*Where are the new good game ideas going to come from? Spawned

[DeadlyNinja]

Thread spawned from the "How can Nintendo coax 3rd party devs to the Wii" thread.

I want to see truly innovative games find a market that actually takes advantage of the Wii's strengths.

You're not going to see them from Western studios -- at least not big name studios. They've long run out of ideas. Why do something intelligent and creative when you can rehash Quake for the 1000th time with some gimmicks and call it mature to get sales? If you want innovative, you're better off looking at small companies like 5th Cell, or Japanese developers for innovation. Check out Probe's Let's Tap for the Wii.

I mean, just look at the 360. After what, 3 years now, and their their best genres can be counted on 1 hand. If you look at it's retail games, it's barren wasteland of generic games with a new coating. How many people are scarfing up crap like COD:WAW instead of something amazing as Braid? What's worst is that most of these games are treated like the second coming when they're all just smoke and mirrors designed to cover a bad game. ZOMG, Oblivion has a huge world!!!1111213. Turns out, the game is a huge empty lifeless world that looks like a quick copy and paste job filled with fetch quests. It's all about building hype. This year, some of the best games are download games. Unless these small indie developers really make it big, you're stuck with the same shovelware across the board, not just the Wii.

 

[assen]

You're not going to see them from Western studios -- at least not big name studios. They've long run out of ideas.

Ideas are a dime a dozen. The problem is executing them. Braid is a great idea, wrapped in three years of grueling work and polish by an industry veteran. The same idea in the hand of a rookie would see at most a half-baked Flash game buried among bad arcade clones on a Flash portal somewhere.

 

[fearsomepirate]

YThey've long run out of ideas. Why do something intelligent and creative when you can rehash Quake for the 1000th time with some gimmicks

If only modern FPSes had the level design and toughness of Quake. Instead, we're getting rehashes of Medal of Honor.

Any piece of data you can find shows that third party games matter, including on Nintendo's console. It's a matter of scale--3rd party games are not as big a percentage of software sales, but they are not therefore negligible, as they still comprise between half and two thirds of total sales. Also, I don't think the OP was about "hardcore" games, since that is roughly defined as "games that people who call themselves 'hardcore gamers' like," and no one calls himself a "hardcore gamer" who plays Wii.

But if we're talking about good games, well, as the OP states, that includes things like Boom Blox and Zack & Wiki.

I think some kind of quality mark would be nice. However, I don't think Nintendo really needs to do anything. If companies can't figure out on their own how making Wii games can and should benefit them financially, or if they're doing well enough on the HD consoles to stay in business, well, that's their business. I think Nintendo has made an attractive platform for anyone making a game that is unlikely to be a platinum hit.

 

[midorigreenwood]

You're not going to see them from Western studios -- at least not big name studios. They've long run out of ideas. Why do something intelligent and creative when you can rehash Quake for the 1000th time with some gimmicks and call it mature to get sales? If you want innovative, you're better off looking at small companies like 5th Cell, or Japanese developers for innovation. Check out Probe's Let's Tap for the Wii.

yup, I read recently that only 20% of games that reach the market make any profit at all so its not surprising that companies are striving to make the next Halo or Gears of Wars and gain a big windfall for their gamble.

Also with the easy capital from venture capitalists and banks that have funded these AAA gambles drying up, we're likely going to be seeing more "safe" titles and the innovative ideas fall to the XBLA, PSN and the DS/PSP.

IMO, with the lower development costs and the dominant marketshare of the Wii, there is an opportunity for brave companies to make their mark by innovating with different games to the HD consoles like the download services and handhelds have this generation.

ps: Lets Tap looks so crazy.....but at the same time strangely appealing.... I can't wait to try it out

 

[fearsomepirate]

yup, I read recently that only 20% of games that reach the market make any profit at all so its not surprising that companies are striving to make the next Halo or Gears of Wars and gain a big windfall for their gamble.

