AMD Radeon RDNA2 Navi (RX 6500, 6600, 6700, 6800, 6900 XT)

Bondrewd · Aug 4, 2021

Wesker said:
they could've done it with two 2*80WGP Navi 21 chips, no?

Easily.

Pressure · Aug 4, 2021

Ferman said:
2 x NV21 in 400W. It's power limited.

The MPX module power connector alone can supply up to 500 Watt.

Deleted member 13524 · Aug 5, 2021

New Thursday, new drop.

Couldn't get my 6800XT, the moment I got my place in line there were no more of those.

So I very angrily bought a 6900XT.

At least I wasn't scalped... I think..

Malo · Aug 5, 2021

ToTTenTranz said:
New Thursday, new drop.

Couldn't get my 6800XT, the moment I got my place in line there were no more of those.

So I very angrily bought a 6900XT.

At least I wasn't scalped... I think..

Congrats on finally getting a new GPU I guess

Weren't you buying from AMD where the price is MSRP?

CarstenS · Aug 5, 2021

ToTTenTranz said:
New Thursday, new drop.

Couldn't get my 6800XT, the moment I got my place in line there were no more of those.

So I very angrily bought a 6900XT.

At least I wasn't scalped... I think..

That's one way to force an upsell.

Deleted member 13524 · Aug 5, 2021

I think this time they successfully implemented a MAC address filter. I tried opening several browsers in the same device and save for one they would all be put on the end of the line.

What saved me was using all the devices I had with me. I used 1 laptop + 1 tablet + 3 smartphones. The best one appeared with a 6 minute time, at which point they had either a 6700XT for 500€ or a 6900XT for 1000€.

It's definitely not the price I wanted to pay for a graphics card, but I think the window of opportunity to sell my Vega 64 for >500€ and my RX480 for ~180€ is coming to an end. I was most probably not going to be able to buy a 6800XT at MSRP or below anytime soon, either way.

Malo said:
Weren't you buying from AMD where the price is MSRP?

Yes, but the RX6900 XT is hardly worth 1000€ IMO. Though if the "worth" is defined my market prices, I guess for some got a hell of a deal..

CarstenS said:
That's one way to force an upsell.

I suspect there are more 6900XT cards available than 6800XT ones.

Bondrewd · Aug 5, 2021

ToTTenTranz said:
I suspect there are more 6900XT cards available than 6800XT ones.

less demand really

Deleted member 13524 · Aug 5, 2021

Bondrewd said:
less demand really

Yeah... I just wanted to feel better with myself by blaming AMD for my bad luck.

Granath · Aug 6, 2021

This is where most wafers are going.
https://www.hardwaretimes.com/amd-h...ice-as-much-as-sales-of-ryzenradeon-combined/

I wonder, what would be a GPU market share when dGPU are combined with consoles.

DegustatoR · Aug 6, 2021

Granath said:
I wonder, what would be a GPU market share when dGPU are combined with consoles.

Would be pretty similar to when Intel iGPUs are combined with AMD/Nv's dGPUs I'd imagine.
Could be an interesting way of looking at the gaming GPUs market from a game developer point of view.
But also even less relevant than the iGPU+dGPU combination since you can't get or use console GPUs in the same way as PC GPUs, even of the "i" sort.

CarstenS · Aug 6, 2021

Granath said:
This is where most wafers are going.
https://www.hardwaretimes.com/amd-h...ice-as-much-as-sales-of-ryzenradeon-combined/

From what i've seen in the earnings call for Q1/FY2021, Sony expects so sell 14.8M PS5 for the whole fiscal year, not 22M in this very calender year: "Our FY21 forecast remains unchanged from the previous forecast, and there is no change to this fiscal year’s target of selling more than 14.8 million units of PS5™, which was the number of units we sold of PlayStation®4 in the fiscal year after its launch."

Just one TwinScan NXE 3400C used by TSMC can start 170 wafers per hour (with minimum number of exposures (96) at reticle size (26x33mm)). Roughly adjusted for a 308 mm² Oberon SoC (14x22 mm for eases' sake) and 85% usable dies, this single machine alone could produce around 88 Million SoCs per year - or the 14.8 M PS5-SoCs in just 2 months.

