Console Exclusives: Significance and Impact *spinoff*

The idea that Japan prefers japanese products, and shuns western ones, is brought up often, but the sales figures don't support that theory. Sony and nintendo sell very well all over the world. MS is selling well only in US/UK. And apple sells very well in japan.

The only correllation is that americans buy american consoles more than any other countries. I.e. the sales imbalance is in the US, not in japan. I think games genres discrepancies and cultural preferences in the US/UK explains it more than national pride.
 
Ah yes, including of course internal power supply.

I never got why some gamers found an external power module (brick) to be intrusive... or some weird underlying reason for not purchasing a system. Sure the XB360 had a fairly large power-supply, and XBO has an external one as well, but I always found them to be welcomed, than displeasing. Could you image how much quieter & cooler the PS4/PS3 would have been with an external module? Seriously, I don't hear people complaining about their Laptop power modules, when you have to lug that shit more often than a console.
 
Which was ironically the case of base PS4 (the 100% in your scenario) and base Xbox One (80%) from launch and until PS4 exclusives picked up.
However, PS has always offered a great library and was carried on that Good Will, of which I'm certain. Plenty of existing PS fans knew it'd be getting great exclusives down the line despite a lack-lustre launch. XB didn't have great exclusives with OX (excepting of note Halo which of course sold the entire platform!) and hasn't had them with XB1, so going into next gen (and this mid-gen), buyers are faced with a certainty of high quality only-on-PlayStation titles to join their favourite 3rd parties on PS5, and an uncertain set of unique titles only-on-Xbox with a possibility of not many at all. If MS can't address that by the end of this generation (possibly too late now), they'll have trouble recovering from that next gen.
 
My argument would be that console owners don't buy infinite games. A bigger library gives more options for games to buy and that's a strong benefit, but not having those options wouldn't necessarily lessen your opportunity to buy and play games. You would instead just choose different games from the options you do have. So the question for consumers is, what platform is going to give the best overall gaming experience with the time/money I have to spend? The one with the most games isn't going to be the answer for everyone.

To add: Last gen I calculated the average yearly purchase rate for a console owner to be around 5 games per year. Now adjust that how you will to come up with some number of games purchased by a "hardcore" gamer in a year. Fill those "slots" with games available to Playstation 4 + Xbox One owners in the prior calendar year. Then do the same with the options available to PS4-only and Xbox One-only gamers. How much of a quality drop-off is there between the totality of gaming experiences that could be had with access to exclusives and without if you were to buy the same number of games?
 
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Even if true, for most having more choice means better chance to be satisfied. Given a choice between a massive supermarket stocking thousands of products you'll never try, and a local corner store with just the basics that keep you well fed, which is the more popular and why? "Number of games" is a nice comparable figure with psychological significance even if the decision makers never go outside their comfort zone when buying games.
 
Does the quantity of choice matter if you're not interested in all the types? It's like having dinner at a Gourmet Restaurant that specializes in 10,000 different Vegan dishes when one has a taste for Meat and Potatoes. If that's the situation, then one would be better off going to a Steak House instead.
 
Yeah it will be difficult for MS to branch out, but I think the X360 was on the right track. But instead of building on what made X360 work, they shifted their focus to TV/entertainment and their 1P output fell off. The launch price was also too high and the HW was lacking.

Phil seems to have shifted the focus back to gaming. I believe he has also stated that they plan to recommit to 1P again; personally I think it would be a mistake not to.

I don't think they necessarily need to secure more Japanese games, or make games appealing to the Japanese market. They just need to put more money towards their 1P output, have a more steady stream of 1P games, and market the shit out of them like they used to. Give gamers a reason to buy your console over the competition.

They most likely will never be successful in Japan, but they can at least sell better in EUR. I expect XB1 to sell ~55-60M whereas X360 sold ~85M... the large majority of those lost sales were from EUR.

But japanese games don't sold well only in Japan but in Europe too...

And we have a pretty good approximation of the advantage of Sony in US ~3 millions, ~ 1,3 million in UK and 6,5 millions in Japan. The biggest difference comes from Europe and rest of the world. Nearly ~2,4 millions for Spain ar least...

