[360] Forza Motorsport 3

[E2K]

Do we have any screens showing the Laguna Seca so we can compare with real life?
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/08/circuit-logic-mazda-captures-laguna-seca-on-google-street-view/

It still seems that the game's extremely saturated look is what keeps it from looking realistic, colours simply aren't that vibrant in real life. I wonder why T10 still persist with it, are they intentionally going for a non-photorealistic look? Like the art styles of Halo 3, Resistance etc.

Cause employing a more realistic colour palette wouldn't be more expensive to run now would it?

Not to make it a 'game comparison'-thread, but IMO GT4 also suffered a little bit from this. So I turned the saturation of the TV down a little bit, et voila, it then looked like it was real footage (at the time).
I have quicktime8 now (snow leopard) so I cannot change the gamma, saturation, color, anymore ( ?? ). But if I could I would demonstrate it to you guys.

 

[COPS N RAPPERS]

Do we have any screens showing the Laguna Seca so we can compare with real life?
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/09/08/circuit-logic-mazda-captures-laguna-seca-on-google-street-view/

It still seems that the game's extremely saturated look is what keeps it from looking realistic, colours simply aren't that vibrant in real life. I wonder why T10 still persist with it, are they intentionally going for a non-photorealistic look? Like the art styles of Halo 3, Resistance etc.

Cause employing a more realistic colour palette wouldn't be more expensive to run now would it?

maybe your monitor's vibrant level is up a little........if it isn't then tone it down.

you can always do that to your tv (hey when something bothers my eyes and it's within my boundaries i iron it out)

 

[(((interference)))]

Not to make it a 'game comparison'-thread, but IMO GT4 also suffered a little bit from this. So I turned the saturation of the TV down a little bit, et voila, it then looked like it was real footage (at the time).
I have quicktime8 now (snow leopard) so I cannot change the gamma, saturation, color, anymore ( ?? ). But if I could I would demonstrate it to you guys.

Well I use the same calibration settings for both movies and games on my TV, which gets it to the D6500 color temp standard which film and TV abide by (I assume games do as well). So on my TV i'll be seeing the game as the artists intended it to look.

And Forza 2 on my TV definitely has a saturated, vibrant look (similar to Halo 3) that other games employing a more photo realistic pallette do not share. Playing GT5 Prologue and Forza 2 on the same set with the same settings shows a clear difference in color/lighting between the two series.

It's disappointing that Forza 3 is largely continuing with the artstyle of its predecessors as it does not do to justice to the quality of car models which seem even higher poly than GT5's.

Having a 400,000 poly car model and rendering it using a non-photorealistic shading method is a bit strange IMO. I cannot understand why they do it? Is it just bad artistry or are they shooting for a non-realistic look?

 

[E2K]

OMG. People, this news will shock fanboys all over the world (if confirmed).
I know the reason why there has not been any realtime footage for such a long time..

http://www.imagebam.com/image/78285848378290

This is a screenshot I just took.
It looks like forza3 is .... upscaled
Can anyone of you pro-pixel counters confirm this??

I want my name, E2K attached to this when it goes public, plus this website. If other major sites want to publish this news they have to say it came from Beyond3d, and that E2K found out

 

[AlNom]

The vertical res is certainly 720 and 4xMSAA... can't get much from the horizontal though.

 

[E2K]

The vertical res is certainly 720 and 4xMSAA... can't get much from the horizontal though.

At 2:10 you get a better image for horizontal resolution, also much cleaner than the image I posted imo.

 

[Rotmm]

This is a screenshot I just took.
It looks like forza3 is .... upscaled
Can anyone of you pro-pixel counters confirm this??

I want my name, E2K attached to this when it goes public, plus this website. If other major sites want to publish this news they have to say it came from Beyond3d, and that E2K found out

What makes you think it's upscaled?

Also, I hope that last part is a joke

 

[COPS N RAPPERS]

Well I use the same calibration settings for both movies and games on my TV, which gets it to the D6500 color temp standard which film and TV abide by (I assume games do as well). So on my TV i'll be seeing the game as the artists intended it to look.

