Business Approach Comparison Sony PS4 and Microsoft Xbox

[Shortbread]

hah ok. Console wars

good luck with that.

Don't take things so personal... both systems are middle aged PCs in my book.

Anyhow, XB1 December NPD numbers might surpass PS4 (North America) because Sony was supply limited for weeks after it's initial launch, most retailers didn't receive anything significant until the second week of December. It's January and beyond that's going to be interesting.

 

[Tap In]

Don't take things so personal... both systems are middle aged PCs in my book.

Anyhow, XB1 December NPD numbers might surpass PS4 (North America) because Sony was supply limited for weeks after it's initial launch, most retailers didn't receive anything significant until the second week of December. It's January and beyond that's going to be interesting.

. Not taking anything personal thanks... Just having a laugh at the attempts to try to prove failure for Xbox and win for Sony in first month Lol

 

[djskribbles]

From my end, it does look like you're taking it a bit personal. Shortbread made it clear that he doesn't think the XB1 is a failure... just that sales are slowing. From anecdotal evidence, that seems to be the case. Plus he has access to sales data from Gametop and BB in the US AFAIK.

The Xbox One should do well in the US in December. January and beyond is when things start to get interesting.

 

[Tap In]

From my end, it does look you're taking it personal. Shortbread made it clear that he doesn't think the XB1 is a failure... just that sales are slowing. From anecdotal evidence, that seems to be the case. Plus he has access to sales data from Gametop and BB in the US AFAIK.

gimme a break. I already said above I expect a 75%-80 of sonys sales by end of year two.

to take something personal I'd have to be personally invested. Which I am most definitely not.

some people are going out of their way to create, find or present "evidence" that Xbox is not selling. It is straight up console war nonsense. It is imo done to detract from Xbox sales that many people thought the Xbox would never have going into November. They are shocked it is selling so well by comparison to expectation of failure (see November sales reports) And appear to be trying way too hard. And its funny and a little ridiculous to watch in here.

its supposed to be a business strategy thread. Not a console war (sales-age rumor) thread

 

[Shortbread]

gimme a break. I already said above I expect a 75%-80 of sonys sales by end of year two.

to take something personal I'd have to be personally invested. Which I am most definitely not.

some people are going out of their way to create, find or present "evidence" that Xbox is not selling. It is straight up console war nonsense. It is imo done to detract from Xbox sales that many people thought the Xbox would never have going into November. They are shocked it is selling so well by comparison to expectation of failure (see November sales reports) And appear to be trying way too hard. And its funny and a little ridiculous to watch in here.

its supposed to be a business strategy thread. Not a console war (sales-age rumor) thread

Sorry, if my intent wasn't clear enough. XB1 is making numbers (sales), and will continue to do so, however the demand for it has tapered off, compared to the initial demand during its launch period. Hence the more than normal available units now, compared to then. Anyhow, I'm more of PC snob by nature of wanting the best technology... but I do enjoy console gaming as well, very much so. :smile:

Business strategy thread - would/should include sales, on trying to validate that a strategy is working or not. And how to improve it, if it's not working.

 

[RudeCurve]

Or demand is the same but MS has ramped up supply...glass is half full...

 

[Shortbread]

Or demand is the same but MS has ramped up supply...glass is half full...

How can I put it in simpler terms, the demand is still there for those who want it, but the demand overall has tapered off quite a bit. From what I know, between BB/GS sales of XB1 have slumped a bit 30% overall (GS 28.7% and BB 31.3%). This isn't bad news, it's just the initial "Hardcore Gamer" and "Joe who loves new technology" phase has tapered down/off, and that the casual buyers should be sustaining growth as time goes on. As for the magic ramp up notion, not happening for either side, since retailers are either placing the same amount of orders (knowing the availability), and reducing RSO's if not needed.

 

[-tkf-]

hah ok. Console wars

good luck with that.

Exactly, a console war is what we are seeing right now, and if someone provides real numbers from the battlefield it's pretty interesting for us. For the past many years we have had no problem discussing the former war and numbers, why stop now.

The numbers are early, nothing is decided yet, at all, but what is Microsoft going to do if these numbers hold true. It's their strongest market, if that is showing weakness then what about the rest of the world. Sony was very swift with the PS3 will Microsoft do something similar or do they have another plan ready.. I find this very interesting..

 

[bkilian]

How can I put it in simpler terms, the demand is still there for those who want it, but the demand overall has tapered off quite a bit. From what I know, between BB/GS sales of XB1 have slumped a bit 30% overall (GS 28.7% and BB 31.3%). This isn't bad news, it's just the initial "Hardcore Gamer" and "Joe who loves new technology" phase has tapered down/off, and that the casual buyers should be sustaining growth as time goes on. As for the magic ramp up notion, not happening for either side, since retailers are either placing the same amount of orders (knowing the availability), and reducing RSO's if not needed.

Why are people surprised that sales have slowed after the silly consumer season? Sales for January are _always_ significantly lower than December...

 

[joker454]

Exactly, a console war is what we are seeing right now, and if someone provides real numbers from the battlefield it's pretty interesting for us. For the past many years we have had no problem discussing the former war and numbers, why stop now.

The numbers are early, nothing is decided yet, at all, but what is Microsoft going to do if these numbers hold true. It's their strongest market, if that is showing weakness then what about the rest of the world. Sony was very swift with the PS3 will Microsoft do something similar or do they have another plan ready.. I find this very interesting..

Going by their history, it seems like Microsoft would sooner throw in a bundled game or two rather than cut the price.

 

[wco81]

I think for them to consider a SKU without Kinect, it would depend on how many Kinect components they ordered or have in the supply chain.

