The new PS3 sales pitch: Better gaming, better technology, better value

[rabidrabbit]

I'm not convinced, pingpong-toy.
I think all those games did have a second or so transition, which isn't seamless like in the movies where the transition from cut to cut is instant.
That's what my memory tells me, but as it could be failing, I might need to check for example FFX before I decaler you wrong

 

[London Geezer]

I'm not convinced, pingpong-toy.
I think all those games did have a second or so transition, which isn't seamless like in the movies where the transition from cut to cut is instant.
That's what my memory tells me, but as it could be failing, I might need to check for example FFX before I decaler you wrong

I have a good memory and at least in LOTR the FMV faded into in-game engine with no stops, no black screens, no pauses. Most people will remember the beginning of the game where the battle scene is ripped straight from the movie and just kind of "morphs" into in-game and u can start playing. I think it happened at the point where an ancient soldier was ready for battle, when humans first destroyed the Sauron or whatever deodorant-sounding name the big baddie had...

FFX did it too a few times, and i'm sure lots of games ever since did the same.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Second.. I'm not really sure that I'm certain of what you are proposing. If the RPM spinrate is variable but the data transfer rates are constant, couldn't that also be expressed as handicapping the higher spinrates in order to maintain a constant data transfer rate?

This was discussed earlier, and no-one who has yet commented has an real insight, but best guess it seems the limiting factor is the optical pickup. If the BRD head can read data at no more than 72Mb/s, once you are spinning the disc that fast, going faster actually stops the disc being read.

Thus if 72 Mb/s is achieved on the outside tracks at 2500 RPM, and at 5000 RPM on the inside tracks, in CLV you'd speed up the disc moving towards the centre. In CAV if you go at 2500 RPM you get full speed from the outside edge and half speed from the inside edge. If you go 5000 RPM, full drive speed, you get full transfer rate from the inside edge but lose all data access on the outside edge because the OPU isn't fast enough to read the data.

That's how I understand it. I don't know that's the way it works for sure, but that explanation ties in with all the data we have.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I have a good memory and at least in LOTR the FMV faded into in-game engine with no stops, no black screens, no pauses. Most people will remember the beginning of the game where the battle scene is ripped straight from the movie and just kind of "morphs" into in-game and u can start playing.

Yep. It was very good transistioning indeed.

 

[rabidrabbit]

I haven't played the LOTR games, but I think I now remember inFFX those fade in transitions. Is it some "render to texture" trick oslt?
But is the PS2 with DVD capable of seamless pause free fast cut i.e a switch between fmv to gameplay, that is just that, a cut, not transition?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

No reason why it wouldn't be if it can do blends. A smooth transition has both buffers (FMV and game) and mixes between them. You'd just not bother mixing and do a straight flip.

 

[London Geezer]

The way it was explained at the time, those seamless transitions were possible because of the MPEG2 accellerator built into the EE itself, but it could all be PR talk at the time just to brag about the EE. In the end, the whole thing was just quite impressive at the time, whatever way they did it.

 

[rabidrabbit]

As the LOTR games were multiplatform, did the xbox version have similar transitions?

 

[London Geezer]

As the LOTR games were multiplatform, did the xbox version have similar transitions?

Not sure but i don't see why not.

 

[rabidrabbit]

It's your memory now that's failing.
Just abouve you said

The way it was explained at the time, those seamless transitions were possible because of the MPEG2 accellerator built into the EE itself, but it could all be PR talk at the time just to brag about the EE.

I ask is that true, then you question your own rumour.
Are we getting old there, thongdong-boy?

 

[London Geezer]

It's your memory now that's failing.
Just abouve you said

I ask is that true, then you question your own rumour.
Are we getting old there, thongdong-boy?

You bolded the wrong part... My main point was "...but it could all be PR talk at the time just to brag about the EE". So yes of course i question my own rumour, i did so in my first post.

 

[rabidrabbit]

Then why post it at all.
If they said it was possible because of some EE mojo, that does imply it's unique to PS2 and not possible on xbox, though you say xbox should be just as capable doing it even without the EE majicgiga.
Is it or is it not. Why do you see it being just as possible on xb, if you felt the former rumour was worth posting even if you questioned it's accuracy.

 

[Phil]

I'm not convinced, pingpong-toy.
I think all those games did have a second or so transition, which isn't seamless like in the movies where the transition from cut to cut is instant.
That's what my memory tells me, but as it could be failing, I might need to check for example FFX before I decaler you wrong

L-B is correct, FFX had absolutely no lag when going from FMV to in-game graphics. In fact, this was one of the reasons why at some point, you actually thought you were still looking at the FMV when it was already the in-game cutscene cutting in... (some nice examples can be seen on the boat when they encounter Sin...)


EDIT;

Just remembered; even FFVII on the PSone was able to pull this off; There are various instances where you have FMV in the background while still being able to control your character in the foreground... one example would be near the harbour with the big gun pointing towards the lake; there's an elevator. Once you activate it, you have a FMV playing the sequence of the elevator moving up but while moving up, it's possible to still move your character.

 

[London Geezer]

Give a break rabid for god's sake, you've been impossibly difficult lately.

I posted the rumour about the MPEG2 decoder inside the EE, then said it could have just been PR talk, just to make conversation.
Then i said that if the rumour was not the truth, then i don't see why not the Xbox wouldn't be able to transition between FMV and in-game engine just like the PS2 did.

What's the big deal?

If it's true that it was because of the MPEG2 decoder, it matters very little because in the end most FMV on PS2 games are on MPEG2 format because Sony had paid for the decoder already, as it's on every EE. On other machines, FMV was usually on other formats, so i don't see why an Xbox couldn't transition between in-game and video just like PS2 did, as the video could have been on any other format.

Anything else you need to nitpick?

I just remembered that God of War did the same thing, and more recently KH2.

EDIT: And as Phil said, if even PS1 could transition between FMV and in-game seamlessly, and even have FMV playing in the background with 3d objects moving (like those crappy shooting games that looked cool for the first 5 minutes in the 90's), then the Xbox would be more than happy to do the same.

 

[rabidrabbit]

I'm sorry, don't-get-me-wrong-boy.
...but, I need answers. Was it the same for xbox? Not guesses.
Not that it matters much, but still..... I just want answers

 

[London Geezer]

Google is your friend, so are all the thousands of gaming sites that reviewed the game.

 

[scooby_dooby]

Ok now that we're done with that little squabble, LB what's your source for the BR drive being both CAV and CLV, and do you have any numbers on min write speed using CAV, and the respective seek times?

 

[Arwin]

Ok now that we're done with that little squabble, LB what's your source for the BR drive being both CAV and CLV, and do you have any numbers on min write speed using CAV, and the respective seek times?

I know from the BluRay requirement specs that it uses the one for BluRay (as it is the requirement for video) and the other for DVD compatibility. So, I guess it could do the other for BluRay as well, though I don't really see the point. If you do good mastering, you'll lump all the small files into big resource files, as already happens on DVDs also anyway, because even on DVD, reading lots of scattered small files is terribly inefficient.

(And those small files you do need should go on the HDD of course)