X360 Ditching Backwards Compatibility
- Thread starter rounin
- Start date
Well, MS' numbers on the B/C useage I don't exactly trust. I know I was using it for PS1 games for a year or so after launch, and I everyone else I know who bought a launch unit was also. Now, if you buy the system two-three years out, then ok I can imagine that one is pretty well through with last gen's games. But at the same time, Sony does still have strong former gen titles it seems a decent ways into the new consoles life.
Last gen for me it was Dragon Warrior/Quest VII that soaked up ~100 hours on the PS2; this gen it will probably be FFXII and God of War 2.
Last gen for me it was Dragon Warrior/Quest VII that soaked up ~100 hours on the PS2; this gen it will probably be FFXII and God of War 2.
Exactly, and I'm sure quite a few people recently replayed the orignal Silent Hill on their PS2s as well. (Although personally, I emulated the game in HD and used a 360 controller with my HTPC.rounin said:I already know a few guys who have been intrigued enough by MGS3 that they're going through from MGS1 again. And this is 2006
)I was going to get $50 got Xbox when I got the 360, but after playing Halo 2 once on the 360 I gave up on that option and keep the big ugly beast hooked up mostly for that game.Asher said:
thatdude90210
Regular
Same here, never had an xbox before so no old games. Between 360 games and live arcade, I don't really have the need to look up their B/C list.Asher said:
kyleb said:
And realistically speaking, how many people actually do that? Did the original MGS suddenly sell a couple of million fresh copies in 2005? Was the demand so high that they had to put it back into duplication?
Or are we only talking about a few hundred to a few thousands people? A drop in the bucket compared to the 120+ million PS2 systems in circulation?
RancidLunchmeat
Veteran
The really amusing part to me, is the impact of BC on the sale of used games.
OMG! let's not talk about that.
But seriously, isn't that what this is all about?
The early adopters who purchased a 360 might still want to play their favorite old Xbox games on their new system, but they also most likely have their old Xbox and they also most likely purchased the 360 to play new games.. not the old ones.
Additionally, early adopters are a small fraction of the market and if the investment in time and resources doesn't equate to increased sales and profits, then it simply makes no sense at all for MS to focus energy on it.
What we have here is a really simple situation. The 360 offers BC for the large majority of the most popular Xbox games.
They did this only to insure that early adopters for the 360 could still play Halo2 over Live! on their 360.
That's really it. That's the only reason. They did what was easy enough to do, to satisfy enough early adopters until their new 360 library was built out.
The fact is that now that 360 library has increased in size, BC is no longer a selling point to early adopters. They have plenty of NEW titles that they should be purchasing and playing.
Also, I believe that the wave of early adopters (which I discussed previously) is just about over for the 360. I believe that MS was poised to declare a price reduction in the next couple of months (prior to the holiday season) up until Sony announced the price of the PS3. Now, they don't think they have to. Everybody knows how much the PS3 will cost when it hits the market, those people who were waiting to find out.. will purchase a 360 if the PS3 price is prohibitive. PS3 will sell out at launch, and the 360 will also get a huge holiday bump. (From now until the holiday season, I forecast a drop in 360 sales, btw).
But none of that has anything to do with BC. Those who are buying a 360 between now and the next price drop (following the holidays) are doing so because they want to play 360 games.. no because they have a huge library of Xbox games that they want to play.
Which comes back to my original premise: BC and the impact of used game sales. How many people actually own two or three dozen Xbox games? That they want to be able to play on the 360 that they are willing to pay $399 for?
I'd say that percentage is so small its irrelevant. Most people sell their old games, unless they are really spectacular, and those games that are top sellers are the same games that MS spent the effort in order to make BC (such as Halo2).
The lack of BC hurts the used game market, but that's about it. Because as the 360 becomes mainstream and the Xbox becomes obsolete, the only people who "lose" from the lack of BC are the people who don't buy games at full price (who are also the same group of people who won't own a 360 for 2 years or so), and the used game retailers who can't find a market for their inventory because the market isn't Xbox+360, the market is only Xbox.
