A Generational Leap in Graphics [2020] *Spawn*

Discussion in 'Console Technology' started by chris1515, Dec 19, 2020.

Tags:
  1. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    4,520
    Likes Received:
    2,074
    MM isnt even close to 2077. Cross gen game but still. Maybe the ps5 version but thats a different thing ;)
     
  2. ThePissartist

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2013
    Messages:
    1,987
    Likes Received:
    950
    And yet, even though it's cross-gen, it still has a nicer look to it. Amazing what good art direction can do.

    The reflections also appear better (granted not with a real-time day/night system) than anything else available at the moment.
     
  3. PSman1700

    Veteran Newcomer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2019
    Messages:
    4,520
    Likes Received:
    2,074
    Nah, their not even close. Didnt expect that to happen either :)
     
    pharma likes this.
  4. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    What people like a lot about MM implementation is the fact the raytracing goes further in distance than other implementation for dynamic object too, There is other compromise like resolution or using lower LOD but it is something devs knows seeing gamers reaction to raytracing effect. I am sure we will see the same on future PC title with less compromise than PS5 on more powerful hardware.

    The limitation is visible seeing pedestrians popin inside reflection a few meters from the window if you did not watch the video. This was my main complaint for Watchdog Legions too. This is more annoying than not having reflection inside reflection for example.
     
    ToTTenTranz and ThePissartist like this.
  5. ThePissartist

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2013
    Messages:
    1,987
    Likes Received:
    950
    Looks like a lower quality reflection LOD in Cyberpunk too (presumably with less cutbacks though), the pedestrians aren't shadow casting either.

    Are the reflections the same as the rendering resolution on 2077?
     
  6. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    Raytracing is heavy. They can patch it when there will be more powerful GPU and improve this part. This is why digitalfoundry said this is partially Crysis. You can do tons of thing to improve the raytracing part with more powerful hardware.
     
  7. Silent_Buddha

    Legend

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2007
    Messages:
    17,687
    Likes Received:
    7,681
    Reading through this thread, I get the same feeling as I get with most threads.

    PS5 users - X PS game has the best graphics and is the most next gen looking.
    PC users - X multiplatform game has the best graphics and is the most next gen looking.
    XBS-X/S users - ... Not much yet, will have to wait for a MS exclusive here. :p

    There's some exceptions, but every generation it's always the same. :D

    Regards,
    SB
     
  8. Flappy Pannus

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2016
    Messages:
    145
    Likes Received:
    172
    Why would you not compare the PS5 version considering the hardware you need to CP2077 decently, especially with RT? MM is stunning on the PS5 and is a locked 60 in performance RT.
     
  9. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    Imo I think cross gen make the beginning of generation not so impressive. On consoles Demon's souls remake is impressive as a launch title but Spiderman MM is pretty good but it has some of it roots on PS4 and it is visible. Character model is good and strand hair is an improvement but less impressive than the Frosbite implementation. The RT reflection implementation is good some compromise but I think the choice is probably better than pop in of dynamic object in the reflection imo. The PS5 GPU is equivalent to the less powerful Turing GPU in triangle based RT, this is not a matter of power but of choosing the right compromise.

    Cyberpunk 2077 RT is impressive but assets roots are on old generation consoles.

    I think the better has yet to come. We need a title with where everything will be pushed from geometry details and texture quality with great streaming technology, good usage of hardware accelerated raytracing, good hair technology and so on.

    I think the title will be Battlefield a multiplatform game and I said it as a PS user.



    EDIT: And this is the first time first party have cross gen games too. It does not help the beginning of the gen to impress people.
     
    #49 chris1515, Dec 20, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2020
    Johnny Awesome and ThePissartist like this.
  10. ThePissartist

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2013
    Messages:
    1,987
    Likes Received:
    950
    Just to correct myself, in the fidelity mode on Miles Morales the pedestrians are shadow casting, even at a large distance. Screenshot_20201220-185723_YouTube.jpg
     
    Shortbread and ToTTenTranz like this.
  11. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    As a PS User, I don't think it will come from Horizon 2 Forbidden West because it is a cross gen game and I doubt a lot the next God of War won't be a cross gen game.
     
  12. pjbliverpool

    pjbliverpool B3D Scallywag
    Legend

    Joined:
    May 8, 2005
    Messages:
    8,545
    Likes Received:
    2,888
    Location:
    Guess...
    To be honest, it's beyond me how anyone can look at the likes of this:



    or this:



    or this:



    or this:



    or for the love of God this:



    And not conclude that this is clearly the most graphically impressive game released to date. Although FS2020 should get an honourable mention for sheer photorealism.
     