Power is not everything far from it, Sony sold much more PS3 than 360 in continental Europe. And the PS3 was far more expensive than 360 for a long time and had weaker version of multiplatform games... there is other things in action, it is called brand and games... Sony games are more popular in Europe than US and more popular than Microsoft games out of UK in Europe. I am not sure that if the PS3 was weaker but not sold 599 dollars/euros but 399 euros the 360 will have made a big gain in continental Europe. They did some gain because of Sony being lenient and launch one year after Microsoft and a a very bad design of the console too expensive to produce... They lost 200 dollars per console sold at 599...

Like I said and I will say it again Jim Ryan from Sony playstation divison told than single player narrative games are very popular in Europe. And Sony have multiple studio working on this type of game... And it seems currently MS is focus on improving first party with a focus on GAAS games, it will not help them with the people liking single player game. From the rumor only the new Fable seems to focus on this part of the market...

For the brand part, MS tried to sponsor the liga(soccer league) in Spain the most popular sport there and it did not help... It is because Playstation is a much bigger brand because they were there before Xbox in Europe and it is the first choice for consumer. They just need to launch a good console at 399, continue to launch enough exclusives games and keep the 3rd party support...

If they follow the logic and choose again AMD with backward compatibility they have another advantage, they can keep the Playstation player inside the ecosystem. It is much more important than last gen with the growth of digital sales.

Microsoft can come back out of UK and US but they need Sony to fucked up(sold console more than 399) and or no backward compatibility or launch too late. Or Xbox offer need to be vastly superior to Sony offer it is difficult too.

Edit: I don't believe Microsoft will sold 55/60 millions Xbox One if they sold between 45/50 millions it would been great...

Edit2: Xbox is a great brand in US, Microsoft lost because of the error they made DRM bad press, launch at 499 dollars with Kinect, a less powerful console but it was not the main error...
 
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Even if true, for most having more choice means better chance to be satisfied. Given a choice between a massive supermarket stocking thousands of products you'll never try, and a local corner store with just the basics that keep you well fed, which is the more popular and why? "Number of games" is a nice comparable figure with psychological significance even if the decision makers never go outside their comfort zone when buying games.

For this analogy to work, the corner store has to also have the absolute freshest, highest quality produce and stocks enough variety that consumers have sufficient choice.
 
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Does the quantity of choice matter if you're not interested in all the types? It's like having dinner at a Gourmet Restaurant that specializes in 10,000 different Vegan dishes when one has a taste for Meat and Potatoes. If that's the situation, then one would be better off going to a Steak House instead.

Yet when you can have games for everyone it is better... Sony have the steak house and the vegan menu...
However, PS has always offered a great library and was carried on that Good Will, of which I'm certain. Plenty of existing PS fans knew it'd be getting great exclusives down the line despite a lack-lustre launch. XB didn't have great exclusives with OX (excepting of note Halo which of course sold the entire platform!) and hasn't had them with XB1, so going into next gen (and this mid-gen), buyers are faced with a certainty of high quality only-on-PlayStation titles to join their favourite 3rd parties on PS5, and an uncertain set of unique titles only-on-Xbox with a possibility of not many at all. If MS can't address that by the end of this generation (possibly too late now), they'll have trouble recovering from that next gen.

And they serve everyone japanese people on Japan, fan of japanese games in Europe and fan of single player game in Europe and US...

And for the other people third party are there too... GAAS and MP game...

When you buy a PlayStation all consumer know what they will have...
 
My argument would be that console owners don't buy infinite games. A bigger library gives more options for games to buy and that's a strong benefit, but not having those options wouldn't necessarily lessen your opportunity to buy and play games. You would instead just choose different games from the options you do have. So the question for consumers is, what platform is going to give the best overall gaming experience with the time/money I have to spend? The one with the most games isn't going to be the answer for everyone.

