Well, that about wraps it up for blu-ray.

[Magnum PI]

exaclty in situations where small chucks of downtime (file\print server) I think clustered Linux(on x86 hardware) has huge advantages(we do some of that) but when you need 100% uptime and high level app support there really isn't any alternative to

Linux is as reliable as solaris or windows. It's not a hobbyist-only thing (do you think s/390 are made for hobbyists), it's ready for critical/enterprise use.

You can have any commercial support you want.

We use it to run critical applications, and the uptime is very good.
We are extending its use for years in our enterprise, replacing Windows and Solaris servers.

 

[c0_re]

ok so your saying there's as much professional support and knowledge base materael out there for Lunix as there is for Windows and Solaris. Companies load test most of their stuff primary on windows these days, do they ake other versions sure they do. Also I dont have to pay a windows admin 150,000 grand a year, I can buy 3 of them forthat price plus get Microsoft\Cisco support for load balancing and clustering.

Can I have an 8 node Linux cluster with 4 nodes in the states and 4 of the other nodes in Tailand and have vendor approved documentation and support for the whole thing, highly unlikely.

Linox will never be where all you unix folks think it will until someone takes it over and makes it NOT open source it's just not going to happen you can live in whatever dreamworld you like we migrated all of our apps from Mainframes to Windows no one siad it could be done we did it, because we had Microshaft with us all the way to fix any little problem that came up, that just would not have been possible on a open source linux platform.

and don't even get me started on development costs, Microsoft kills everyone there developing for windows is soooooo much cheaper than any other platform right now there's just no comparison.

There's alot of factors involved from a corporate standpoint, not just "can you do it"

Like I said we use Linux for some things but other just are not exceptable

 

[Shifty Geezer]

WWWAAAYYYYYYY off topic, guys!

 

[Magnum PI]

ok so your saying there's as much professional support and knowledge base materael out there for Lunix as there is for Windows and Solaris.

I didn't say that. There is as much support as one would ever need.

Companies load test most of their stuff primary on windows these days, do they ake other versions sure they do. Also I dont have to pay a windows admin 150,000 grand a year, I can buy 3 of them forthat price plus get Microsoft\Cisco support for load balancing and clustering.

Here Linux admins aren't much more expensive that windows one, and very far from being paid 150 000 grand, unfortunately.

Can I have an 8 node Linux cluster with 4 nodes in the states and 4 of the other nodes in Tailand and have vendor approved documentation and support for the whole thing, highly unlikely.

I guess you see configurations like that every day..
I see nothing that would prevent that.. just ask IBM, Redhat or SGI..

If you take the top500 supercomputer list you'll see that Linux is gaining in popularity for years, now it has more than half of them:
http://www.top500.org/lists/2005/06/overtime.php?c=8
Where are windows clusters ? Why aren't they dominating ?

Linox will never be where all you unix folks think it will until someone takes it over and makes it NOT open source

If you know what you are talking about, you must nows that linux (the kernel), due to its license, can't be taken over and made closed source. I don't see how it could make Linux have more success, having access to kernel sources proved to be very useful to me..

This doesn't prevent companies like Redhat to make commercial distribution that are not freely redistribuable and that are more and more like commercial unixes in terms of packaging and support options, just a lot cheaper..

I don't care about Linux dominating or not I'm just happy of the big savings we make, we can do a lot of things we couldn't afford to do with windows..
We still use windows for the desktop and the thin clients..

it's just not going to happen you can live in whatever dreamworld you like we migrated all of our apps from Mainframes to Windows no one siad it could be done we did it, because we had Microshaft with us all the way to fix any little problem that came up, that just would not have been possible on a open source linux platform.

We migrated from mainframe to solaris, now we are mainly using linux and solaris.

I guess each OS has its strength and its weakness.

You are talking of linux like if things didn't change for the last ten years .. Where are you been all these years ?