They wouldn't consider it until they've exhausted all the components they've committed to.

It may be that their roadmap is to produce the current configuration until they have some major cost reductions planned, like die shrinks and expected drops in things like Blu-Ray drives, hard drives, HDD controller, RAM, etc.

As much as it may make sense, if they came out with such a SKU, it could be a desperation, last-resort type of move.

So they may be willing to accept a certain amount of share as long as they can still sell what they consider is a good number of the current configuration.

If the ratio becomes one-sided against them, they may bail but if it's like 20-30 % less, they may bite the bullet.

 

[Xalion]

I don't think Microsoft has anything to gain by removing Kinect. It is one of their few distinguishing features. Eventually, prices will come down and they will be able to price equivalently with the PS4. Right now I believe a far better option for them would be working to get exclusives from some big name franchises. Even if they have to "pay" for them. It will be a far smaller loss than trying to cut Kinect out entirely, and give their consoles something to lean on even with the increased price.

 

[blakjedi]

Kinect is part of the chipset... Not just the camera device. To make it worth while they would also have to remove the circuitry on the Durango chipset... And for what? To make it a PS4? PS4 has the luxury of extra CUs to do gpgpu computing necessary for PS Camera duties. The Xbox has no such luxury.

 

[wco81]

To cut the price.

Price would probably have more to do with any sales slippage than whether it had the camera or whether it was perceived as having slightly inferior graphics.

A performance delta of 20-30% is not something many people will care about. If it was perceived as 1/2 as good, that might be one thing.

 

[Tap In]

ahh I see now, people want sales to be low so they hope that ms drops kinect so they can say "see I told you it was a mistake".


Not gonna happen. as said above, they will bundle bundle bundle and Kinect is here to stay

from my 5 weeks with Kinect, I believe it (and the OS) is for real and will be proven over time to be desirable product

 

[scooby_dooby]

ahh I see now, people want sales to be low so they hope that ms drops kinect so they can say "see I told you it was a mistake".


Not gonna happen. as said above, they will bundle bundle bundle and Kinect is here to stay

from my 5 weeks with Kinect, I believe it (and the OS) is for real and will be proven over time to be desirable product

I used it to turn my xbox off about 3 times, till I got bored with the novelty, and really haven't noticed it at all for the last 4 weeks.

I remain utterly unconvinced. MS seems to have this vision, that if only they include Kinect in 100% of boxes, suddenly developers will do all kinds of cool stuff with it. I guess we'll just have to see. Right now, with the exception of a great video chat camera, it's basically as useless as Kinect 1.0 was. Maybe once I get my Cable Box passing through, it will start to show more benefits.

 

[Tap In]

I. Maybe once I get my Cable Box passing through, it will start to show more benefits.

yep

tv pass through and watching tv while playing games at same time and controlling the entire entertainment system with voice while you move around the room and do whatever you want is pretty awesome.

and while it may not do anything for you even after connected, you have yet to experience the whole thing .

 

[Rangers]

I think Rangers is on to something, but the war isn't over, i am certain Microsoft will buy their way back if they are losing, that is how they do business.

Yes, and as a practical matter I think it's hard to lose a douopoly.

If either side starts to slip to the point losing third party support becomes a possibility, they will take drastic measures. They have to.

Realistically a 1/3-2/3 market split is probably the worst that can happen for any side. In other words 33% of the market is probably X1's realistic floor. That's probably something like the point where the install base cant be ignored by third parties. So you could clearly "lose" a generation, yet still have a healthy console.

Price would probably have more to do with any sales slippage than whether it had the camera or whether it was perceived as having slightly inferior graphics.

Yeah, I've agreed with that throughout.

 

[-tkf-]

ahh I see now, people want sales to be low so they hope that ms drops kinect so they can say "see I told you it was a mistake".

Yep everyone in this thread has that as a motivation, they just want them to drop Kinect so it's just console priced similar but less powerful(supposedly) so they can say "HAHA!". Come on, since the introduction of the Kinect the benefits vs the price has been discussed, So of course it's the main subject of any price reduction discussion.

tv pass through

Where it works and for those that actually wants the XB1 to control their TV. You can't sell this feature in many many countries...

and watching tv

For those that actually watch tv while they play, not to mention cable cutters.

while playing games at same time and controlling the entire entertainment system with voice while you move around the room and do whatever you want is pretty awesome.

Of course it's cool, but as said before it totally sucks the few times it doesn't work, the startrek experience has so far NOT been confined. Most here would accept it as is, because we think the technology is pretty amazing. Will the "Joe Average" find it just as great to have his console become the center of his entertainment life.. i doubt it very very much.

As i see it, the "experience" is really not everyones cup of tea, and Microsoft has a giant job in trying to convince the rest of the world that this is it!

 

[-tkf-]

Yes, and as a practical matter I think it's hard to lose a douopoly.

If either side starts to slip to the point losing third party support becomes a possibility, they will take drastic measures. They have to.

Realistically a 1/3-2/3 market split is probably the worst that can happen for any side. In other words 33% of the market is probably X1's realistic floor. That's probably something like the point where the install base cant be ignored by third parties. So you could clearly "lose" a generation, yet still have a healthy console.

Yeah, I've agreed with that throughout.

I doubt it will ever come to that, and i agree that even a small market share, if it's still in the millions will be enough to get support from 3rd parties. Development for both machines should be cheaper than it was for the 360/PS3 thanks to the many similarities. And as Titanfall proved, Microsoft is able to buy the love it needs without relying on it's own gaming division and Sony is not dropping their strong exclusive gaming strategy.