To add: Last gen I calculated the average yearly purchase rate for a console owner to be around 5 games per year. Now adjust that how you will to come up with some number of games purchased by a "hardcore" gamer in a year. Fill those "slots" with games available to Playstation 4 + Xbox One owners in the prior calendar year. Then do the same with the options available to PS4-only and Xbox One-only gamers. How much of a quality drop-off is there between the totality of gaming experiences that could be had with access to exclusives and without if you were to buy the same number of games?
Again, IMO, power has never been the most important factor... this has been proven several times before. The large majority of the gaming market are casual gamers that give little to no fucks about 1080p, 1440p, 4k or watch Digital Foundry videos. If the game is available on the platform, that's the most important thing. Exclusives separate you from the competition, especially if you release several high quality and well reviewed games that a lot of people talk about, on a consistent basis.

Does the quantity of choice matter if you're not interested in all the types? It's like having dinner at a Gourmet Restaurant that specializes in 10,000 different Vegan dishes when one has a taste for Meat and Potatoes. If that's the situation, then one would be better off going to a Steak House instead.
If you personally are not interested in exclusives, then they probably don't matter. But a lot of people have no brand preference and simply play where their friends play. There's a good chance that some of your friends are interested in PS exclusives, and they might choose PS for their games.

When there's a high profile software release, whether it's exclusive or MP, there's always a lot of hype and talk about game X. Just look at Spider-Man and God of War right now... lots of talk and coverage on both games. If game X is only available on one console, that hype may lead people to buy a PS4.

Again, a lot of people downplay the importance of exclusives and having a large and diverse software library because of sales or stats, but I truly believe it is one of the most important factors in a console to give you international appeal and separate yourself from the competition. The overall gaming market cares more about choice and having more available gaming experiences, more so than the relatively minor differences in quality of MP games.
 
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Seriously, I don't hear people complaining about their Laptop power modules, when you have to lug that shit more often than a console.
Huh, don't know where to start, surely its obvious

laptop/phones are portable
consoles aren't

dudes will be complaining more if their phone had an inbuilt powersupply/transformer, we'll be back to having brick phones again (slight exaggeration)

nonmovable objects (tv,console,washing machine/fridge etc) have inbuilt PSU's cause they dont have to keep size/weight down. Having an external PSU for an appliance is just design incompetence thus 99.9% don't
 
Does the quantity of choice matter if you're not interested in all the types?
Of course not if the exclusive offerings aren't to your taste, save I reckon there's a guaranteed psychological impact from the number. I think people will be subconsciously attracted to the console with the larger number of titles when known, and they'd have to consciously investigate if they're any good or not before deciding it was a false value. Like seeing Netflix say, "43 programmes added in the last week," and feeling like that's a win, then checking the list to see it's all Indian and Korean movies.

However, in this specific case we know the range of titles from Sony are quality titles and not just dross (though they are letting through the likes of LoBT so it's not a very well maintained library any more). It's a menu with all the dishes at Café Exbocks plus a large number of rarer dishes like swordfish steak, grilled kangaroo, bacon butties, Vegan pie, month-old sushi, some weird hors d'oeuvres, and a couple of diet-crushing deserts along with some stuff that looks like it's been scraped off the floor. Same with Nintendo. 20 people all with different food preferences are more likely to leave The Greasy PSoon Restaurant satisfied with their options than Café Exbocks at the moment, and that seems to be the reputations for the establishments too.
 
Huh, don't know where to start, surely its obvious

laptop/phones are portable
consoles aren't

dudes will be complaining more if their phone had an inbuilt powersupply/transformer, we'll be back to having brick phones again (slight exaggeration)

nonmovable objects (tv,console,washing machine/fridge etc) have inbuilt PSU's cause they dont have to keep size/weight down. Having an external PSU for an appliance is just design incompetence thus 99.9% don't

Um, I wouldn't consider a console a non-movable object though. A mostly stationary item, probably. My point was, external power supplies aren't inherently bad depending on the device. A common mobile laptop would make more sense on having an internal power supply... but because of size (mostly getting smaller) and thermal requirements (keeping them cooler), an internal power supply is out of the question. A mostly stationary piece of equipment like a gaming console, doesn't really need an internal PSU, IMHO. More than likely, PS4 CPU (and possibly GPU) could have hit similar clocks like XBO, because XBO lacked an internal PSU, which more than likely kept temps down on providing the additional headroom on higher clocks. And lets be honest here, there is a reason why the PS4 can sound like a blow-dryer at times.
 
