AMD: Southern Islands (7*** series) Speculation/ Rumour Thread

2560 is going be a problem for the 1GB ram of 5870. @1920 the gains from 5870 to 7970 and from GTX 285 to GTX 480 are fairly similar, which supports his notion that nVidia paid the compute penalty with Fermi already and that AMD is now paying it. That comparison is unfair anyway with AMD having a refresh in the middle, whereas with nVidia the starting point GTX 285 was the refresh and 480 had quite a bit of problems getting its potential out.

I'm not really sure if 2560 is really a RAM problem since most of those games are old, but yeah I tend to agree overall with the RAM thing.

GTX 285 was already a compute focused architecture, was it not? When they went to 1D ALU's was when I considered it. 285 to 480 was compute>>compute imo. I am sure there were plenty of changes and optimizations along the way but so where there from evergreen to caymen, or from any GPU to next. All these GPU's had HUGE dies for Nvidia and discussion at the time if Nvidia had focused too much on compute creating a lot of bloat for gaming performance.

The comparison wasn't unfair at all, as his assertion of a compute penalty being paid was proven unlikely by comparing a compute to a non compute arch, where the scaling was fine. He compared 7970 to a different arch, but the variable clearly wasnt necessarily compute.

As for the last part, huh? if anything the 285>480 transition would be more apt, since it was a refresh>new arch, like caymen>SI.




Expect the Cayman had 22.5% more transistors and slightly higher clocks than the 5870. I think it's a pipe dream to expect a 8xxx revision to double Cayman performance with only 4.3B transistors. That would require over 2X scaling of transistors, which you seemed to think is unlikely. Cayman had 2.64B transistors.

If that is the case it throws the whole "poor scaling" thing even more into question. I was operating on the incorrect assumption that Tahiti=2x transistor of caymen. I was wrong and it's actually 1.63X, which makes trinibwoy's case only look worse. Basically removes it nearly entirely. The scaling according to ever useful tech power up charts is tahiti=1.39X caymen (2GB) performance at 2560. You could probably chalk the other 24 percent up to use of lots of old, non-tesselated games benchmarks and unoptimized tahiti drivers, or close enough. Knowing that in heavy tess games like Crysis 2 Tahiti is 70% faster.


http://ir.amd.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=74093&p=quarterlyearnings

You can check the financial tables from there. Graphics have done ok lately, but is quite small compared to their CPU business in size and profit. Although The APU chips are counted in the CPU business despite containing GPUs. For nVidia the vast majority of revenue comes from GPUs, but you are right that the GPU-business does not look too healthy from looking at their numbers, although the latest year was profitable. Their profits come from the Quadro and Tesla lines of products. This is interesting...



I don't have much else to say to this except I like big silicon :) Performance/size is good but performance alone is far better. Performance/watt is important, but within reason.

I like big silicon too, usually when AMD goes with small dies and performs well, I tend to think "gosh, think what they could have done with a big die!". It seems like missed opportunities. Overall it has worked okay for them though pretty consistently, including seemingly yet again with tahiti. It clearly can help with dual GPU card performance leadership too, for what that's worth, though I think single GPU performance crown is more valuable. Also, it seems to help them get product out faster, which is pretty big. Every day we go without an Nvidia answer to SI is a big win itself. Whether that's because of the small dies or completely unrelated though I dont know.
 
Fudzilla

Of course, for more demanding users Pitcairn cards will be the preferred choice. The HD 7870 and HD 7850 feature a 256-bit memory bus, along with more shaders and higher clocks. They will sell for $299 and $249 respectively.

Hmmm, 7850 would be my price range. A little high in the range really. It better provide a nice punch and improvement on current 249 cards.
 
Quick enough for now ;)
I see he has new AMD GPU Clock Tool, any leaks of it yet?
It also reports vGPU as 1.17V which if real is very little overvoltage for extreme cooling.