Why would ANY console manufacturer want to encourage BC? It only provides a benefit to the early adopters when they have a small release library, so those people can play their old games on their new system until the library of their new system catches up.
For everything else, it is a detriment to the console manufacturer to provide BC because it means that consumers might purchase their new console for one or two flashy new games, but then purchase the rest of their games as used from a previous generation.
IMO, Killing BC is a far more enticing path to stem the flood of resold games than the path that it was rumored that Sony was pondering.
OMG! let's not talk about that.
But seriously, isn't that what this is all about?
The early adopters who purchased a 360 might still want to play their favorite old Xbox games on their new system, but they also most likely have their old Xbox and they also most likely purchased the 360 to play new games.. not the old ones.
Additionally, early adopters are a small fraction of the market and if the investment in time and resources doesn't equate to increased sales and profits, then it simply makes no sense at all for MS to focus energy on it.
What we have here is a really simple situation. The 360 offers BC for the large majority of the most popular Xbox games.
They did this only to insure that early adopters for the 360 could still play Halo2 over Live! on their 360.
That's really it. That's the only reason. They did what was easy enough to do, to satisfy enough early adopters until their new 360 library was built out.
The fact is that now that 360 library has increased in size, BC is no longer a selling point to early adopters. They have plenty of NEW titles that they should be purchasing and playing.
Also, I believe that the wave of early adopters (which I discussed previously) is just about over for the 360. I believe that MS was poised to declare a price reduction in the next couple of months (prior to the holiday season) up until Sony announced the price of the PS3. Now, they don't think they have to. Everybody knows how much the PS3 will cost when it hits the market, those people who were waiting to find out.. will purchase a 360 if the PS3 price is prohibitive. PS3 will sell out at launch, and the 360 will also get a huge holiday bump. (From now until the holiday season, I forecast a drop in 360 sales, btw).
But none of that has anything to do with BC. Those who are buying a 360 between now and the next price drop (following the holidays) are doing so because they want to play 360 games.. no because they have a huge library of Xbox games that they want to play.
Which comes back to my original premise: BC and the impact of used game sales. How many people actually own two or three dozen Xbox games? That they want to be able to play on the 360 that they are willing to pay $399 for?
I'd say that percentage is so small its irrelevant. Most people sell their old games, unless they are really spectacular, and those games that are top sellers are the same games that MS spent the effort in order to make BC (such as Halo2).
The lack of BC hurts the used game market, but that's about it. Because as the 360 becomes mainstream and the Xbox becomes obsolete, the only people who "lose" from the lack of BC are the people who don't buy games at full price (who are also the same group of people who won't own a 360 for 2 years or so), and the used game retailers who can't find a market for their inventory because the market isn't Xbox+360, the market is only Xbox.
Why would ANY console manufacturer want to encourage BC? It only provides a benefit to the early adopters when they have a small release library, so those people can play their old games on their new system until the library of their new system catches up.
For everything else, it is a detriment to the console manufacturer to provide BC because it means that consumers might purchase their new console for one or two flashy new games, but then purchase the rest of their games as used from a previous generation.
IMO, Killing BC is a far more enticing path to stem the flood of resold games than the path that it was rumored that Sony was pondering.
New backwards compatibility update imminent, work continues.
http://gamerscoreblog.com/team/archive/2006/06/01/535135.aspx
http://gamerscoreblog.com/team/archive/2006/06/01/535135.aspx
RancidLunchmeat said:
I suppose that comes down to a matter of perspective, but looking at this list I have to disagree.
And yet to this day I still keep my orignal Xbox hooked up for that exact reason as it runs the game better than my 360 does. They damn well better keep cracking on it as they have a long way to go before Peter Moore can claim "We under promised and over delivered on that." without being a bold-faced lier.RancidLunchmeat said:
Rockster said:
Heh, from that link:
Then why the hell were MS people saying things like:
http://gamesindustry.biz/news.php?aid=8996
Yeah.
