Business Approach Comparison Sony PS4 and Microsoft Xbox

dobwal said:
What was Sony doing last gen? It didn't stripped down the PS3 to provide a core system. Neither did it abandon or stop supporting its non gaming features to appease some who think a console should a one dimensional product.
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The PS3 didn't have any pack-ins that they could have cut. Sony did everything in their power to reduce costs: reducing the chip sizes, reducing the USB ports, shrinking the board, removing backwards compatibility etc., etc. If Sony packed in a camera with the PS3, you can bet your ass they would have cut it if it meant they could cut the price by $100.

The 360 and PS3 weren't considered failures simply because the Wii was selling like gang busters. And the PS3 fortunes didn't turn around simply on a price cut.
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I don't think Sony or MS see Nintendo as a direct competitor anymore. Shuhei Yoshida even defended Nintendo saying that he doesn't think that the Wii U is a failure and that it's just different. He even admitted that he owns one and loves his Wii U.

If MS is serious about gaming its going to have to heavily invest in software. Because games are the biggest factor that influence the success of your platform.
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If they want to go that route, then they need to build their first-party studios, because they're trailing the competition in that regard IMO. It will be harder to secure third-party exclusive software if they're trailing the PS4.
 
dobwal said:
What was Sony doing last gen? It didn't stripped down the PS3 to provide a core system. Neither did it abandon or stop supporting its non gaming features to appease some who think a console should a one dimensional product.
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I really think the issue for MS is price and value. When the PS3 while sold for $499/599, BOM estimates were of around $800. Whether that's accurate or not, there was a perception that you were getting a lot of value for the price.

I don't think that's the case for MS now. I think had MS launched at $349 (or lower), I think don't think the compute power difference would have been as big of an issue and Kinect would have been seen as added value and not added cost.

Whether it's right or wrong, I think the perception of value matters and I think MS is on the wrong side of that right. Hopefully, unlike Nintendo, they'll address that much more quickly if sales do indeed fall off in Jan/Feb.
 
The problem MS has, which everybody is brushing off, is that they still are selling a lot of 360 systems. The multi-SKU nature of that is they have 4 systems costing $199, $299, $299 & $399. Granted there are some discounts that drops those from $25-$100 on some SKUs depending on where you look, but they are not permanent. They seriously can't make any price drops on XB1 until they can drop some 360 SKUs and/or drop prices. Personally I think they would go totally Kinect-less SKUs on 360 before XB1. 4gb 360 without Kinect for $150 & 250gb 360 without Kinect for $250. Then they can drop XB1 down to $400 or $450 with Kinect. They will want to push people who want Kinect to the XB1 where the technology is much better & is worth the premium. But I think they have found that at $500, Kinect is not worth the premium. I know I don't. $400 yeah, but not $500.

Tommy McClain
 
So many people without the device pontificating as to the benefit of its component values ("I'll never use the Kinect") even to point of citing GAF sales figures. I need to stay out of these threads because the assertions some of you are making would be laughable if they weren't so ridiculous. Oooooh ps4 is selling for more on eBay so it MUST be selling better. Or maybe its just supply constrained more than the Xbox one, so instead of trusting a "seller" on eBay I can just go to best buy and actually get one with a warranty.

Pure nonsense in here.
 
bkilian said:
It's not an add on if every single box has it. It's a core feature. Your statement is more accurately "I don't like the fact I'm paying more for a core feature I think I won't use", or perhaps "I don't want to buy a device that doesn't cater to my every whim". Valid concerns, and that's why you have the power to choose where to spend your money.
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It is essentially an add-on, as R.O.B. was to the NES. The XB1 doesn't need Kinect to function - at all. So my point is still valid, it's an add-on. But yes, a general core XB1 would be welcomed in my book.
 
I'd like to see you buy a XB1 & not use Kinect, then see what happens after a week or so when you realize the dashboard is hampered when not using it or you finally get tired of the nag screen saying it's not connected. But then again those that say they would buy the system without one probably never intend to buy one anyway. That might be an interesting public poll to have. I would finally like to call out some trolls when MS finally drops the price or drops Kinect.

Tommy McClain
 
AzBat said:
I'd like to see you buy a XB1 & not use Kinect, then see what happens after a week or so when you realize the dashboard is hampered when not using it or you finally get tired of the nag screen saying it's not connected.
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So Kinect is really needed? I did not know that... I was under the impression it wasn't required, especially in that fashion. :???:
 
It's not required but that doesn't mean you'll have as pleasant an experience without it.
 
Shortbread said:
So Kinect is really needed? I did not know that... I was under the impression it wasn't required, especially in that fashion. :???:
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Check out the rumor thread there are a few posts from users here that said that there a few instances where there are a few actions that don't have a non-Kinect alternative(I think "Xbox Record That" doesn't work). Did a quick Google search & found this...

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427207,00.asp

You're welcome.