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Does the quantity of choice matter if you're not interested in all the types? It's like having dinner at a Gourmet Restaurant that specializes in 10,000 different Vegan dishes when one has a taste for Meat and Potatoes. If that's the situation, then one would be better off going to a Steak House instead.
Sure, quantity of the same genre becomes pointless. But quantity of genres, and quality in each genre, and regularly having new games in each genre, adds up quickly. Even in a single genre, some games are loved by some and hated by others. Diversity rules as long as it reaches it's audience. The games must keep coming. That's why the first parties are spread out througout the year, and stay clear of similar third parties or even delayed to fit in a hole in the schedule.

Offering a million different amazing shooters counts as essentially zero games from the point of view of those who don't like shooters. Or sports games, or single player adventures, or racing games.... So all genres must have enough great games to feed everyone. Considering the difficulty of making the best games of one genre, let alone having one for each important genre, let alone new ones every year, they must keep making a lot of games and double down when it sticks, and cancel the ones that don't test well.

I always saw first parties as filling up the void left by third parties who gavitate towards the most profitable genres.

The marketing question is wether it's worth the investment to make a AAA game of a genre that doesn't have a very wide audience. I guess the goal is growing the user base in the long run. It can take a decade for the brand to have enough reputation of delivering good games of a specific genre and shape the user base, then that genre makes money.

Sony gained that trust for single player adventures and relatively "artsy" interractive experiences, they didn't succeed much with shooters. MS continues to be successful with shooters, specially competitive ones, and recently said single player adventures are just not profitable for them (meaning they gave up?). I don't play much shooters anymore, but if the best shooters are supposedly third parties, what's MS plan?

There won't be much movement between console brands if each brand concentrate on the keeping their existing base happy, and neither will grow into a dominant position like the PS2 did.

It'd love playing adventure games with writing as good as TLoU, or TLG, or Horizon, at least once a month. I'm getting about two per year. Because these games take 7 years to make. My opinion about writing quality is not the same as someone else's, so it multiplies the number of games needed by a large margin. We are nowhere near a 10,000 vegan meal buffet.
 
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Again, IMO, power has never been the most important factor... this has been proven several times before. The large majority of the gaming market are casual gamers that give little to no fucks about 1080p, 1440p, 4k or watch Digital Foundry videos. If the game is available on the platform, that's the most important thing. Exclusives separate you from the competition, especially if you release several high quality and well reviewed games that a lot of people talk about, on a consistent basis.


If you personally are not interested in exclusives, then they probably don't matter. But a lot of people have no brand preference and simply play where their friends play. There's a good chance that some of your friends are interested in PS exclusives, and they might choose PS for their games.

When there's a high profile software release, whether it's exclusive or MP, there's always a lot of hype and talk about game X. Just look at Spider-Man and God of War right now... lots of talk and coverage on both games. If game X is only available on one console, that hype may lead people to buy a PS4.

Again, a lot of people downplay the importance of exclusives and having a large and diverse software library because of sales or stats, but I truly believe it is one of the most important factors in a console to give you international appeal and separate yourself from the competition. The overall gaming market cares more about choice and having more available gaming experiences, more so than the relatively minor differences in quality of MP games.

Library is a factor in people's purchasing decision. And an important one for sure. It is not the only factor and the relative importance of each of these factors is going to be different from person to person. It is very hard to evaluate how a group as diverse console-buyers are going to weigh these factors without projecting one's own thought processes onto them. The level of certainty you have on what is proven and known without the support of comprehensive market research to back it up is unwarranted.

Take home is in the list of 'reasons to pick a console,' PS4 ticks the 'more game options' box, but there are many more criteria than that on which consumers make their decision and no one point should be seen as a no brainer, so having the most games doesn't trump having the best quality or having the best movie support.

:yep2:
 
Thing is, they don't need a new console, so it's understandable that they aren't interested in a new contender. Same in Europe on the whole. In the US, there was a market for a clear Americanised console with Americanised IP and Americanised branding, I think, so XB got a foothold.

Oh absolutely. It was just a hypothetical I had of whether the response to a new western console would be better or the same if the Japanese back at the launch of the Xbox was more accepting of western electronics in general than they were back then. And to be honest, it wasn't just western, but non-Japanese electronics in general didn't do well in Japan with a few exceptions. For example, Samsung is doing relatively well there now, while in the early 2000's most Japanese wouldn't have touched anything from Korea with a 10 foot pole.

