 better CPU bound performance while having;

More shadows cast
Better LODs
More NPCs

Looking at that pic, there are obviously differences in asset quality because of the settings difference, but also some other differences that don't quite make sense. Look at the building in the back with the 2 sets of windows and the circular window above it. In the DX11 ultra pic, the 2 sets of windows have geometry to them while the DX12 low is a texture. That's expected and explained by the settings difference. But the circular window above it is the opposite with the DX12 low being geometric and it being a texture on DX12 ultra. It's clear the assets aren't a 1 to 1 match for whatever reason. Not something I would probably notice in game, though.

-edit- I might be wrong, perhaps it's just the better settings plus TAA making it look less obviously geometric in the DX11 versions.

Do you have a dx12 ultra shot of this same scene to compare? I'm just curious how it comes out.

 

[Dictator]

My GPU heavily became a bottleneck at native 4K with DX11' and I had to go down to 1440p to make sure I'm CPU limited there. That is on me, I'm sorry for the confusion. I should've both compared them at 1440p.

Here's the exact same comparison at native 1440p. The difference in sharpness/LOD is all caused by 1440p.

Imgsli

I'm comparing newgen dx11 vs newgen dx12. None of my comparisons are from the OG version. DX12 is still a tiny bit sharper but I don't see how that costs a %40 CPU bound performance penalty. If you think the difference in slight sharpness justifies the %40 CPU bound performance, then I'm baffled.

I actually did a full reinstall and config file wipe between versions and the NEW DX11 is indeed using the same draw distance settings as DX12. The OLD DX11 settings had apparently overridden the new when I had typed to you.

My error, sorry!!!!

 

[yamaci17]

I actually did a full reinstall and config file wipe between versions and the NEW DX11 is indeed using the same draw distance settings as DX12. The OLD DX11 settings had apparently overridden the new when I had typed to you.

My error, sorry!!!!

I'm glad you sorted out your issues, I await your review with excitement!!

 

[yamaci17]

a good benchmark to compare what kind of a power difference there is between a 3070 and ps5/series x when it comes to ray tracing. series x and ps5 runs barebones RTGI (per Alex from DF, they run settings that are not exposed to PC) averaging 1100-1150p while barely having a stable 30 FPS. 3070 manages to truck along near 30-35 FPS at NATIVE 1620p with full RTGI+RTAO+RTSHADOWS+RT REFLECTIONS. there's a stark difference between ray tracing performance in this specific case!

 

[Inuhanyou]

a good benchmark to compare what kind of a power difference there is between a 3070 and ps5/series x when it comes to ray tracing. series x and ps5 runs barebones RTGI (per Alex from DF, they run settings that are not exposed to PC) averaging 1100-1150p while barely having a stable 30 FPS. 3070 manages to truck along near 30-35 FPS at NATIVE 1620p with full RTGI+RTAO+RTSHADOWS+RT REFLECTIONS. there's a stark difference between ray tracing performance in this specific case!

I mean ye, that's not really a surprise. the rdna 2.0 is first gen AMD RT to begin with. It would make more sense to compare to 2060 or 2070 which we have known since watch dogs to be roughly equivalent console RT on PC.

I can see why so many devs including cd project are ditching their own engines. It's too hard to update them for every game and on top of that ue5 has much more efficient next gen suite of features in lumen plus nanite that can work across all platforms as opposed to barely getting two RT features to work at 30 on their current engine on a years old project. They probably wanting a clean slate.

This gen of consoles despite being RT capable are not ready for the true RT revolution. But software based GI and hybrid RT may be sufficient until AMD gets their hardware capable enough.

 

[BRiT]

DX12 API vs other APIs topic is over here: https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/no-dx12-software-is-suitable-for-benchmarking-spawn.58013/

No DX12 Software is Suitable for Benchmarking *spawn*

I think AoTS was carefully chosen for the dual cheap GPU beating expensive single card narrative, but if there substantial gains anywhere else I would had expected that game to be showcased as well. I gotta hand it to AMD. They already have people calling the next generation based on a...

forum.beyond3d.com

 

[davis.anthony]

GTA 5 single player on PS5 and XSX has been updated to also have RT reflections.

 

[Remij]

GTA 5 single player on PS5 and XSX has been updated to also have RT reflections.

Sooooo much better. Wow.

 

[milk]

GTA 5 single player on PS5 and XSX has been updated to also have RT reflections.

Best comparison video yet.

 

[QPlayer]

And this game uses the BVH geometry streaming technique, which dynamically handles the BVH geometry. Not on PC, but works great on console. Having produced quite a good result in a previous generation game, and therefore, this is just the beginning. This also proves that there is significant performance potential in the current generation of consoles.

 

[PSman1700]

Not on PC, but works great on console.

Maybe next generation of consoles will, hopefully, improve in this regard. We want RT to adopt as quickly as possible.

 

[pjbliverpool]

And this game uses the BVH geometry streaming technique, which dynamically handles the BVH geometry. Not on PC, but works great on console. Having produced quite a good result in a previous generation game, and therefore, this is just the beginning. This also proves that there is significant performance potential in the current generation of consoles.

I assume you are referring to GTA5 there? I hope the PC version gets these RT updates, it'll make for an interesting comparison point for how much CPU pressure the BVH streaming can alleviate.

 

[QPlayer]

I assume you are referring to GTA5 there? I hope the PC version gets these RT updates, it'll make for an interesting comparison point for how much CPU pressure the BVH streaming can alleviate.

This Ray-tracing procedure written for consoles is unique and not compatible with the PC DirectX Ray-tracing API.

 

[iroboto]

And this game uses the BVH geometry streaming technique, which dynamically handles the BVH geometry. Not on PC, but works great on console. Having produced quite a good result in a previous generation game, and therefore, this is just the beginning. This also proves that there is significant performance potential in the current generation of consoles.

?
Uhh. Do you have some links to some sources? Would be curious to read where this came from.

I believe that many developers on the DXR thread were looking precisely for more control over the BVH that PC DXR blocks

 

[pjbliverpool]

This Ray-tracing procedure written for consoles is unique and not compatible with the PC DirectX Ray-tracing API.

I think you misunderstood my post. Of course these RT features will work on the PC, but if they really are streaming the BVH on console, then that aspect of the implementation will not work on PC, hence why I think it would be a good comparison point so that we can see what impact BVH streaming has vs generating it runtime.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I think you misunderstood my post. Of course these RT features will work on the PC, but if they really are streaming the BVH on console, then that aspect of the implementation will not work on PC, hence why I think it would be a good comparison point so that we can see what impact BVH streaming has vs generating it runtime.

Can you give me more info on this "streaming bvh" thing you guys are talking about?

 

[QPlayer]

?
Uhh. Do you have some links to some sources? Would be curious to read where this came from.

I believe that many developers on the DXR thread were looking precisely for more control over the BVH that PC DXR blocks

From a Hungarian technological site, there is no direct source, but the author is well informed on this topic and they talk a lot about these things.

Hamarosan két sugárkövetéses effekt is lesz a GTA V-ben

Ezek azonban csak az új konzolgenerációra vonatkoznak, a PC-s bevezetésről szó sincs.

prohardver.hu

 

[chris1515]

Rockstar games will release raytracing on PC and the implementation will be different but it will go faster and probably they will use more RT features like RTGI, RT shadows, RTAO. They won't limit PC implementation to RT reflections.

Rockstar North always implement new stuffs on consoles and after PC but when it is done High end PC are more powerful than consoles and they can do much more.