Tommy McClain
 
djskribbles said:
The PS3 didn't have any pack-ins that they could have cut. Sony did everything in their power to reduce costs: reducing the chip sizes, reducing the USB ports, shrinking the board, removing backwards compatibility etc., etc. If Sony packed in a camera with the PS3, you can bet your ass they would have cut it if it meant they could cut the price by $100.


I don't think Sony or MS see Nintendo as a direct competitor anymore. Shuhei Yoshida even defended Nintendo saying that he doesn't think that the Wii U is a failure and that it's just different. He even admitted that he owns one and loves his Wii U.


If they want to go that route, then they need to build their first-party studios, because they're trailing the competition in that regard IMO. It will be harder to secure third-party exclusive software if they're trailing the PS4.
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Their cheapest sku was the one they ultimately discontinued first. They could of scrapped the HDMI port, the bluray playback capability, stuck with the cheapest HDDs, gone with a cheaper top loading drive and made the cheapest wifi less sku the standard sku.
 
Only one thing has consistently sold systems for the past 30 years: games. Let's wait for a few exclusive titles to drop before talking about price cuts.
 
AzBat said:
I'd like to see you buy a XB1 & not use Kinect, then see what happens after a week or so when you realize the dashboard is hampered when not using it or you finally get tired of the nag screen saying it's not connected. But then again those that say they would buy the system without one probably never intend to buy one anyway. That might be an interesting public poll to have. I would finally like to call out some trolls when MS finally drops the price or drops Kinect.

Tommy McClain
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Ehmm then it would be because Microsoft isn't able to design a UI that works without a Kinect, which we all know isn't true. As for the record option, that should be doable with a button combination or other work arounds, just because you don't have a $100 microphone listening in it should still not be a problem.

Microsoft didn't really make it easy for themselves, they went into this round with a vision, Sony had a vision with the PS3 as well, remember that. Sony did it riding on the PS2 and Microsoft did it riding on the success on the 360. The PS3 taught us that people don't really give a shit about something they don't think they need, the PS3 was amazing value for... for me, i got a Blu-Ray player, Card Reader, wireless chargeable controllers, built in BlueTooth support for my headset and a PS2.

However, i was the core, the rest looked at it and said, 600 dollars for a console.. why? It took Sony many years, price drops and feature adding before the PS3 was worth the money. Sony learned the lesson, Microsoft might not have.

I think Rangers is on to something, but the war isn't over, i am certain Microsoft will buy their way back if they are losing, that is how they do business.
 
-tkf- said:
Ehmm then it would be because Microsoft isn't able to design a UI that works without a Kinect, which we all know isn't true. As for the record option, that should be doable with a button combination or other work arounds, just because you don't have a $100 microphone listening in it should still not be a problem.

Microsoft didn't really make it easy for themselves, they went into this round with a vision, Sony had a vision with the PS3 as well, remember that. Sony did it riding on the PS2 and Microsoft did it riding on the success on the 360. The PS3 taught us that people don't really give a shit about something they don't think they need, the PS3 was amazing value for... for me, i got a Blu-Ray player, Card Reader, wireless chargeable controllers, built in BlueTooth support for my headset and a PS2.

However, i was the core, the rest looked at it and said, 600 dollars for a console.. why? It took Sony many years, price drops and feature adding before the PS3 was worth the money. Sony learned the lesson, Microsoft might not have.

I think Rangers is on to something, but the war isn't over, i am certain Microsoft will buy their way back if they are losing, that is how they do business.
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I agree with Rangers too. MS made miscalculations: $500 being one. Problem is it's hard to turn a bus around when you're going 80mph down the Freeway. I was surprised they got the always on DRM design replaced in time. They may still correct problems with depending on Kinect too much, but it takes time. Time they really didn't have before launch. We'll see what happens in February after NPD results. I think that will give them a better idea on how to proceed. Personally I don't want them to concede a non-Kinect SKU, but I would definitely understand if they did. Man at the storm that will create if they do. A bunch of "I told you so" across the Internet. I think if they can wait until E3 or later for a $100 price drop it will be better than dropping Kinect.

Tommy McClain
 
MS store always has good deals and not just X1 stuff. I've purchased stuff from there a few times. That doesn't mean there's less demand for the console. Also the bundles aren't really discounted at all since they're selling you an extended warranty that many people don't actually want. Personally I wouldn't buy any of those bundles because I never buy extended warranties.
 
Tap In said:
or we could say what a great job at supply ms has done compared to past years and competitors.

to act like this thing is failing?.... please lol that would be foolish
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Who said anything about failing? I said slowed down, which demand has. The truth of the matter XB1 sales between GameStop and BestBuy are down by 30%... this downward trend started days before Christmas, and probably will continue. As for PS4, no change at all, other than an increase in demand.

As an FYI, before anyone saids you have no access or links between GameStop or BestBuy, please read my previous sales post, and you will see I'm on the level and that my numbers months before actually came about.
 
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