When Tuesday does the G70 NDA expire?

[Geo]

or SC:CT at 16x12 with HDR and Soft Shadows with a single 7800 GTX

Sure, but that's a strawman for my argument --this is not an adjustment to a zero sum game that I'm asking for. When you have excess power running out your ears --use it. When you don't, you won't have to tell the user to dial it back; he'll figure it out for himself with some pretty direct feedback to help him! And, btw, another goodness for the IHVs --get him hooked on those higher settings and he'll start crying for a card with enough power to do those higher settings in those more ambitious situations too, strengthening your upgrade cycle. Win-win.

 

[digitalwanderer]

de gustibus non disputandum est

"the tastes is not a thing to discuss"? Why not?

 

[EasyRaider]

8x TSAA and 16x AF is already quite heavy IQ. Perhaps NV should have offered 16x AA (4xOGSS w/ 4xRGMS) in the driver panel, but I would much rather see higher quality texture filtering and 6x multisampling, which would require hardware changes.

edit:
Not to mention HDR with multisampling. I would take 800x600 4xAA over 1280x960 any day (as long as shader aliasing is handled).

 

[Megadrive1988]

NV40 ~ GeForce 6800 ====> G70 ~ GeForce 7800 GTX

kinda like:

Voodoo Banshee ====> Banshee2 ~ Avenger ~ Voodoo3

NV10 ~ GeForce ====> NV15 ~ GeForce 2 GTS

 

[nAo]

"the tastes is not a thing to discuss"? Why not?

Ancient latins were wise men

 

[digitalwanderer]

"the tastes is not a thing to discuss"? Why not?

Ancient latins were wise men

Yeah, that's why there are so many of them still around...

 

[Geeforcer]

NV40 ~ GeForce 6800 ====> G70 ~ GeForce 7800 GTX

kinda like:

Voodoo Banshee ====> Banshee2 ~ Avenger ~ Voodoo3

NV10 ~ GeForce ====> NV15 ~ GeForce 2 GTS

More like NV20 ~ GF3 ====> NV25 ~ GeForce 4 TI

 

[DemoCoder]

8x TSAA and 16x AF is already quite heavy IQ. Perhaps NV should have offered 16x AA (4xOGSS w/ 4xRGMS) in the driver panel, but I would much rather see higher quality texture filtering and 6x multisampling, which would require hardware changes.

edit:
Not to mention HDR with multisampling. I would take 800x600 4xAA over 1280x960 any day (as long as shader aliasing is handled).

Without supersampling, your 6xAA image will be aliased out the wazoo just like HL2, BF2, and many other games are today. Don't you find the flicker-fest of fences, rails, and grass *irritating* in these games?

 

[DemoCoder]

I'm wondering if the SS transp AA should also work on nv40 or does the G70 some special hardware support for it?

To be effective, it does require new hardware. It requires centroid texture sampling that is multisample-mask aware.

But PS_3_0 requires support for centroid sampling, so...

Centroid sampling uses the average position of all the samples covered to sample the texel. Depending on IHV implementation, it may or may not apply the multisample mask to the coverage first, because that particular detail is not in the DX specification. I'm not totally sure exactly why this is needed to produce good TSAA results, but there you go. I have a feeling you could pull this off on NV4x/R3xx, but you might introduce other artifacts. It might be a win, it might reintroduce texture-atlas problems (you might have to turn off centroid)

 

[Megadrive1988]

NV40 ~ GeForce 6800 ====> G70 ~ GeForce 7800 GTX

kinda like:

Voodoo Banshee ====> Banshee2 ~ Avenger ~ Voodoo3

NV10 ~ GeForce ====> NV15 ~ GeForce 2 GTS

More like NV20 ~ GF3 ====> NV25 ~ GeForce 4 TI

yeah that's another example.

 

[Geo]

Without supersampling, your 6xAA image will be aliased out the wazoo just like HL2, BF2, and many other games are today. Don't you find the flicker-fest of fences, rails, and grass *irritating* in these games?

Yeah, as I just said in the other thread, I missed the applicability to the ubiquitious ugly grass thing. This feature just got even niftier in my book.

 

[Blastman]

Come on 20% I feel the ATI force is still strong on this bulletinboard
I read a ton of reviews today and in eyecandysettings its mostly ~1,4-1,6 faster then a X850XTPE.

Those FS BF2 benches look bogus. Every other BF2 bench has the X850 XTPE well ahead of a 6800U. They’ve mixed up benches in the past, pasting 6800GT benches in place of 6600GT benches. Sometimes I think someone at FS has their 5 year old kid sister cutting and pasting those benches.

Other BF2 benches...

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=Nzg0LDE3
http://www.techreport.com/reviews/2005q2/geforce-7800gtx/index.x?pg=9
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2451&p=8

 

[EasyRaider]

Without supersampling, your 6xAA image will be aliased out the wazoo just like HL2, BF2, and many other games are today. Don't you find the flicker-fest of fences, rails, and grass *irritating* in these games?

I don't really have the hardware to play the latest games, but yeah, I find any form of aliasing hugely distracting. Maybe I misunderstood, but I got the impression geo was asking for even higher and slower IQ settings than what the 7800 driver panel currently offers. I think that would be kind of moot, it would hardly ever be used. OTOH, 6x MS with selective SS would have been very useful, but the hardware unfortunately doesn't support it.

 

[Jawed]

It would appear that NVidia is keeping 16xAA as an option for SLI systems, even though in older games it would be playable (presumably!) on 7800GTX.

Jawed

 

[Geo]

Geo is asking for that. Getting NV's "tweakable" AA levels available in the control panel, where they'd actually be reviewed by the major sites, would be a darn good step. You ain't got enuf hardware to make it go, or the particular game feature (some HDR stuff) makes it impractible, then don't use it. Looks to me like it isn't even much of an investment for NV to do it (a couple hours of driver guy time?)

 

[EasyRaider]

I wonder, is G70 capable of straight, full scene RGSS? It should be, right? If so, maybe that could be applied in FP16 mode? 800x600 4xRGSS is an improvement over 1600x1200 in my book. As it stands, I would rather disable HDR than AA.

 

[JF_Aidan_Pryde]

Why are those screenshots with transparent multi-sampling showing no benefit with alpha textures?

 

[Geeforcer]

Those FS BF2 benches look bogus. Every other BF2 bench has the X850 XTPE well ahead of a 6800U. They’ve mixed up benches in the past, pasting 6800GT benches in place of 6600GT benches. Sometimes I think someone at FS has their 5 year old kid sister cutting and pasting those benches.

Other BF2 benches...

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=Nzg0LDE3
http://www.techreport.com/reviews/2005q2/geforce-7800gtx/index.x?pg=9
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2451&p=8

Everyone is using their own demo, so the results are not comparable from site to site.

 

[compres]

I got to as you guys: Is Xfire DOA?

I mean what's the ponint of releasing xfire now, they wont beat the 7800sli.

 

[digitalwanderer]

I mean what's the ponint of releasing xfire now, they wont beat the 7800sli.

Do we know that for sure, and will a Crossfire R520 beat a 7800sli?