And Forza 2 on my TV definitely has a saturated, vibrant look (similar to Halo 3) that other games employing a more photo realistic pallette do not share. Playing GT5 Prologue and Forza 2 on the same set with the same settings shows a clear difference in color/lighting between the two series.

It's disappointing that Forza 3 is largely continuing with the artstyle of its predecessors as it does not do to justice to the quality of car models which seem even higher poly than GT5's.

Having a 400,000 poly car model and rendering it using a non-photorealistic shading method is a bit strange IMO. I cannot understand why they do it? Is it just bad artistry or are they shooting for a non-realistic look?

Again many forza fans would agree that that's something one can take care of with a little bit of tweaking to your tv.......my tv is set to a dynamic color/contrast auto adjusting setting. and if that doesn't get the job done then i make custom presets.

these same set of principles seem to apply perfectly when i play gears, uncharted, down to even kameo and ratchet and clank, so i don't see why it wouldn't for a racing game.......it could even possibly be the paint jobs that's making it look color full.

OMG. People, this news will shock fanboys all over the world (if confirmed).
I know the reason why there has not been any realtime footage for such a long time..

http://www.imagebam.com/image/78285848378290

This is a screenshot I just took.
It looks like forza3 is .... upscaled
Can anyone of you pro-pixel counters confirm this??

I want my name, E2K attached to this when it goes public, plus this website. If other major sites want to publish this news they have to say it came from Beyond3d, and that E2K found out

................didn't the developers say it was 720p native when there were rumors running around that it was thought to have been 1080p?

 

[E2K]

It could also be the video-compression, or even the video-capture software.
If it is 1280*720 then I'm sorry. But in the case that it isn't: I still think the car models, environments and the lighting looks great, especially when compared to earlier forza games.
And I rather have slight upscale plus 4xMSAA, then no upscale and no AA. But we'll have to wait until a person who can count the pixels can confirm or deny it..

 

[gongo]

I think there was a lot of hype on how FM3 looks like a completely different generation to 2...TBH...not seeing the "differences" from the videos...nice marketing in any case...

 

[E2K]

I think there was a lot of hype on how FM3 looks like a completely different generation to 2...TBH...not seeing the "differences" from the videos...nice marketing in any case...

As you might have read, forza3 cars are 1.000.000 polygons. Let's say we have 2 cars on screen: this would mean @ 60 fps, the game-engine would be pumping out 120.000.000 polygons a second. That is among, if not, the highest of this generation of consoles. So even if you think you don't see the difference, technically there really is. People complain that there are only 8 cars at the maximum in a race, but they fail to realize how great the cars look.

Edit:
Turn 10 said during Forza2 that cars had more than 100.000 polygons.
With Forza3 they stated that the cars now have more than 10 times the polygon count compared to that of forza2.
That would make it 1.000.000 for Forza3.

 

[czekon]

I think there was a lot of hype on how FM3 looks like a completely different generation to 2...TBH...not seeing the "differences" from the videos...nice marketing in any case...

try eyeglasses?

 

[2real4tv]

As you might have read, forza3 cars are 1.000.000 polygons. Let's say we have 2 cars on screen: this would mean @ 60 fps, the game-engine would be pumping out 120.000.000 polygons a second. That is among, if not, the highest of this generation of consoles. So even if you think you don't see the difference, technically there really is. People complain that there are only 8 cars at the maximum in a race, but they fail to realize how great the cars look.

Has this been verified. I seen the dev say 10x as previous versions but never say we have a vehicle that is 1M polys. If so I wonder which vehicle it is? All the vehicles would vary wouldn't it?

 

[rekator]

The 10x more polygons is reals polygons or tessellated polygons?

 

[TheWretched]

Forzas cars are NOT 1million Polygons!