I could go on for a while about this as there are, of course, many factors involved. Lessening of tariffs making other Asian products more palatable. The stagnant economy combined with rising inflation leading to the proliferation of cheap Chinese food goods in Japan. Another thing that was considered almost anathema in Japan outside of a few specialty import stores back in the early 2000's, but is now commonplace in all their food markets. Heck, they are even importing Korean TV drama's now.

I find the transformation of the Japanese culture in the past 1-2 decades quite fascinating.

Regards,
SB
 
Library is a factor in people's purchasing decision. And an important one for sure. It is not the only factor and the relative importance of each of these factors is going to be different from person to person. It is very hard to evaluate how a group as diverse console-buyers are going to weigh these factors without projecting one's own thought processes onto them. The level of certainty you have on what is proven and known without the support of comprehensive market research to back it up is unwarranted.
I didn't know an opinion required comprehensive market research to back it up. :???:

My level of certainty I have is from following the gaming market closely for the past 15 years. That's enough data for me to be pretty certain of my opinion. But maybe I can at least expand on why I think that exclusives matter more than raw power.

The most powerful console hasn't always been the best selling console, that's a fact.

As far as XB vs PS, XB has generally had more raw power, or has been the more capable console, and also generally cheaper as well; yet PS has sold extremely well internationally, and XB struggles outside of the US/UK. Why do you think that is? What else would make people view PS as a better purchase than XB?

Again, PS has 2 of the top 3 best selling consoles of all time... that's also a fact. PS4 will no doubt pass the PS1 and Wii and PS will hold the top 3 spots.

So why has PS been so successful? What are they known for? They weren't always the most powerful console. They weren't always the cheapest console. But what have they consistently done for all of their consoles, which includes the PS3? They were able to provide a strong 1P software lineup to compliment their strong 3P software lineup, giving them the largest and most diverse software lineup of any other company. They make games that appeal to many different gamers.

The only reason the PS3 sold poorly compared to other PS systems is because Sony, quite frankly, fucked up. They were arrogant and made a complicated HW design, priced it too high and expected everyone to be loyal to their brand. Despite this, they still went on to sell ~85M, which is by no means bad in its own right.

Preferences aside, it's a well known fact that Sony's 1P output has been one of the best in the business, arguably as good as Nintendo's. What separates Sony from Nintendo is 3P support, where Sony is clearly on top. Nintendo's strong 1P output is the biggest reason why people buy Nintendo systems... they provide very good exclusive gaming experiences not available on any other platform. They too sell well internationally. Coincidence?

Furthermore, when it comes to XB/PS anyway, I think the majority of early HW sales are from core gamers, ie the people who give a damn about graphics. Once they saturate the core market, they usually need to reduce the price to get the casual gamers to bite. Once consoles receive price cuts, or specifically reach the sub $300 or $200 marks, that's when sales start to pick up. That's why I feel that the casual gamers make up for a larger portion of sales than core gamers. And I honestly feel that casual gamers care less about graphics and more about games.

Tl;dr, that's why I feel that brand presence is the most important factor, followed by price, then power. You need high quality exclusive gaming experiences or a diverse software library to appeal to many gamers internationally and choose your system over the competition. You need your console to be priced low enough to reach out to casual gamers. You need decent hardware to make your system appealing to core gamers. The latter two are kind of a balancing act. I feel like Sony have done an excellent job of balancing all 3 with the PS1, PS2 and PS4. PS3 they failed on pricing.

I feel that Nintendo has generally been good at achieving 1 and 2, while MS has generally been good at achieving 2 and 3.
 
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The idea that Japan prefers japanese products, and shuns western ones, is brought up often, but the sales figures don't support that theory. Sony and nintendo sell very well all over the world. MS is selling well only in US/UK. And apple sells very well in japan.

The only correllation is that americans buy american consoles more than any other countries. I.e. the sales imbalance is in the US, not in japan. I think games genres discrepancies and cultural preferences in the US/UK explains it more than national pride.

If you had lived there for the past 40+ years the changes in consumer buying habits and acceptance of non-Japanese products is quite evident.