There are plenty of companies not trying to best Halo or GoW for the simple reason that a lot of folks in business understand that trying to trump someone else's success almost always leads to failure. The entertainment market values novelty, which is why "me-too" products rarely beat the originator, the exception being when the "me-too" product overcomes critical, glaring flaws in the original item that prevent it from reaching greater heights of success (WoW vs EQ, for example). Remember how many shooters were lauded as "Quake killers"? From last gen, we don't remember any Halo killers, because none of them came close...but we remember Splinter Cell and Burnout. In fact, the Xbox1 was supposed to be a PS2 killer (don't listen to the revisionist history on the web--dig up what Bill Gates and others were saying back in 2000), and we all remember how that turned out. The best you can reasonably hope for is riding the successful product's coattails to moderate success.

 

[obonicus]

There are plenty of companies not trying to best Halo or GoW for the simple reason that a lot of folks in business understand that trying to trump someone else's success almost always leads to failure. The entertainment market values novelty, which is why "me-too" products rarely beat the originator, the exception being when the "me-too" product overcomes critical, glaring flaws in the original item that prevent it from reaching greater heights of success (WoW vs EQ, for example). Remember how many shooters were lauded as "Quake killers"?

That's incredibly selective memory. Lots of FPS' didn't succeed, but lots did. A whole lot of FPS titles were forgotten when Halflife came out, but several of the developers who had games out at around the same time, such as Monolith, Epic are now powerhouses. Infinity Ward took the fanbase Halo built and coopted it with a title that isn't dramatically different from any shooter out there, just a lot more polished. And now Activision has one of the biggest, if not the biggest shooter franchise.

But directly back on topic, Dragon Quest X was announced for Wii. Not a big deal in the US, not even a shocker if you think about it (the only other system it could be on would be the DS, and for a probable 2010 release it might be a bit late even for the DSi) but it could mean greater developer support directed at the Wii, particularly for JRPGs. Personally, I don't think this changes much. Larger Japanese publishers will continue targeting their games towards the West, and will probably continue to support the HD consoles, giving the Wii games that have distinct Japanese appeal (like DQ, Monster Hunter, TvC). At least until someone proves that there's a market for upscale games on the Wii that's comparable to the same market on the HD consoles.

 

[DeadlyNinja]

I think people are too obsessed with "big budget" games. right now, games cost at least 10 million to make, what'll happen next generation when games get near 100 million level? I don't want to see that. I wouldn't mind playing small games like Braid or Lost Winds. These games are beautiful and creative. That's why I'm in love with 5th Cell's Scribblenauts. It's a really creative idea and it's from a small developer.

If only modern FPSes had the level design and toughness of Quake. Instead, we're getting rehashes of Medal of Honor.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks today's games are piss easy. My gaming skill are average AT BEST and I think today's games are too easy.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I'll agree with wishing for more creative titles from the big studios, but I wouldn't say there aren't a lot of good games out there. This fall, in particular, there were a lot of good games.

It's hard to please everybody. A lot of people do not enjoy losing, so games are made to challenge the player just enough that they're on the verge of dying/losing frequently, but rarely ever doing so. Then there's games like Fable2, which you really can't lose at, and it doesn't matter. I prefer games with options for extreme difficulty, but I'm open to games and concepts where it's not really about winning or losing.

 

[Turok]

I don't see what the big push for innovation is about. People love to dish out words like "tired" and "generic", but fun is the only one I would use to describe the numerous awesome shooters on the 360. The last thing I want to play is a game that is innovative for the sake of being innovative.

 

[Cheezdoodles]

*Where are the new good game ideas going to come from?

Weed + some tiny inspiriation can lead to alot of fun ideas.

 

[MrFloopy]

Weed + some tiny inspiriation can lead to alot of fun ideas.

But not a lot of implementation.

But seriously, I don't think ideas are the problem. The problem is design or lack there of.
It's very hard to find people that are truly designers.

 

[Nano]

Everywhere

The problem is many developers have aspects such as time and budget restricting them. I think time is the slightly bigger issue of the two personally.