 

[c0_re]

Hey man don't get me wrong on a one to one basis no windows box can compete with a Linux box, not even close. One other thing I should clairify is when I say reliabuility I mean things like hard drive failures, power supplies, hardware failures not OS issues thats another one where Linux wins out(but window has gotten much much better with 2003)

I know companies like Compaq and IBM make "good" propriatary clustering solutions for Linux that do work but thats not the same thing as having it built inot the operating system from the ground up, where widows wins is the factthat everything is built in and supported by one or 2 companies(Microsoft and your applicaiton vendor) no customization or additional software\hardware needed in most cases and I don't need of team 5 application\hardware\OS engineers to troubleshoot the issue.

It's pretty tough to beat multiple load balanced cluster farms as far as reliabuility goes especially when you have all the money you want to throw at the hardware aspect of the problem.

 

[MechanizedDeath]

MS can't demand anything from a manufacturer that's beyond the software license. Dell can pack all PCs with an MO drive as standard if they wanted to. Vista also will no ship on HD-DVD. Not now, probably not ever. DVD is supported by both BD and HD-DVD, and an OS that takes more than a DL-DVD for an install is probably not really an OS...it's a trainwreck. HD-DVD is still dead in the water IMO. Until MS and Intel start making drives, I don't see how this news has changed anything. PEACE.

 

[wco81]

MS can't demand anything from a manufacturer that's beyond the software license. Dell can pack all PCs with an MO drive as standard if they wanted to. Vista also will no ship on HD-DVD. Not now, probably not ever. DVD is supported by both BD and HD-DVD, and an OS that takes more than a DL-DVD for an install is probably not really an OS...it's a trainwreck. HD-DVD is still dead in the water IMO. Until MS and Intel start making drives, I don't see how this news has changed anything. PEACE.

It would not be surprising if MS and Intel put a full-court press on Dell and HP to flip. Dell has been a loyal Intel customer and has been rewarded with financial inducements to remain so.

I believe the Centrino program rewards co-op advertising dollars as well as the logo, which Intel advertises on its own. They will probably do something similar with the ViiV brand. Maybe like Centrino required using Intel wireless hardware, ViiV will require the use of HD-DVD drives. So if Dell and HP want to ship branded ViiV computers, with all the co-op money and branding benefits, maybe they will flip.

One of the main advantages of Blu-Ray is that it's just better for recordability. You can burn and edit BR discs and be more assured that they will play back on any Blu-Ray drive. So that will be good for home video enthusiasts, who tend to buy more expensive computers. Other than that, I'm not sure what Dell and HP's allegiance to Blu-Ray would be.

 

[a688]

It would not be surprising if MS and Intel put a full-court press on Dell and HP to flip. Dell has been a loyal Intel customer and has been rewarded with financial inducements to remain so.

I believe the Centrino program rewards co-op advertising dollars as well as the logo, which Intel advertises on its own. They will probably do something similar with the ViiV brand. Maybe like Centrino required using Intel wireless hardware, ViiV will require the use of HD-DVD drives. So if Dell and HP want to ship branded ViiV computers, with all the co-op money and branding benefits, maybe they will flip.

One of the main advantages of Blu-Ray is that it's just better for recordability. You can burn and edit BR discs and be more assured that they will play back on any Blu-Ray drive. So that will be good for home video enthusiasts, who tend to buy more expensive computers. Other than that, I'm not sure what Dell and HP's allegiance to Blu-Ray would be.

Who would Dell switch to? AMD? Last I heard, AMD doesn't have the capacity to supply anybody as large as Dell. There is a reason why Dell uses Intel. For clairification, the Centrino was for a combination of the Processor (Pentium M), chipset, and (Intel) wireless card. Also, how the hell is Blu-Ray "better for recordability"? I see what you wrote but it implies that HD-DVD drives can't read all HD-DVD discs which sounds ridiculous. I also remember when DVD-R beat DVD+R because it was readable by more drives. The only thing about Blu-Ray that is "good for recordability" is the amount of data it can store compared to HD-DVD but storage space isn't everything.

 

[Magnum PI]

Who would Dell switch to? AMD? Last I heard, AMD doesn't have the capacity to supply anybody as large as Dell. There is a reason why Dell uses Intel.

Instead of switching to AMD, Dell could offer some AMD-based models.
Intel gives them much money to prevent that.