Console design and manufacturing comparison - effective cooling yada yada *spawn

[BRiT]

There are plenty of alternative replacement drive mechanics that work with the PS3, you just need to swap the drive's logic board. And this also seems to be the case for the PS4. Perhaps you should fact check your posts.

edit: and the same for Xbox One.

You can also swap out the dvd drive in x360 if you reflash the firmware on the new drive with the old drives key.

 

[Rikimaru]

We were talking about modular design, remember? How would you make replacing logic board easy for consumer?

Reflashing the drive is ridiculous. Also they are now write protected.

 

[BRiT]

Yeah, they dont have things currently setup for easy user servicable parts.

 

[dobwal]

You can not replace whole drive on either console because of security measures.
PS4 CUH-1200 drive has only mechanical parts though. And average man would break zif connector immediately

And thats all in the nature of the design. Outside of the HDD, the PS4 wasn't designed for user friendly replaceable parts but that doesn't mean Sony can't/couldn't design its console to be more modular and allow for such use.

The current designs aren't the product of some tech limitation that makes modular design impossible or impractical. More than likely its the cost and the ability to recoup the costs of that added functionality from consumers that makes such designs impractical.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

We were talking about modular design, remember? How would you make replacing logic board easy for consumer?

Teach them to read. It's not a complicated process, just a delicate process that takes a little time.

 

[Rikimaru]

And thats all in the nature of the design. Outside of the HDD, the PS4 wasn't designed for user friendly replaceable parts but that doesn't mean Sony can't/couldn't design its console to be more modular and allow for such use.

All parts are user friendly replaceable as they could be. There are only 4 replaceable parts anyway: PSU (first thing you see when opening PS4), FAN, laser (and other drive assembly) and HDD.
I changed PS3 laser very easily.
Wii laser on other hand is pretty hard to replace. I did not bother.
360 and xone have clips which are very hard to open. And dreaded X clip on APU so you can destroy MB trying to reapply thermal paste.

 

[dobwal]

All parts are user friendly replaceable as they could be. There are only 4 replaceable parts anyway: PSU, FAN, laser (and other drive assembly) and HDD.
I changed PS3 laser very easily.
Wii laser on other hand is pretty hard to replace. I did not bother.
360 and xone have clips which are very hard to open. And dreaded X clip on APU so you can destroy MB by reapplying thermal paste.

You can. My father can easily replace a transmission or swap out a motor but that doesn't mean its user friendly do so.

I routinely change the oil in my truck, which is a matter of unscrewing a bolt, draining the oil, replacing an oil filter (which is simply screwed on or off) and pouring in new oil, but most people need a mechanic for something that seems relatively simple for any one who does it themselves.

 

[Rikimaru]

You can. My father can easily replace a transmission or swap out a motor but that doesn't mean its user friendly do so.

I can change my oil on my truck, which is a matter of unscrewing a bolt, draining the oil and replacing an oil filter (which is simply screwed on or off), but most people need a mechanic for something that seems simple for any one who does it.

Which consumer electronics have easily replaceable internal parts?
If I'm not mistaken you need to unscrew 6 screws to replace PSU on PS4.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

You can not replace whole drive on either console because of security measures.

In my scenario, the components would be replaced with official parts. PS4 drive fails? Sony sends a replacement drive module for you to swap in.

 

[dobwal]

Which consumer electronics have easily replaceable internal parts?
If I'm not mistaken you need to unscrew 6 screws to replace PSU on PS4.

Thats the point, consoles aren't really designed to be that way. Its one thing to ask a user to replace a hot swappable DVD drive out a laptop, its another to ask them to break out the screw driver and replace a drive requiring them to open the case.

Swappable components only really make sense if your average user has no problem doing it.

 

[eastmen]

In this picture, it looks like there is heat sink compound coupling the entry capacitor to the hot mosfets. Maybe I don't see it correctly, but the heat source still touches the only component which degrades over time from heat since the top heat sink (not shown) is basically coupling everything together indiscriminately.

Mosfets can tolerate up to 175C without degrading.
Capacitors only tolerate 85C or 105C and degrade with heat before that.

The ps4 power supply layout have the caps well spaced from the mosfets, with the air going through laterally so that each component gets cooled individually. This allows the mosfets to be operating hotter (because they can) and the caps to be colder (because they must), essentially the caps are the same temperature as the controlled air (which the ps4 monitors) and this remains constant.

Yes but its cooling it with heated air from the APU . This is bringing in fresh air from its surroundings.

THe video posted shows the one and it seems to target the components very nicely. It even seems to have a battery backup inside of it to further help protect with surges.

 

[MrFox]

Yes but its cooling it with heated air from the APU . This is bringing in fresh air from its surroundings.

THe video posted shows the one and it seems to target the components very nicely. It even seems to have a battery backup inside of it to further help protect with surges.

A little colder air is equivalent to more warmer air. PS4 regulates the air temperature.

There is no battery in there. That's not how surge suppression works.

 

[iroboto]

A little colder air is equivalent to more warmer air. PS4 regulates the air temperature.

There is no battery in there. That's not how surge suppression works.

Those are capacitors that I think he's referring to

 

[Rikimaru]

In my scenario, the components would be replaced with official parts. PS4 drive fails? Sony sends a replacement drive module for you to swap in.

Drive module needs to be remarried with mb with special equipment.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Drive module needs to be remarried with mb with special equipment.

Why not design it with a standard SATA connector?

 

[Rikimaru]

Why not design it with a standard SATA connector?

Interface is a sata, but you need to remarry drive to motherboard anyway.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

You lost me. What's stopping Sony or anyone else designing a unit that can be slipped out and in, like any removal drive bay? I'm not talking about the existing PS4 design, but a theoretical console design where several components (HDD, optical, PSU) are supplied in discrete, interchangeable units, making replacement as easy as replacing batteries or a SIM card. It'd add a little bulk to the unit and cost per item, so may not be the best idea, but it's surely possible and not difficult for either the engineers to design or the home user to use.

 

[Rikimaru]

You lost me. What's stopping Sony or anyone else designing a unit that can be slipped out and in, like any removal drive bay? I'm not talking about the existing PS4 design, but a theoretical console design where several components (HDD, optical, PSU) are supplied in discrete, interchangeable units, making replacement as easy as replacing batteries or a SIM card. It'd add a little bulk to the unit and cost per item, so may not be the best idea, but it's surely possible and not difficult for either the engineers to design or the home user to use.

Unique key have to be flashed by authorized personnel to prevent drive hacking and traffic sniffing.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Unique key have to be flashed by authorized personnel to prevent drive hacking and traffic sniffing.

Then you remove that from the drive and tie it to a chip on he motherboard; t's not an insurmountable problem. This has the added advantage that data is only decrypted on the motherboard rather than before the time is flows out the data bus from the drive where it can easily be intercepted in the clear.

 

[MrFox]

Maybe it's to keep the copy protection tamper proof? BD copy protection is relying on the integrity of the analog BDID which can be read but can't be physically replicated. This can't work with a rogue BD drive cheating the reading of this section of the disc, so the drive itself would have to be authenticated.