Post Xbox One Two Scorpio, what should Sony do next? *spawn* (oh, and Nintendo?)

[trainplane]

If MS doesn't even have final hardware, let alone a real box to show, and it's coming out a year and a half later, I don't think showing at E3 makes sense. "We have something coming. Just you wait now." They might talk about it behind closed doors though and those rumors could spill out. Neo, if it is coming out in the Fall should show at E3. But if it doesn't, I think there is a good chance it will come out early 2017 instead.

Secondly, coming out with a follow up console that isn't Zen/Polaris just seems like a missed opportunity when we are at the cusp of these technologies. It'll be even more heavily GPU weighted than the PS4/XBox One. Pretty graphics with simple gameplay. To me, you release hardware based on the big architecture changes, which happens every 3-4 years. Otherwise, why bother? That's why I just can't get excited about Neo. It just seems like more of the same rather than something new.

 

[Mobius1aic]

If MS doesn't even have final hardware, let alone a real box to show, and it's coming out a year and a half later, I don't think showing at E3 makes sense. "We have something coming. Just you wait now." They might talk about it behind closed doors though and those rumors could spill out. Neo, if it is coming out in the Fall should show at E3. But if it doesn't, I think there is a good chance it will come out early 2017 instead.

Secondly, coming out with a follow up console that isn't Zen/Polaris just seems like a missed opportunity when we are at the cusp of these technologies. It'll be even more heavily GPU weighted than the PS4/XBox One. Pretty graphics with simple gameplay. To me, you release hardware based on the big architecture changes, which happens every 3-4 years. Otherwise, why bother? That's why I just can't get excited about Neo. It just seems like more of the same rather than something new.

Arguably the biggest reason for Neo is Playstation VR. But, faster framerates and better 1080p support will more resonate with gamers as all games on PS4 can benefit. Despite the problems with supporting multiple pieces of hardware, there is merit in doing away with purely console-based platforms for software based platforms that provide both forwards and backwards compatibility with minimal issue.

 

[trainplane]

Arguably the biggest reason for Neo is Playstation VR. But, faster framerates and better 1080p support will more resonate with gamers as all games on PS4 can benefit. Despite the problems with supporting multiple pieces of hardware, there is merit in doing away with purely console-based platforms for software based platforms that provide both forwards and backwards compatibility with minimal issue.

The problem though is that if Sony wants games to be cross-compatible, they should have developed a DX12 type layer to abstract the hardware for the PS4 before it was released. Supposedly they are stuck with same architecture because the games would not operate otherwise. You can't code to the metal and want a hardware abstracted ecosystem at the same time.

Then again, there is speculation that the PS4K isn't a Jaguar part either. So who knows actually.

Instead, Sony and AMD hammered out an agreement in which Sony would adopt the 14nm successor to Jaguar as well as a GPU based on the Polaris architecture. According to Valich, the PS4K isn’t actually based on Jaguar at all and will instead leverage four “Zen Lite” CPU cores. We’ll have to wait and see if this proves true; we haven’t previously heard of a Zen Lite CPU core. But it’s at least theoretically possible that AMD built a version of its upcoming architecture for Sony rather than going to the trouble of taking Jaguar down to 14nm FinFET. Everyone agrees that the GPU is based on Polaris, so there’s no argument there.

http://www.extremetech.com/gaming/2...utely-necessary-for-vr-slams-ps4s-performance

 

[function]

Zen Lite.

 

[MrFox]

 

[Mobius1aic]

The problem though is that if Sony wants games to be cross-compatible, they should have developed a DX12 type layer to abstract the hardware for the PS4 before it was released. Supposedly they are stuck with same architecture because the games would not operate otherwise. You can't code to the metal and want a hardware abstracted ecosystem at the same time.

Then again, there is speculation that the PS4K isn't a Jaguar part either. So who knows actually.

I'm for one a big believer in using Zen cores for PS4 Neo, whether they are a "lite" version or not. I was quite pessimistic about the recycling-of-Jaguar-bumped-to-2.1 GHz rumor, as only Zen could provide the real bump in performance necessary. It's also built for 14nm, and has SMT that even with two threads per core in a four core version for PS4 Neo just would absolutely wipe the floor with Jaguar, especially in SIMD. Native threading of PS4 code should be able to happen without too much concern. I do wonder how big individual Zen cores are though.