According to Muropaketti, Shamino (nor anyone else outside AMD perhaps) has no idea how high the GPU would go - the 1650 was highest the current tools allowed to try
 
You could probably chalk the other 24 percent up to use of lots of old, non-tesselated games benchmarks and unoptimized tahiti drivers, or close enough. Knowing that in heavy tess games like Crysis 2 Tahiti is 70% faster.

Lol, sure if cherry picking is your thing. No need to fabricate numbers, they're right there plain to see.
 
Fudo claims different numbers for 7770/7750.

http://www.fudzilla.com/graphics/item/25363-radeon-hd-7770-brings-28nm-for-$149

"The Radeon HD 7770 is based on the Cape Verde XT chip and it should end up clocked at 900MHz. It has 896 stream processors as well as 56 texture units and 16 ROPs. The memory is clocked at 1375MHz (5.5GHz GDDR5 effective). The runner up is HD 7750 based on Cape Verde PRO, works at 900MHz has 832shaders, 52 TMUs and 16 ROPs. The memory works at 5.0GHz bringing the total possible bandwidth to 80 GB/s for its 1GB of memory. This one will sell for $10 less, or $139."

Fudzilla is refering to these fake numbers AFAIK: LenzFire

896 SPs didn't make sense, because the CUs are most probably a factor of 4 (8/12/16/...) because of SI's design.

12 CUs/768 SPs @ 1000 MHz are quite reasonable if it should be around 6850 (960SPs @ ~800 MHz). But interesting that the narrower memory interface doesn't have a bigger impact (even if clocked higher)

I guess this means 20 CUs max for the 7870 (which would reach 6970 levels @1GHz)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Fudzilla is refering to these fake numbers AFAIK: LenzFire

896 SPs didn't make sense, because the CUs are most probably a factor of 4 (8/12/16/...) because of SI's design.

12 CUs/768 SPs @ 1000 MHz are quite reasonable if it should be around 6850 (960SPs @ ~800 MHz). But interesting that the narrower memory interface doesn't have a bigger impact (even if clocked higher)

it doesnt have to be factor of 4.. i think Demers cleared that at Rage3D review.. additionaly 12CUs vs 8CUs wouldnt make any sense %50 difference between XT and PRO
 
it doesnt have to be factor of 4.. i think Demers cleared that at Rage3D review.. additionaly 12CUs vs 8CUs wouldnt make any sense %50 difference between XT and PRO

Maybe it doesn't have to but IMHO it doesn't make sense to design a chip outside this structure. Maybe the 7750 will have only 10 CUs (2 deactivated) or it will just be clocked lower.
 
Has it been confirmed anywhere wether Tahiti uses the rumored HPL process instead of HP process?
 
Has it been confirmed anywhere wether Tahiti uses the rumored HPL process instead of HP process?
Unlikely, with the clocks it's able to reach.

Does anyone know the default voltage for 7970?

In the massive overclock, it's set to 1.17V.
d5d439dc77fbf2be5c68962f621f11d3.jpg

The same screenshot shows 0.85V as an option. That corresponds to the standard voltage of HP. Of course, that doesn't mean it's the default voltage of 7970.

HPL has 1.0V as standard voltage: http://www.tsmc.com/download/brochures/2011_28 Nanometer Process Technology.pdf
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Now *that's* the card AMD should have released. Stick a new age vapour chamber peltier thing on the card, something like their closed loop water cooling thing with Bulldozer. Ramp up the core and mem and crush the 6990 with it. Sell it for £600. I'd rather pay £600 for something with that spec, than £450 for what we actually got.
 
Now *that's* the card AMD should have released. Stick a new age vapour chamber peltier thing on the card, something like their closed loop water cooling thing with Bulldozer. Ramp up the core and mem and crush the 6990 with it. Sell it for £600. I'd rather pay £600 for something with that spec, than £450 for what we actually got.

You do realize this would probably draw way over 600W, right?
 
over 44% factory OC'd, indeed :runaway:

Also, does Tahiti secretly have 36 CU's after all? 2304 shaders on the "cancelled products" would suggest such
 
Back
Top