Will Warner support Blu-ray?

[Ty]

Really?? What kind of incompatabilities? Also, how is it a moving target? Man, as if HDCP wasn't a big enough pain.

Well HDMI 1.3 is already in the works.

Incompatabilities like poor handshaking. Don't count on switch boxes to correctly pass the HDCP flag properly. I've even read that some ports on particular pieces of HT equipment don't even properly pass the audio bitstream. It's come down to some people listing out what equipment works with other equipment and what doesn't.

 

[aaaaa00]

When progressive DVD players first hit the market, they used simple bob and weave techniques to do deinterlacing. Per-pixel directional deinterlacing came along much later and is not "extra stuff to tweak it"

Just a slightly off topic question, I was under the impression that correctly flagged film-sourced DVD material doesn't require any sort of stride detection or deinterlacing in the DVD player -- it can reconstruct the full progressive frames from the stream by using the field flags and merging the fields in the decode frame buffer.

I remember a lot of discs were authored incorrectly years ago, which is why progressive scan DVD players had to be smarter than just flag reading, but the question is realistically, how often is material flagged incorrectly today?

 

[DemoCoder]

I think the rate is something like 10% of discs are incorrectly flagged. Of course, the flags only deal with 24fps film source. If the material is video, or other format, you'll still need a more advanced deinterlacer. This is especially important I've found for TV series packaged on DVD.

I can only speak from experience. I was watching The Rock the other day and I noticed the deinterlacer switching in and out of film mode, which means that the disc has some funky mix of progressive/interlaced frames in the video stream, and/or if flagged them incorrectly.

You have to remember that DVDs are authored by engineers who perform quality control on interlaced display devices. They generally don't care about the result on non-CRT, although that may have changed in the last few years given the ubiquity of flatpanls.

 

[one]

A conversation with Bill Gates

http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/archives/2005/10/14/news/13474.shtml

DP: There has been a lot of debate about the next generation Blu-ray and HD DVD technologies in recent weeks. It seems more and more companies are backing the Blu-ray standard. The current debate seems to harken back to the Betamax vs. VHS format war in the 1970s and 80s, where Betamax was ostensibly the superior technology yet it did not gain wide acceptance. Why is Microsoft not backing Blu-ray today — a technology that many consider to be superior?

Gates: Well, the key issue here is that the protection scheme under Blu-ray is very anti-consumer and there's not much visibility of that. The inconvenience is that the [movie] studios got too much protection at the expense consumers and it won't work well on PCs. You won't be able to play movies and do software in a flexible way.

It's not the physical format that we have the issue with, it's that the protection scheme on Blu is very anti-consumer. If [the Blu-ray group] would fix that one thing, you know, that'd be fine.

For us it's not the physical format. Understand that this is the last physical format there will ever be. Everything's going to be streamed directly or on a hard disk. So, in this way, it's even unclear how much this one counts.

 

[Ty]

Understand that this is the last physical format there will ever be.

No HVD!

 

[DemoCoder]

Haha, Microsoft attacking other people's DRM as anti-consumer, when they are trying to embed super-onerous DRM into upcoming versions of windows. Priceless.

 

[London Geezer]

Understand that this is the last physical format there will ever be.

OH NO!!! That sounds SOOO much like his famous "PC's will never need more than 640KB RAM!!"

What the hell is that supposed to mean? Last physical format there will ever be?! Then what, he's gonna give everyone in the world cheap 1GB/s broadband connections? And provide every kind of entertainment like that?!
Before we get to that level, we'll have 892 new formats around.

 

[Farid]

err...

OH NO!!! That sounds SOOO much like his famous "PC's will never need more than 640KB RAM!!"

So, famous that he probably never said it...

And on topic, or somehow, I really hope wellsee something like HVD or even better before we go fully virtual data.
Anyway, we won't go down the virtual stockage path until we have faster connexions, for almost everybody, and gigantic webspace for free (or comprised in the internet monthly fees). until then people will need physcal optical storage... I guess...

And what has that to do with rendering technology used in Consoles or at least hardware used in consoles, you may ask? Well, who knows. This will remain a mystery...

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Dunno about you but I'd like a physical disk to backup my material to. Streamed movies is all waell and good and somethng I appreciate, but I want something to store my HDR hidef home-made movies on. Though I guess eventaully Google will supply the whole worlds data storage requirements including multiple backups and mirrors of every file ever produced...

