Business Approach Comparison Sony PS4 and Microsoft Xbox

[Bagel seed]

Yup, I know about those features. Which ones wouldn't PSEye 2.0 be able to do to some degree?

I'm not saying it could beat Kinect 2.0 at those things, or do everything it can. Just enough to get a baseline support of waggle gesture tracking stuff without even coming close to breaking the bank at all.

 

[warb]

Kinect works in the dark.

 

[patsu]

Set your sights a little higher. Check out the Wired video showing the more interesting possibilities...

http://video.wired.com/watch/new-xbox-kinect-exclusive-wired-video-398878

Tommy McClain

That looks great. Glad they use a high res camera.

I suspect the most common use cases are the hand gestures and voice commands. The skeleton tracking can be faked or 2D for gaming usually. Microsoft probably want to reserve their most amazing stuff for E3. So we will probably see more Kinect 2.0 use there (beyond TV stuff).

 

[ERP]

Kinect is far more capable than a stereo camera.
The question is how much of that additional functionality improves the user experience.

Things like swipes and pointing are relatively easy.
Skeletal tracking is probably impractical, but how much will it be used?
You certainly won't be able to reconstruct the depth image with anything like the same fidelity.

Being able to function in 0 light conditions is also a win IMO.

 

[patsu]

I think people may be interested in environment scanning, and other sorts of scanning.

I realized that motion gaming is too tiring for me. Good for workout time, but not so interested if I arrive home exhausted. The kid already wear me out everyday. ^_^

 

[MrFox]

Being able to function in 0 light conditions is also a win IMO.

Well, PSEye is sensitive enough to work with only the light from the TV, it makes for very few use cases where you are in total darkness, the TV is OFF, and you want to wave you arms around to swipe at a screen that is off. The next one is supposed to be even more sensitive.

 

[Bagel seed]

Holy shit, what about using Kinect in a sensory deprivation tank with Oculus Rift? Flying through and manipulating other dimensions like a god

 

[Brad Grenz]

I'm going with the camera that can't see my junk through my pants in a pitch black room like a TSA agent.

 

[(((interference)))]

I'm going with the camera that can't see my junk through my pants in a pitch black room like a TSA agent.

Hey, that's a great idea for a Xbox One app: Kinect X-Ray Vision :smile:
See through the tops of girls at parties lol

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Would this be the appropriate place to voice some concerns over MS rumoured used games treatment and ask some opinions?

If you want to discuss how it'll affect the platform perceptions and sales, yes. If you want to discuss what MS is doing, start a new thread (I think all the old discussions on this moved to the RSPCA forum).

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Why do you think the PS4 has much less silicon than XB1? XB1 has 50-60 mm^2 worth of SRAM, the PS4 has 6 CUs more (the difference between a Pitcairn and a Bonaire is 50mm^2). I'd expect the size of the two APUs to be within 10% of each other.

Ah, that's the importnat info. I didn't know how big the CUs were, and forgot SRAM is far more dense than logic. So all in all, you make good points and I doubt PS4 has a BOM advantage.

 

[ninzel]

If you want to discuss how it'll affect the platform perceptions and sales, yes. If you want to discuss what MS is doing, start a new thread (I think all the old discussions on this moved to the RSPCA forum).

Ok well how do people feel about the idea that once you give up the disk you loose the right to play the game.
The current business model is one thats seems pretty clear and follows the current free market one where the disk holds not only data but implies ownership.
Now I am just just trying to focus on some confusing rumours but it is all we have at this point. The future we seem to be moving to is one where the disk itself becomes less relevant in terms of ownership.
The rumours suggest that if you buy a games then transfer it, the next person takes the disk but still has to pay full price for a new licence to play the game like two new games.
So if GETTING a disk does not automatically GRANT you ownership why should GIVING up the disk cause you to LOOSE the ownership to play the game.
It would seem MS is trying to create a very one sided bargain with the consumer whee on one hand the disk is not important when it serves them but it is important when it serves them.
THis lack of clarity will hurt them if they don't clear it up by the time of launch.
So far it seems that the rumours suggest a very unfair one sided agreement with the consumer.
The second part is about the value of a used game. People like the free market system where they determine the value of the game.
If each person has to pay full price for the games MS is trying to create artificial value. I don't think consumers would have a problem with MS or pubs getting a cut of used games in the future but they still will want to determine value. So for example right now if I walk into a game store I can pick up Halo4 for $30. Right now all of it goes to EB. I don't mind if in the future I would instead pay EB $15 to EB and pay another $15 for a license to play it and it goes to MS.
I think consumers will be fine in that kind of scenario but creating artificial value and taking that out the hands of the consumer will cause a string backlash.