Another example is the iPod. It exploded in popularity in virtually every country in the world, so much that digital music became synonymous with the iPod. Out of all the first world countries, Japan was an outlier. Despite how hard Apple tried, it could not get the Japanese to accept much less embrace the iPod. As such rather than MP3s and whatever it was Apple used becoming the dominant portable music format over time, Sony's MiniDisc format was what the Japanese choose en masse for portable consumption of music. A format that basically failed outside of Japan.

They have since transitioned away from the MiniDisc and joined the rest of the world in embracing the current digital music standards.

Smartphones marked a significant inflection point in Japan for non-Japanese electronics. Smartphones have allowed companies like Apple, Samsung, LG, and the various Chinese phone makers to flourish in Japan which in turn has driving adoption in other electronic markets (TV's, Rice Cookers, Fans, Air Conditioners, etc.). At the start of the 2000's it was almost unthinkable for a Japanese to buy non-Japanese electronics outside of certain niche high end products (High end stereo equipment, for example, had limited penetration in the market).

You can also see the transition in the automotive industry. At the start of the 2000's BMW and Mercedes were rare as the affluent looked won upon them as undesirable and most would not even look at them. Now? BMW and Mercedes have gained a very strong foothold there.

How a non-Japanese product does outside of Japan until relatively recently has had negligible impact on how well it would do in Japan.

Which all comes back around to the Xbox One. Currently it offers less for the Japanese market than the Xbox or X360 having fewer Japanese exclusives. To have a chance it would need to offer at least the same or better quality of experience (in this case games tailored to the market). It also isn't significantly cheaper than the Japanese competition which is another thing that is almost required in order for non-Japanese electronics to find acceptance there.

Both of those were key in non-Japanese electronics gaining acceptance in the market. That and Japanese sentiment towards outsiders and outside products changing with it. Just think about it for a moment. For most of the past century non-Japanese-Asian countries were either hated or considered sub-human (these feelings were still very prominent in Japan in the 2000's but has grown significantly less in the 2010's). As younger generations slowly supplant older generations that also is changing, and with it, how they the view products from those countries.

The US enjoyed a different reputation with them (supplanting the oppressive Warlord driven regime due to WW2 and then the efforts in helping Japan recover from the war endeared them to the average Japanese citizen of the time, it breaks my heart to see some of things currently being done to undermine the closeness of the two countries). However, even that wasn't enough to get US products accepted there outside of niche nostalgia or pop culture items. Marlboro was able to capitalize on that US mystique, but not other cigarette brands. Levi's were hugely popular but not other US jean brands. Hell, 50's US music was hugely popular in Japan even through the late 80s.

Europe also enjoyed favorable mindshare to a similar if lesser extent as the US in Japan through most of that period. That balance is changing, however, due to some unfortunately political grand standing coming out of the US.

Japanese culture is littered with quirky examples of certain western products succeeding due to having pop culture status, while the vast majority of products of similar or better quality absolutely failed due to not attaining pop culture status.

Again, that is all changing as mundane non-Japanese products increasing gain acceptance. This process has grown exponentially in the past few years.

Regards,
SB
 
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The idea that Japan prefers japanese products, and shuns western ones, is brought up often, but the sales figures don't support that theory. Sony and nintendo sell very well all over the world. MS is selling well only in US/UK. And apple sells very well in japan.

The only correllation is that americans buy american consoles more than any other countries. I.e. the sales imbalance is in the US, not in japan. I think games genres discrepancies and cultural preferences in the US/UK explains it more than national pride.
Like all things I’m sure there are some die hard Xbox Japanese gamers in Japan. Which is normal. I mean, just going through Tokyo you see all sorts of foreign food adjusted for Japanese tastes and they are delicious. They are very rapidly able to apply their dedication and hard work and take a foreign dish and make it their own.

So I don’t doubt that they have their Xbox fans there, but I think the “flavour” is still very American and if they could make a Japanese flavour of Xbox perhaps that’s their entry method. Right now, MS seems lost here.

As per Buddha’s note, we do see a lot more foreign influence in japan. Thinking about initial D, and how Takumi hates how his GF visits the Benz Driver!
 
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