Could multiple Xenon SKUs work?

[wco81]

I know this has been discussed in many threads but couldn't find one specifically about it.

A blog claiming to have a contact which has been right in the past brought up the multiple Xenon (or Xbox360) SKU scenario again. Maybe this is based on the same old rumors or maybe this is more firmed up info.

The SKUs are described as "'cheapo' without any extras," a middle SKU with a hard drive and "DVR-like" functionality, and a "PC version."

Maybe the cheapo version is priced to really move while the more feature-rich versions come later. However, could adoption be delayed by people waiting for the configurations with more features?

Could hard drive support by games be diminished by the fact that the hard drive isn't on the base (cheapest) SKU? Could backwards compatibility be only supported in the higher SKUs?

Could it be that the additional SKUs were added because the prospect of not having a HDD wasn't received well? Could the higher-priced SKUs sport a blue-laser drive to counter the Blu-Ray drive in the PS3? Could MS be that reactive in their design decision-making?

Is there a big demand to have DVR functions in a console? Or personal computing functions (surfing, productivity)?

It doesn't seem to make sense. Inventory management of multiple SKUs could be costly if they don't forecast the relative demand of the different SKUs correctly. The PSX didn't fly so why would a higher-priced DVR sell?

Assuming they can't release all these SKUs at once, the higher-priced SKUs could dampen adoption of the base SKU (and a lot of those who wait for the higher SKUs may end up deciding they want the base SKU after all).

Yet this rumor seems to persis.

 

[jvd]

I believe they could do something like this


Xenon with hd-dvd drive , 512 megs of ram , 80 gig hardrive for 300$

xenon hd-dvd drive 512 megs of ram , 120 gig hardrive 400$

xenon hd-dvd drive 512 megs of ram 200 gig hardrive 500$

Or switch around the size of the hardrives however much u want

This way someone who just wants to play games can get the xenon cheap . Those who want to play games and tivo some stuff can get a bigger drive , and those who want to use the tivo functions often can get the biggest


I think it would be dumb to put out two xenons one with dvd and one with hd-dvd as all it will do is provide playback and the system it self wouldn't see any advantages do to it

 

[wco81]

Hmm, if the only differentiation is hard drive size, I don't see too many people paying for bigger drives. A lot of people will try just to get the lowest one and try to upgrade the drive themselves.

Plus I don't see a need for a bigger drive than 80 GB for gaming. Now DVR features would be nice but is it going to have horsepower to record a program while you're playing a game?

If they delivered with HD-DVD, 512 MB RAM and 80 GB for $300, that's a very attractive package.

Maybe too attractive to be true.

 

[Farid]

About the Hard Drive issue,
if they really segment their market by making the HD an option, I fear that the Xenon's HD would be as useless as PS2's one (Except from a Media Player/Emulation/Pirate poin of view, of course).
Seeing that with the HD in all Xbox, a too little number of games make any good use of it, an optional HD in Xenon would have little to none support from the developers (I assume that MGS's games would use, though).

 

[Pozer]

I dont understand either how having a non-HD and a HD model will work in regards to Xenon Live. Great thing I like about current xbox is downloadeable content and patches for exploits. On the ps2 if an exploit is found, too bad, the games ruined forever. On Xbox a patch can be issued. But if you have non-HD models on Xenon Live how will patching be possible.

Will non-HD players be on a seperate server from patched HD players? Will non-HD models even have Live compatiability? Will non-HD models have a slower/smaller/cheaper 1 gig of flash ram instead? (is that even cheaper than
a small HD?)

Basically, I love my xbox. But having multiple SKUs for a console is just a bad idea. Because if the HD model is just for vanity crap like ripping music and wont enhance the way the game runs, then its pointless. If the HD model enhances the game performance then its stupid to release a non-HD model. The point of a console is the fact the game runs the same for everyone.

I'm going to reserve judgment though, cause MS have never said if their will be multiple models. We still have no official word from MS on anything yet. i guess pretty soon we will know.

 

[pc999]

Basically, I love my xbox. But having multiple SKUs for a console is just a bad idea. Because if the HD model is just for vanity crap like ripping music and wont enhance the way the game runs, then its pointless. If the HD model enhances the game performance then its stupid to release a non-HD model. The point of a console is the fact the game runs the same for everyone.

It is used in some games (e.g. Halo) but to few.

Just 1 ? , isnt the HD obsolet to stream next gen games

 

[wco81]

Actually, SOCOM II patched to a memory card. So it can be done but it's not the best idea, with limited memory.

It would be cool if all the consoles supported the USB flash memory drives, which you can get pretty cheaply now. Several hundred megabytes at least for what you pay for the console-specific memory cards.

But of course, there's money to be made in those proprietary console-specific memory cards.

 

[Trawler]

I wouldn't be surprised if the no-HD version of Xenon hit the shelves at US$200.

MS will be going for the jugular with Xenon. I would say they care little about a few million going down the drain in loss on hardware sales for the first few years.

 

[Inane_Dork]

Multiple SKUs make stocking a nightmare, I know that much.

If they do actually want that kind of model, they should just make things add-ons. Yes, I know, add-ons almost never catch on. Too bad.

If the rumor is true about the X2 having memory card ports on the console instead of on the controller, maybe MS plans on releasing their own Ipod-like device. Or maybe such devices will work from day one as hard drives if you plug them in.

Backwards compatibility is completely up in the air to me. I can't pin anything down about it. Maybe yes, maybe no. Maybe it's paid for. Maybe you pay per game.

 

[passerby]

few million going down the drain in loss on hardware sales for the first few years.

If a console generation lasts 5 years, "first few years" means losing millions for half of the product's lifespan!