Deleted member 90741 · Aug 6, 2021

CarstenS said:
Just one TwinScan NXE 3400C used by TSMC can start 170 wafers per hour (with minimum number of exposures (96) at reticle size (26x33mm)). Roughly adjusted for a 308 mm² Oberon SoC (14x22 mm for eases' sake) and 85% usable dies, this single machine alone could produce around 88 Million SoCs per year - or the 14.8 M PS5-SoCs in just 2 months.

N7 used for PS5 does not use EUV at the moment. So it does not use the NXE3400C. A rumored N6 refresh for PS5 SoC would of course.
Also I am not sure you can count like that, each die will have many layers of DUV and multiple machines need to work to do all the layers
N7 has around 60-75 layers depending on the design.

You have to go by TSMC figures of around 120k wpm output for N7. With your calculation above you can do 120k with single machine which is not the case, they have a lot of machines doing N7 to get that output of 120k wpm.
At the moment AMD should get like >30% share of N7 wafer output from TSMC
For that target number of PS5 AMD would need 10K wpm out of a total allocation of 36k wpm for N7 for AMD from TSMC

Also reason why despite having >20 NXE3400C N5 output was still only ~20kwpm by end of last year

CarstenS · Aug 6, 2021

Modern DUV systems are at >250 wafers per hour, that'd be 142M wafer starts a year with the above formula.
And yes, that's wafer starts, as i've written. Naturally, you'd have to have a production chain in place anyway. And you're right, it's not really fair to calculate it this way.

pharma · Aug 10, 2021

AMD Radeon Pro W6800 Professional Graphics Card Review | KitGuru
August 9, 2021

pharma · Aug 10, 2021

Wesker · Aug 10, 2021

What a disappointment. It’s basically a 5700 XT in performance and die size.

EDIT: and price

Leoneazzurro5 · Aug 10, 2021

Wesker said:
What a disappointment. It’s basically a 5700 XT in performance and die size.

EDIT: and price

Mostly the big issue is the price, being slightly smaller, with a smaller memory bus and with more features it slightly outperforms the 5700XT on the same process and with much lower power consumption. Performance was almost a given, it has 8 less CU and it performs in line with it. Problem is the price: at 379$ it has low value compared to both the 3060 Ti and the 3060 (if we compare the MRSPs only, that is) and for sure a 5700XT user has zero reason to "upgrade". If it was priced 60-80$ lower it would have been a much better proposition. I think it will be a much better proposition in notebooks.

Bondrewd · Aug 10, 2021

Leoneazzurro5 said:
Problem is the price: at 379$ it has low value compared to both the 3060 Ti and the 3060 (if we compare the MRSPs only, that is) and for sure a 5700XT user has zero reason to "upgrade". If it was priced 60-80$ lower it would have been a much better proposition. I think it will be a much better proposition in notebooks.

supply.
AMD is very not interested with anything maybe sorta interfering with H2 Milan ramp.
I.e. no amount of client begging would help.

Deleted member 13524 · Aug 10, 2021

Wesker said:
What a disappointment. It’s basically a 5700 XT in performance and die size.

EDIT: and price

Nah.

Navi 23 vs. Navi 10 is:

- Faster at 1080p and 1440p;
- Slightly smaller
- Consumes >20% less power, so PCB is simpler/cheaper
- Uses half the memory channels, so PCB is simpler/cheaper
- Supports hardware raytracing, VRS, mesh shaders and sampler feedback
- Still uses the same N7 process from TSMC

It's a really big win for AMD IMO, and in normal circumstances it could probably scale down in price immensely.
And in power consumption too, at relatively small performance penalties, which is probably what AMD is doing to get this into laptops.

Bondrewd · Aug 10, 2021

Yeah it's fine.

ToTTenTranz said:
which is probably what AMD is doing to get this into laptops.

Not much designs there due to supply.
Better luck next year aka the N33 ballbuster.

AMD Radeon RDNA2 Navi (RX 6500, 6600, 6700, 6800, 6900 XT)

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