I mean, compare them visually to what GT5P had with 200k models. They certainly do not have 5 times as many Polygons

 

[Neb]

As you might have read, forza3 cars are 1.000.000 polygons. Let's say we have 2 cars on screen: this would mean @ 60 fps, the game-engine would be pumping out 120.000.000 polygons a second. That is among, if not, the highest of this generation of consoles. So even if you think you don't see the difference, technically there really is. People complain that there are only 8 cars at the maximum in a race, but they fail to realize how great the cars look.

Edit:
Turn 10 said during Forza2 that cars had more than 100.000 polygons.
With Forza3 they stated that the cars now have more than 10 times the polygon count compared to that of forza2.
That would make it 1.000.000 for Forza3.

If we assume that is for ingame racing and not just photomode/car selection screen then it would certainly drop in detail drastically using tesselation. Just some meters ahead the detail could be a lot lower beyond your car. Like the tesselation demo by ATI where the closeup "dwarfs" have 1.8-2m polygons and 5 meters ahead they drop down to some 20-40k polygons range. Yet it is hard to spot the difference due to tesselation.

 

[Neb]

Forzas cars are NOT 1million Polygons!

I mean, compare them visually to what GT5P had with 200k models. They certainly do not have 5 times as many Polygons

I doubt it is 1 million while racing however it certainly has more curved surfaces than GT5 cars.

 

[(((interference)))]

Yes, there is no way that they have a million polys per car, that's ridiculous.

The only way that could be correct was if they were using Xenos' tesselator (which AFAIK converts normal maps into real geometry) however that just seems to be forum conjecture and we have nothing from Turn 10 to suggest that they are using the feature.

A more reasonable estimate I read was 400,000 polygons per car for F3, (with F2 cars being around 40,000 polys).

Again many forza fans would agree that that's something one can take care of with a little bit of tweaking to your tv.......my tv is set to a dynamic color/contrast auto adjusting setting. and if that doesn't get the job done then i make custom presets.

these same set of principles seem to apply perfectly when i play gears, uncharted, down to even kameo and ratchet and clank, so i don't see why it wouldn't for a racing game.......it could even possibly be the paint jobs that's making it look color full.

This is not the point. Compared to other racing titles PGR4, GT5P etc running on the same set with the same settings, F2 looks 'cartoony' due to the high contrast and color saturation.

And unlike you suggest, most F2 fans were not satisfied with the game's graphics, go have a read on the official Turn 10 forums and you'll see plenty of such comments.

 

[nightshade]

As you might have read, forza3 cars are 1.000.000 polygons. Let's say we have 2 cars on screen: this would mean @ 60 fps, the game-engine would be pumping out 120.000.000 polygons a second. That is among, if not, the highest of this generation of consoles. So even if you think you don't see the difference, technically there really is. People complain that there are only 8 cars at the maximum in a race, but they fail to realize how great the cars look.

Forza 2 cars surely werent 100k, that would mean they were as good with curves as PGR4 cars which wasnt the case for sure. I am dead sure Forza 3 isnt anywhere close to being 1 million.

Btw you got a pretty wrong estimate for the poly count on this console generation
Dead Rising has a peak poly count of ~4 million & that's a hell lot of polygons.

 

[slapnutz]

You know what they say about assumptions...

It actually looks like a mix at best, though. At least some of the shots look like the "attract mode" at least. And it seems as if it would be awfully hard to drive with some of those camera views.

Hey man, thanks for the info. I dont have anything against FM3 nor do I wish ill against it. In fact its the game that will make me buy an xbox360. Its just that I wish they could have avoided all this confusion with all their "promo vids" call it what you wish and present/missing HUDs and just released simple race cam showing a single lap months/weeks back. Its like they went out of their way to make it look like it was anything but racing mode captures.... marketing execs

Anyway yeah, definately a mix since theres shots where motion blur is clearly visible. Also I didnt know DOF was active during racing mode? Besides, I'm sure GT5 will have to put up with the same questioning.

Bring on what this new vid will be! (wow that last sentence has shocking grammar)