RancidLunchmeat
Veteran
kyleb said:
Uhh.. Sorry, what was that a list of? It certainly wasn't a list of the top selling games and which ones were BC. Am I supposed to look at that link and automatically know of a completely different link that shows which ones are BC?
Could you please define 'runs the game better'?
You mean Xbox games run better on the Xbox than they do on the 360?
Again.. You've made two statements already that demonstrate my point, they don't refute it. First.. You've already purchased a 360 so you are an early adopter. Second, you still have your Xbox (and not only that, you still have your Xbox "hooked up").
So why in the world should MS spend energy and money on making Xbox games BC when the people who are early adopters of the 360 already own an Xbox and can play their old games on their old system? What exactly is in it for them? How do they profit by doing so?
Uhh... They damn well better do what? I agree his statement was completely absurd. They delivered what they promised, IMO. To say they did anything other than that is ridiculous.
But they don't need to damn well do anything. You own an Xbox on which you can play Xbox games. You own a 360 on which you can play 360 games and some of your Xbox games.
That's all they ever promised and that's what they've delivered.
If you purchased a 360 because you have a library of 2 or 3 dozen Xbox games that you wanted to be able to play on the 360 along with all the new games released for the 360, then you clearly didn't understand what MS said when they announced that BC would be available.
Furthermore, considering the fact you own both an Xbox and a 360, I'm inclined to believe you would have purchased the 360 regardless of any claims towards BC.
NBK - Steve
Newcomer
Meh doesn't matter to me I have only played one Xbox game (Halo2) on my 360 and I only played it once. I just wanted to see what it would look like up converted.
I don't want to make generalizations, but I think the whole B/C aspect tends to be more important to the Sony hardcore than the MS hardcore. I agree that as time goes on, the ability to play old games becoems less pertinent, but at the same time there's a certain satisfaction and piece of mind in knowing that if you wanted to, you could. And I'm not trying to make a big deal of it or anything, but again for myself, B/C is important.
When I get my PS3, if my PS2 isn't sold, it's going to be shunted off to some corner. I don't want to have to dig anything out when I want to play an old game - so much better just to be able to pop it in, even if never used.
Now, on the 360 I don't think it's as big a deal, just because it's just not as much a part of the expectation. Still though, I do feel sorry for people who sold their XBox's on the expectation that they would be able to play their XBox games on the newer system - and there are some of those people. Caveat emptor, true, but I can't deny that with my own thinking I likely would have been among them.
Anyway Rancid I agree that the whole B/C push in general is of limited economic benefit, but all the same I think when easily achievable, it does provide a sort of nicety to the fanbase, and can encourage pickup of the system near launch when it's own launch titles are less than inspiring; ie myself and the PS2 launch for example.
When I get my PS3, if my PS2 isn't sold, it's going to be shunted off to some corner. I don't want to have to dig anything out when I want to play an old game - so much better just to be able to pop it in, even if never used.
Now, on the 360 I don't think it's as big a deal, just because it's just not as much a part of the expectation. Still though, I do feel sorry for people who sold their XBox's on the expectation that they would be able to play their XBox games on the newer system - and there are some of those people. Caveat emptor, true, but I can't deny that with my own thinking I likely would have been among them.
Anyway Rancid I agree that the whole B/C push in general is of limited economic benefit, but all the same I think when easily achievable, it does provide a sort of nicety to the fanbase, and can encourage pickup of the system near launch when it's own launch titles are less than inspiring; ie myself and the PS2 launch for example.
Last edited by a moderator:
You should have a general idea of what games are BC if you knew what you were talking about when you made your claim:RancidLunchmeat said:
But sense you were obviously going on without knowing what you were talking about there, I suppose I'll just leave it at that.RancidLunchmeat said:
Similar threads