Besides, asumming a XBNext takes $330 to produce...
Assume selling at $200...
assume this price constant for 1 year...
Assume 1 mil units in 1 year(reasonable?)

Total loss for 1 mil units in 1 year = $130mil
Add in marketing, distribution, administration costs...

If lucky we're looking at loss of ~quater billion. And we have not counted development/R&D/software costs yet. Software sales of course helps, but ~0.25bil is a really big number to work with.

Unless the XBNext is really, really cheap to produce...

 

[wco81]

A $200 SKU would be really attractive. Even a $250 SKU would entice a lot of people.

However, if they announce higher-priced SKUs with more features releasing later, it just might have people delay their purchases.

So it would mitigate the impact of an early launch?

 

[Li Mu Bai]

I believe they could do something like this


Xenon with hd-dvd drive , 512 megs of ram , 80 gig hardrive for 300$

xenon hd-dvd drive 512 megs of ram , 120 gig hardrive 400$

xenon hd-dvd drive 512 megs of ram 200 gig hardrive 500$

Or switch around the size of the hardrives however much u want

Someone's been both spec. & functionality dreaming.

I wouldn't be surprised if the no-HD version of Xenon hit the shelves at US$200.

MS will be going for the jugular with Xenon. I would say they care little about a few million going down the drain in loss on hardware sales for the first few years.

Expect to be surprised then. They want to see profitability by '07-'08, so I wouldn't count on your "jugular scenario." XBX 360 is not even designed to be a "money pit" in any form. I doubt MS would abandon their cost-effective partnerships & design measures by slitting their throats with a premature price drop.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If lucky we're looking at loss of ~quater billion. And we have not counted development/R&D/software costs yet. Software sales of course helps, but ~0.25bil is a really big number to work with.

Such losses are a HUGE step up from where they are now!

Instead of HDs I expect MemCards to be used. Sony will use MemStick in PS3, providing media portability between Sony devices. Patches could be downloaded onto these. If XB went with the cheaper formats they could provide large storage at low cost, and mem prices would be dropping constantly for the life of the console.

 

[Pozer]

I wouldn't be surprised if the no-HD version of Xenon hit the shelves at US$200.

Thats incredibly wishful thinking. A top of line GPU alone will set you back a pretty penny. Add to that a top of line CPU and DVD drive.

I think we'll be lucky to see a $299 launch. Maybe $399. but if MS is smart they'll keep it cheap BEFORE ps3 to get a bigger install base. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw price wars earlier next gen. Look for xbox2 to hit $199 by Xmas 2006. (and even lower if its has a rough time selling) Im assuming Sony is going to come out of the gate swinging. Im expecting another E3 shocker from SOny, similar to E3 '94 or'95 when they upped Sega by announcing PSone launch for $299. THere gonna do everything they can to make Xenon look like another dreamcast.

 

[StefanS]

Instead of HDs I expect MemCards to be used. Sony will use MemStick in PS3, providing media portability between Sony devices. Patches could be downloaded onto these. If XB went with the cheaper formats they could provide large storage at low cost, and mem prices would be dropping constantly for the life of the console.

I am personally very disappointed that Nintendo's SD-Adapter was never released....

 

[AzBat]

I have always had similar ideas to Inane's. Ever since the first rumors about no hard drive and 3 different SKUs I envisioned MS releasing one base model capable of taking a iPod-like device. The base model might come in at $200-$250 without the iPod-like device, but it could be added later. If you the buy the model that comes with an iPod-like device packaged with it, then you could also throw in a special AV pack to allow DVR support. The cost of buying those 2 addons could be more than buying it in a package deal. The HDD/PVR package could cost $300-$350.

Now, here's where I have a difference of opinion of the HDD. I don't think MS will go with a standard hard drive. I'm thinking it could it will be entirely flash-based. Use off-the-shelf components again and you have the hacking community take advantage of it again. How it connects to the Xbox could be entirely different too. I'm expecting it to be a removable docking station type integrated with the console. Snap on the front or side. It will probably look similar and operate similar to an iPod. Meaning it will probably have a LCD that would be visible and usable while docked with the console.

The whole point of this idea is to quit subsidizing the cost of the MP3/WMA music functionality in every console. Some people use it, but most people don't. Even with all original Xbox consoles including support for it, not all developers took advantage of it in their games. This way Microsoft saves some money at the same time they give customers an actual incentive to buy the hard drive add-on. A hard drive only add-on like the PS2 HDD doesn't sell. Microsoft knows this. Maybe the hard drive also comes with pre-installed games? Maybe it provides for the backward compatibility? There are a lot of incentives Microsoft can provide with the add-on for people to buy it.

Anyway, I can see multiple package deals with or without a HDD add-on, but I still believe there will only be one physical box. Everything else will be external add-ons.

Tommy McClain

 

[kyleb]

I believe they could do something like this


Xenon with hd-dvd drive , 512 megs of ram , 80 gig hardrive for 300$
....

So I take it you have given up on the 300gb 15000k sata drive?

 

[V3]

They could do it like low-high end PC GPU too IMO.

$300 for 480p
$500 for 720p
$1000 for 1080p

That way they can save money, IMO.

If PC developers can deal with multiple resolutions, with just 3 platforms, I am sure consoles dev can deal with it too.

 

[Qroach]

? When they say HD I beleive eveyrone is talking about Hard drive, and not High def. The console will handle what resoloution the game runs at, so there certainly isn't any reason to have seperate consoles for each resoloution.

Btw, No console is going to support 1080p as it has a frame rate limit of 30fps (with no half frames at 60).

 

[bbot]

Qroach,


Can you tell us if MS will go with three cores on a die or if, as a recent rumor suggests, they will go with only two cores on a die?