 

[MrFox]

Stop stop stop.

Theo Valich is an anagram for Vull O'Chite.

 

[eastmen]

All those reboots of Windows Phone hasn't helped.

THe problem with windows phone is the apps. Xbox doesn't have that problem as they get all the multiplatforms and have their own exclusives.

Windows phone isn't windows phone anymore , its windows mobile which is really just windows 10 with less backround processes .

That's the thing MS is trying to do is to move completely to one kernel and one program type.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Makes senses that they wouldn't bother moving Jaguar to 14nm.

 

[AlNom]

Makes senses that they wouldn't bother moving Jaguar to 14nm.

Wiki says Cougars are next in size after Jaguars, although maybe it'd have been more fitting at 40nm.

 

[mpg1]

Xbox One officially at $299 now

http://www.xbox.com/en-us/xbox-one/consoles

 

[rockaman]

Great move. I'm surprised actually the change is not closer to October/November holiday season though.

But I'm sure they will even more aggressively price it then, with a basic price cut, they can do extra sale at Holiday time.

Xbox has always been (smartly) aggressive with pricing in holiday periods.

 

[mpg1]

Great move. I'm surprised actually the change is not closer to October/November holiday season though.

But I'm sure they will even more aggressively price it then, with a basic price cut, they can do extra sale at Holiday time.

Xbox has always been (smartly) aggressive with pricing in holiday periods.

Well if they are releasing a slim model I would imagine the original model will be discontinued. Just curious as to what the pricing will be on the slim model. I suspect it will be $299.

 

[MrFox]

Is it a permanent price drop this time or just on sale temporarily?

 

[rockaman]

I imagine it is permanent. Also probably permanent/starting price to the Slim. $299 announcement for that at E3 I bet. We're almost at 3 years now, the timing seems right.

 

[AlNom]

Looks like it's just the special bundles that have the "*For a limited time only".

What a weird choice. 1TB w/ Division or 500GB w/ choice for $299.

 

[MrFox]

I don't understand the timing two weeks before E3. They'll have to get rid of the fat XB1 as soon as the slim comes out, and that means pricing it lower than the slim. If the slim is above $299, it would be a very weird move, while if it comes out at the expected $299, who would buy the fat XB1 for the same price as the new slim?

Sony's E3 press conf is later than the MS conference, so it's not like they are preempting a Sony price drop, they could have done so at E3 at the same time they announce the slim.

unless... the slim have no ODD, which would set teh internets aflame.
or unless... there is no slim announcement.

 

[mpg1]

I don't understand the timing two weeks before E3. They'll have to get rid of the fat XB1 as soon as the slim comes out, and that means pricing it lower than the slim. If the slim is above $299, it would be a very weird move, while if it comes out at the expected $299, who would buy the fat XB1 for the same price as the new slim?

Sony's E3 press conf is later than the MS conference, so it's not like they are preempting a Sony price drop, they could have done so at E3 at the same time they announce the slim.

unless... the slim have no ODD, which would set teh internets aflame.
or unless... there is no slim announcement.

Apparently the slim model isn't actually going to be available until August. So it does make sense in that they have a few months to clear out the old model inventories..

 

[AzBat]

Can MS reduce the size of the console without a reduction in silicon? Supposedly Sony couldn't with the PS4. So maybe the XB1 Slim has a similar increase in power like the rumored PS4 Neo? MS could be selling their Slim at the same price as a PS4 @ $350 or higher? Usually a price drop means they're clearing out inventory for a replacement, but after some searching I couldn't find where any company announced a price drop prior to E3. Usually it was timed with announcement of a new model at E3.

Personally I don't buy the rumor they will announce the Slim at E3, but won't ship it until August. That's the Osborne-effect isn't it?

Tommy McClain

 

[upnorthsox]

Can MS reduce the size of the console without a reduction in silicon?
Tommy McClain

Absolutely, in fact that's what I expect. From the rumors, the slim is going to be roughly the same size as the ps4 so there's little doubt that they could do a slim without a shrink. PS4 on the other hand, likely blew its slim at launch which may be why Neo was in the cards all along.