Digital Foundry Article Technical Discussion [2024]

[Shifty Geezer]

Shoutout to the ray traced cornetto's.

Those are some very impressive results for RT. Transformative in a number of cases.

 

[Karamazov]

it reminds me the transformative results seen in Fortnite also between lumen and standard lighting

 

[Dampf]

Nah, that's a way bigger difference. Regular Fortnite even lacks SSAO in these screenshots and any proper lighting at all.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Indiana Jones has very nice lighting, but the lack of RTXDI and what I consider to be sometimes more simple outdoor environments spoil the impression a little. I've already seen it straight away but I won't be playing it until Christmas. Maybe I'll change my mind then.

Why do you think it's not using RTXDI? It's using it in full PT mode.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

You forgot Black Myth Wukong! It's path tracing is considerably better than Outlaws in my opinion.

I didn't think BM:Wukong had a full path traced mode as UE5 isn't fully path-traced yet. Am I missing something?

 

[IQandHDR]

I didn't think BM:Wukong had a full path traced mode as UE5 isn't fully path-traced yet. Am I missing something?

Perhaps:

Black Myth: Wukong Out Now With Full Ray Tracing & DLSS 3 - Get The Definitive Experience On GeForce RTX 40 Series GPUs

Learn all about the tech in the stunning new game, see how DLSS 3 accelerates performance on GeForce RTX 40 Series GPUs, check out new RTX ON-OFF comparison videos and screenshots, and put your system to the test with the Black Myth: Wukong benchmark.

www.nvidia.com

NVIDIA has helped elevate Black Myth: Wukong’s graphics and technology to the highest levels. Lighting, effects and immersion are at their very best through the inclusion of realistic full ray tracing, otherwise referred to as Path Tracing.

 

[Jupiter]

Why do you think it's not using RTXDI? It's using it in full PT mode.

Start watching at 18:53. Local light sources like lamps do not cast RT shadows. Therefore Star Wars Outlaws is visually closer to Path Tracing for me.

 

[trinibwoy]

It’s kinda thrilling to see this level of lighting halfway through the current console generation. We are in for a treat for the next round of consoles. Hopefully by then all engines will converge on unified lighting systems.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Perhaps:

Black Myth: Wukong Out Now With Full Ray Tracing & DLSS 3 - Get The Definitive Experience On GeForce RTX 40 Series GPUs

Learn all about the tech in the stunning new game, see how DLSS 3 accelerates performance on GeForce RTX 40 Series GPUs, check out new RTX ON-OFF comparison videos and screenshots, and put your system to the test with the Black Myth: Wukong benchmark.

www.nvidia.com

But that kind of lingo is said for Indiana jones as well.

"To further upgrade Indiana Jones and the Great Circle on PC, players can turn on Full Ray Tracing. Also known as Path Tracing, Full Ray Tracing is a demanding but highly accurate way to render light and its effect on a scene, used by visual"

Indiana Jones and the Great Circle Out Now With Full Ray Tracing & DLSS 3

Enhance gameplay with Fully Ray-Traced Global Illumination, Foliage Subsurface Scattering, Ray-Traced Reflections, and Shadows.

www.nvidia.com

 

[Charlietus]

It’s kinda thrilling to see this level of lighting halfway through the current console generation. We are in for a treat for the next round of consoles. Hopefully by then all engines will converge on unified lighting systems.

If next consoles don't get Nvidia levels of acceleration, developers can't do too much to reach this level. But I'm sure that developers are screaming to Cerny to make sure they get that.

It would be funni bad if 2028 consoles can't reach 4070ti levels of ray acceleration

 

[IQandHDR]

But that kind of lingo is said for Indiana jones as well.