  13. Johnny Awesome

    Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2002
    Messages:
    2,514
    Likes Received:
    454
    Location:
    Windsor, ON
    I think MS and Sony have wisely realized that having true showcase titles at launch isn't really necessary when you are supply limited anyway. I'm sure MS wishes they had an MM or Demon Souls, but neither of them wasted true next gen titles on 1-2 million user bases.
     
  14. BillSpencer

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2020
    Messages:
    304
    Likes Received:
    117
    Is there a reason why the foliage in that game looks like holograms? Like in the future all plant life died or something so the government replaced them with non-interactive holograms, aside from the cacti which survived the plant-holocast? :p

    But yeah, looks like that game has the best scale and overall details yet
     
  15. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    This is here with FS 2020 and the huge geometry details in Demon's souls*

    *Good but less impressive than Nanite.

    I can understand people who think there will be more impressive things in the near future probably with Frosbite. In your video I can see popin easily something like Nanite will make it fully disseapear or good usage of mesh shader will reduce it a lot.

    Vegetation like Demon's souls is not impressive and I hope we will see better this gen.
     
    #55 chris1515, Dec 20, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2020
    Shortbread likes this.
  16. Dictator

    Regular Newcomer

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2011
    Messages:
    407
    Likes Received:
    2,312
    I agree with @pjbliverpool here. Cyberpunk is the best looking game this year. This is something that time will vindicate when more people have the Hardware to play this game - AKA a gpu that can competently do RT (the eventual next en versions should be interesting). I think the General lowbrow luddite septicism across the Internet against ray tracing is the only reason why this game is not being so widely praised on PC graphically. People unfortunately dislike ray tracing due to memes or stupidly associate Graphics rendering progress via ray tracing with console wars or worse, IHV wars.. When to me, a game looking good due to RT is just 25 years progress and hard work where the RT Revolution is here: something i have wanted to see for so long.
     
    Kyyla, Scott_Arm, Benetanegia and 7 others like this.
  17. cwjs

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2020
    Messages:
    164
    Likes Received:
    342
    I mean I also think miles morales is a better looking game, but if you think it's as cutting edge technically you have a lot to learn about rendering.

    The thread is "generational leap" not best art team, and the art team that's leveraging good procedural workflows, building on an (amazing) established base, better paid, and doing less crunch, is almost always going to punch above the engine's weight.

    That doesn't make some nice tradeoffs in reflections magically more impressive than everything going on in cyberpunk.
     
  18. ThePissartist

    Veteran Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2013
    Messages:
    1,987
    Likes Received:
    950
    I don't think many here are skeptical of ray tracing. It's just that this specific game doesn't have the best implementation.

    I'm a big fan of your work, but I also don't believe we can disregard comments saying that they'll change when people have the "hardware to play the game". There are comments from people here that don't have the hardware that are using YouTube as demonstration of why this is the best looking game.

    So while this game is using the most ray tracing features, it's let down by art direction and implementation. Same as why Minecraft with RT also isn't the best looking game.
     
  19. cwjs

    Newcomer

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2020
    Messages:
    164
    Likes Received:
    342
    There are better implementations of single effects, but there's nowhere near the same complete package implementation in any other serious modern game. The very distant second place is control, which is also an amazing looking game.
     
    Kyyla, PSman1700, pharma and 3 others like this.
  20. chris1515

    Legend Regular

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2005
    Messages:
    6,105
    Likes Received:
    6,378
    Location:
    Barcelona Spain
    I disagree a bit. I think assets geometry details is as important or better vegetation. For example in Dex photos, the light is great but I can see polygons edge and I know it is a videogame. Same on FIFA 21 seeing polygons edge on ears and it brokes the illusion, shading material, shadows and hair are great but models have roots in old generation.

    This is a bit the problem of launch. Bluepoint did not do anything with hardware accelerated raytracing because of time constraints and they began the development of the game on devkit or PC without the feature.

    I wait the game where we will have everything and it will be better on PC because there is more power. Good polygonal details, great hair implementation, great textures, good RT implementation probably a mix of non triangle RT and triangle based RT.

    I don't think it will come from a first party game because they are cross gen. My guess is a Frosbite game.
     
    Sonic, snc and Shortbread like this.
Loading...

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Beyond3D has been around for over a decade and prides itself on being the best place on the web for in-depth, technically-driven discussion and analysis of 3D graphics hardware. If you love pixels and transistors, you've come to the right place!

    Beyond3D is proudly published by GPU Tools Ltd.
Loading...