Uncharted 4: A Thief's End [PS4]

[VFX_Veteran]

My thoughts on this:

Yes, the E3 trailer was running on a PS4. Yes, the gameplay cutscenes rival the quality of the E3 trailer. However, the gameplay is significantly worse than the E3 footage. It's clearly a difference. What people are expecting to see is:

Gameplay you see this:

 

[Nesh]

I popped the gamersyde high quality video on my 55' TV and oh God it looked so much better. The intro almost impressed me as much as the E3 trailer. For some reason I feel that the game might actually look very close to the E3 trailer during the "night"

 

[djskribbles]

My thoughts on this:

Yes, the E3 trailer was running on a PS4. Yes, the gameplay cutscenes rival the quality of the E3 trailer. However, the gameplay is significantly worse than the E3 footage. It's clearly a difference. What people are expecting to see is:

Gameplay you see this:

Are you trying to show the foliage differences? Because they're in two different times of day.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Are you trying to show the foliage differences? Because they're in two different times of day.

The different times of day doesn't matter in these 2 images. There are enough differences in modeling, textures, and shaders to tell that they are using different assets and different shaders. Do you really think the two are identical except the time of day?

 

[bgroovy]

They are different locations. Different times of day. Drake is wet in one and dry in the other. Direct comparisons can't tell us much of anything.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

They are different locations. Different times of day. Drake is wet in one and dry in the other. Direct comparisons can't tell us much of anything.

A different location, time of day, dry/wet shouldn't display that much of a change visuals.

Those are different locations and different times of day too. And the model, textures, and shaders hold up really well.

 

[London Geezer]

And the scenes are, literally, night and day. What many games have shown is that lighting can be be much more dramatic at night. Throw in some water and bingo.

Absolutely. Look what a bit of rain and lightning did to Driveclub and you'll see that it doesn't take much to make something look entirely different and much more 'CGI looking'.

 

[ultragpu]

Did a quick contrast adjustment and color filter in PS, aside from the different lighting angle you can see the model and texture res are exactly the same, can't judge the shader quality since E3 Drake was obviously half wet. The only difference is the hair rendering seems to get much better AA coverage in the E3 demo.

 

[Phil]

I just re-watched the E3 teaser and about the foliage; Has it occured to anyone that perhaps, the E3 teaser seems to have a denser foliage due to the fact that it's a controled cut-scene with very limited scale? In the gameplay sequence, you see Nate in action platforming in a very wide open area. Even the areas that seem off area, turn out to be actual places where you can go and explore. Rewind back to the E3 teaser and we have a scene, which probably received lots of polish to make it into the teaser that was revealed. Limited scale, huge focus on Nate close-up, one light-source and a slow pan showing the dense foliage.

I don't think it takes much effort into imagening that a very controlled scene, even at 60fps, gives a lot more scope to turn up the bar on everything, compared to a gameplay extract of 15 minutes that covers 1% of the entire game. We've all played heaps of games here, and even in the most impressive games, we rarely see a game that is consistent at its very best at all times. There will always be scenes and parts that get more polish or impress more than others. Uncharted 2, for instance, I think the generally some of the best moments are to be found in the later stages of the game (the Himalaya village). Same goes for KZ2 where the level on the moving train is extremely impressive.

Personally, I think the picture above from ultragpu shows quite nicely how the character from the E3 teaser and the gameplay reveal compare to each other. I personally find that very encouraging, even if the latter was running (for now) at half the framerate. To expect that the whole game will mimic what we see in the teaser is highly unrealstic, but all the same, I have absolutely no doubt that in the right scenes, it will impress on a very similar level, even during gameplay. Unfortunately, daytime scenes will always exagerate the flaws in games because we can see much more.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Did a quick contrast adjustment and color filter in PS, aside from the different lighting angle you can see the model and texture res are exactly the same, can't judge the shader quality since E3 Drake was obviously half wet. The only difference is the hair rendering seems to get much better AA coverage in the E3 demo.