 

[Carl B]

And what has that to do with rendering technology used in Consoles or at least hardware used in consoles, you may ask? Well, who knows. This will remain a mystery...

C'mon Vysez, at this point it's just understood that somehow, HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray is crucial to console discussion. Like you said it's a mystery why, but I have to say it just seems to fit somehow.

 

[London Geezer]

C'mon Vysez, at this point it's just understood that somehow, HD-DVD vs Blu-Ray is crucial to console discussion. Like you said it's a mystery why, but I have to say it just seems to fit somehow.

I think it's the whole Anything VS Sony thing.

You know, if Sony made microwaves, we'd have threads on here on how DeLonghi microwaves are so much more advanced than Sony's, and how next gen Sony microwaves will have Cell.

See it's all connected.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

And invariably Nintendo invented the Microwave ten years before Sony anyway so whats the big deal?

 

[London Geezer]

And invariably Nintendo invented the Microwave ten years before Sony anyway so whats the big deal?

And Apple patented the idea of warming up stuff with radiation 50 years ago so they should get royalties!

 

[mckmas8808]

Bill is ridiculas. If I have 3 computers in my house don't I have to buy 3 different versions of MS Office? Why doesn't he let us be able to copy his billion dollar baby for backups and different computers? I would like to buy one version of MS Office and be able to use it legally on 2 other computers and a laptop. This guy is laughable. Just admit Bill you don't like it because Sony is mostly behind it.

 

[rabidrabbit]

I have an official, bought from the store, Student Version of Office 2003, and it says it can be installed in three computers...
What's this fact got to do with Warner and Blu-ray, I have no clue.

 

[MoeStooge]

Bill is ridiculas. If I have 3 computers in my house don't I have to buy 3 different versions of MS Office? Why doesn't he let us be able to copy his billion dollar baby for backups and different computers? I would like to buy one version of MS Office and be able to use it legally on 2 other computers and a laptop. This guy is laughable. Just admit Bill you don't like it because Sony is mostly behind it.

I really think it has very little to do with Sony being behind it. The big thing for Microsoft seems to be the lack of a "Managed Copy" stipulation in the Blu-ray spec. Microsoft's plans for Windows need this for the home entertainment services they are envisioning. It would be very interesting to see what happens if the Blu-ray camp adopts some form of managed copy.

 

[Edge]

PC-Engine is back?!?!?

This should be fun.

 

[London Geezer]

PC-Engine is back?!?!?

This should be fun.

What's the point of this post? Are you making this place any better by calling out for him?
Come on, some common sense people. He might have his issues, but calling out for him is just as bad.

 

[NavNucST3]

I really think it has very little to do with Sony being behind it. The big thing for Microsoft seems to be the lack of a "Managed Copy" stipulation in the Blu-ray spec. Microsoft's plans for Windows need this for the home entertainment services they are envisioning. It would be very interesting to see what happens if the Blu-ray camp adopts some form of managed copy.

Correct. But I think the BDA will just say what they have been saying, "Well we support AACS also", leaving out the fact that the movie studios didn't jump on BD-ROMs for size they jumped on it for the BD-ROM+, and I would be willing to bet that all of the Major Studio movies have the BD-ROM+ stamp on them.

As strange as it sounds, I actually agree with Mr. Gates on this one. With the movie studios seemingly all about to jump on the BDA bandwagon I will concede the win to Blu-Ray, but I will concede the loss to the consumer as well. I just hope a Sony Blu-Ray gets hacked and then see what Sony/movie studios do in that case, will they disable their own product or let it ride, and if they do let it ride, but disable the Apexs of the world, I would forsee some type of litigation.

 

[mckmas8808]

As strange as it sounds, I actually agree with Mr. Gates on this one. With the movie studios seemingly all about to jump on the BDA bandwagon I will concede the win to Blu-Ray, but I will concede the loss to the consumer as well. I just hope a Sony Blu-Ray gets hacked and then see what Sony/movie studios do in that case, will they disable their own product or let it ride, and if they do let it ride, but disable the Apexs of the world, I would forsee some type of litigation.

Come on people DVDs are even supposed to be copied and tossed around the house today. So how is this any different? If you buy a Blu-ray movie and want to watch it in another room just walk you lazy butt to the first room, remove the disc, and play it on your other Blu-ray player.

It's been like this for years what's the problem? Screw MS for wanting to take the movie off the disc and zap it around the house knowing that this would probably lead to more people just not buying the movie and just pirating it. [/rant]