 

[Strange]

If its not mandatory then it must not add any intrinsic value to the day to day operation of the console. If it doesn't do that, why bundle it? Its not like it can provide Kinect feature parity on multi-platform titles. (at least from what we have seen of its tech so far, compared to the new Kinect)

Sony's better off going all in on mandatory PSEye integration or put the money in the bank, or take it off MSRP.

A controller isn't mandatory for 360 or PS3 to function (remote control and kinect) but they're still bundled.

 

[dragonelite]

Horror genres could use the heartbeat sensor data for some cool gameplay even.
Like levels having trigger points and your heartbeat will be the vital data point to determine what event triggers.

 

[warb]

Kinect working with the same far better precision in all and changing lighting conditions is big relative advantage for any body tracking stuff.

Horror genres could use the heartbeat sensor data for some cool gameplay even.
Like levels having trigger points and your heartbeat will be the vital data point to determine what event triggers.

Lke the Resident Evil zombie jumps out of the wardrobe to scare you to death, only when they have your attention and you're not expecting it? Or it doesn't jump out if you're in danger of having a heart attack, calls an ambulance.

 

[Arwin]

Kinect and PS Eye 2 definitely do overlap, but both have features the other can't do. Personally I think right now I am more convinced by Kinect as a usuable extension of control inputs. It is far more advanced at reliably isolating and tracking a human being, and it is clearly capable of doing so very well. Being able to do so in all lighting conditions including no light at all makes it a very reliable, stable solution.

If PS Eye were modified so that the lenses don't have an IR filter, but the IR is filtered in software, they could achieve good results as well, though that would require more calculations / horsepower to do lag-free. But I strongly doubt they have this solution, or we would already have known about it.

Of course, the PS Eye should be able to give a better Stereo 3D image of what is actually visible, by virtue of seeing slightly more like humans do. And this should work more easily with Stereo 3D TVs as well. I also think it should be able to more accurately render a 3D object just by holding it up to the screen (assuming moderate to good lighting conditions).

However in terms of body tracking it will need Move to do a decent and reliable job, though having a stereo image should really help isolate things from the background, especially when moving - but that will take a lot more processing power than the Kinect solution, and be much less reliable due to changing lighting conditions. When combined with Move controllers however, it should perform quite well (better in arms/hands, weaker in legs).

Much of their relative success will also be due to how well the SDK and OS takes them in, and what applications will be supported for them.

Personally, traditionally a big fan of the Sony platform, I think that the new Kinect has great potential to reach a much bigger market share.

 

[expletive]

A controller isn't mandatory for 360 or PS3 to function (remote control and kinect) but they're still bundled.

Please, try selling a game console without a game controller.

 

[Cranky]

Interesting views are coming in about MS' entertainment plays. The media and forumites really seem to be focusing cable being outdated and cord-cutting. What boggles my mind is that these folks inability to project the inherent capabilities of the Xbone forward to alternative media sources. Sure they are focusing on the current dominant paradigm. however, I fail to see how that limits them going forward when the same infrastructure can be applied to any future entertainment delivery systems/

 

[Strange]

Please, try selling a game console without a game controller.

My point is stuff being bundled doesn't automatically qualify them as either being mandatory for it to function or being totally useless and no devs will use it.

The original question was the following.

Any word on whether it is mandatory or optional for the console to function?

 

[Billy Idol]

After the MS reveal, I have the following impression: it seems to me that MS aim for 'higher' goals.

It seems that they don't even see SONY as a real opponent anymore...SONY just does games, that is not enough, SONY can fight with NINTENDO.

I guess MS turn towards the big fishes out there: Apple, Google,...they are the one to beat in the long run to take over the living room.

MS entered the heavy weight league after having some fun with the cruiser weights.