"To further upgrade Indiana Jones and the Great Circle on PC, players can turn on Full Ray Tracing. Also known as Path Tracing, Full Ray Tracing is a demanding but highly accurate way to render light and its effect on a scene, used by visual"

Indiana Jones and the Great Circle Out Now With Full Ray Tracing & DLSS 3

Enhance gameplay with Fully Ray-Traced Global Illumination, Foliage Subsurface Scattering, Ray-Traced Reflections, and Shadows.

www.nvidia.com

Yeah, but I think if you look at the list for "Black Myth Wukong":

• Full Resolution Multi-Bounce Ray-Traced Indirect Lighting.
• Full Resolution Ray-Traced Reflections.
• Ray-Traced Particle Reflections.
• Ray-Traced Caustics.
• Ray-Traced Shadows.

Those are more effect than "Indiana Jones and The Great Circle" does, eg. water has only SSR in the latter and no caustics.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

It sounds like 'Path Tracing' is just a marketing term to try and sound More-And-Betterer than Ray Tracing.

 

[pcchen]

It sounds like 'Path Tracing' is just a marketing term to try and sound More-And-Betterer than Ray Tracing.

Traditionally path tracing and ray tracing are a bit different (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_tracing and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_tracing_(graphics) ) or one can say path tracing is a form of more broad ray tracing techniques.
Although theoretically real path tracing should have no conventional rendering techniques so I think all current real time "path tracing" are still mixed techniques.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The fundamental difference is use of the BRDF to calulate surface values?

 

[chris1515]

Traditionally path tracing and ray tracing are a bit different (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Path_tracing and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_tracing_(graphics) ) or one can say path tracing is a form of more broad ray tracing techniques.
Although theoretically real path tracing should have no conventional rendering techniques so I think all current real time "path tracing" are still mixed techniques.

Offline pathtracing and realtime pathtracing aren't the same. I prefer full raytracing term of Digitalfoundry.

 

[trinibwoy]

If next consoles don't get Nvidia levels of acceleration, developers can't do too much to reach this level. But I'm sure that developers are screaming to Cerny to make sure they get that.

It would be funni bad if 2028 consoles can't reach 4070ti levels of ray acceleration

It would be great if the next consoles have amazing RT performance but I don’t think it’s necessary. Having “useful” RT is enough. RT should be a first class citizen next generation with game developers and game engines. So even if consoles require certain compromises due to lack of raw horsepower it should be easier to scale up effects on PC hardware. We’re already seeing that with the current crop of cutting edge RT titles.

 

[QPlayer]

If next consoles don't get Nvidia levels of acceleration, developers can't do too much to reach this level. But I'm sure that developers are screaming to Cerny to make sure they get that.

It would be funni bad if 2028 consoles can't reach 4070ti levels of ray acceleration

The 2026 nextgen "consoles" can even have the performance of Nvidia 5090 VGA, because it is easy that the next Xbox will actually be equal in terms of hardware to the PC.

 

[trinibwoy]

It sounds like 'Path Tracing' is just a marketing term to try and sound More-And-Betterer than Ray Tracing.

Yeah basically. Nvidia’s definition seems to include some combination of:

1) Per-pixel multi bounce GI
2) RT shadows for large number of lights
3) RT reflections

I’m not sure how you communicate the improvement in quality aside from saying “more, better raytracing”.

 

[Charlietus]

The 2026 nextgen "consoles" can even have the performance of Nvidia 5090 VGA, because it is easy that the next Xbox will actually be equal in terms of hardware to the PC.

Let's not advance the discussion since this isn't the thread for it, so I'll just leave it at... If they cost a 1000€.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Offline pathtracing and realtime pathtracing aren't the same. I prefer full raytracing term of Digitalfoundry.

'Full' of what? Given not full-tracing must be partial raytracing, what are all the parts that come together to make full raytracing? See VFX_Veteran's post here.

I’m not sure how you communicate the improvement in quality aside from saying “more, better raytracing”.

Pictures. As I say in VFX_Veteran's post, we've never invented terms for other rendering techniques. A game wasn't labelled some-form-of-rasterising if it added AA or SSAO. Call it 'Advanced Ray Tracing Techniques' or 'next gen ray tracing'.