The differences between the E3 reveal and the gameplay cutscenes was really never in question. It's more about the actual gameplay comparing to the E3 reveal.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

I just re-watched the E3 teaser and about the foliage; Has it occured to anyone that perhaps, the E3 teaser seems to have a denser foliage due to the fact that it's a controled cut-scene with very limited scale? In the gameplay sequence, you see Nate in action platforming in a very wide open area. Even the areas that seem off area, turn out to be actual places where you can go and explore. Rewind back to the E3 teaser and we have a scene, which probably received lots of polish to make it into the teaser that was revealed. Limited scale, huge focus on Nate close-up, one light-source and a slow pan showing the dense foliage.

I don't think it takes much effort into imagening that a very controlled scene, even at 60fps, gives a lot more scope to turn up the bar on everything, compared to a gameplay extract of 15 minutes that covers 1% of the entire game. We've all played heaps of games here, and even in the most impressive games, we rarely see a game that is consistent at its very best at all times. There will always be scenes and parts that get more polish or impress more than others. Uncharted 2, for instance, I think the generally some of the best moments are to be found in the later stages of the game (the Himalaya village). Same goes for KZ2 where the level on the moving train is extremely impressive.

Exactly this.

 

[ultragpu]

The differences between the E3 reveal and the gameplay cutscenes was really never in question. It's more about the actual gameplay comparing to the E3 reveal.

And how is this pic I did comparison with not from the actual gameplay? It cuts seamlessly into gameplay with no sudden drop of quality.

 

[Phil]

I still think the differences we are seeing and judging are down to a level of polish. If ND say the E3 teaser was running on actual hardware in realtime at 60fps, I see no reason to doubt them. Fact is; They probably had lots of time and effort to dedicate to a fixed limited cutscene type scene at X part in the game and now, several months later, they decided to show us an extract from actual "work-in-progress" that shows us part Y-Z of the game and is actually playable with A.I. opponents and a scale with foliage that spans a pretty large area that is all explorable. And that, all at day-time. Given that the game is still just about a year from release, it's only logical to assume that this rather large area they've just revealed hasn't received the amount of polish that the teaser did.

I think it's unlikely that the gameplay footage at daylight we've seen will ever look "as good" (even with way more polish) as what that E3 teaser at moonlight managed to capture in our minds, even if it's identical assets and engine - the scale at which everything is running is just too large and the day time will always reveal much more detail IMO. But at the same time, I am not doubting that more controlled tighter areas of the game, perhaps even within the same moon-light setting can and will look as good as what was shown in the E3 teaser.

 

[ultragpu]

Yeah the build they showed at PSX was obviously very pre alpha, I can see many missing effects such as object motion blur, volumetric sun shaft, bokeh DOF all of which even UC3 has in the retail version. So I'm pretty sure ND must felt reluctant to reveal the gameplay to the public so soon, also it would be best to reserve judgement until we eventually do get to see the in game version of that twilight scene.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

... it would be best to reserve judgement until we eventually do get to see the in game version of that twilight scene.

Can we please stop with these calls to never discuss a game until it's out? Happens every frickin' game! People are entitled to talk about what they see, right or wrong. If we hold off talking about what we see until the game is finished, these threads will be pretty pointless until release. No commentary on what we like or don't like about the game, our hopes, our concerns, enthusiasm or disappointment. Seriously, what's the point of game discussion threads prior to a game's release if not to discuss it as a WIP??

If someone claims Naughty Dog, or some other dev, is a useless dev for failing with a WIP to match targets, then they can be brought to task. But if someone's discussing a WIP and saying it's not currently reaching expectations/promises/hopes, that's perfectly allowed. It happens constantly, especially in big-ticket, flagship, hyped titles. Anyone making judgements now, a year from release, is an idiot, but discussion doesn't mean making judgements. ND hasn't been judged. People are just talking about what they (personally) see in the E3 trailer and the PSX gameplay.

 

[Karamazov]

i don't mind if cutscene characters are more detailed and with better effects, i even encourage this, i want beautiful real time cutscenes.
Why do people want to waste ressource budget to have the same character during gameplay, it's useless if you don't see him in close up most of the time. How many of you have noticed that car detail in DC switches to high lod from gamplay to photo mode ?

gameplay:
http://i.imgur.com/e99TGVN.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kTCKmSr.jpg

photo mode:
http://i.imgur.com/lyO73YZ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/gGTl1L4.jpg

 

[VFX_Veteran]

And how is this pic I did comparison with not from the actual gameplay? It cuts seamlessly into gameplay with no sudden drop of quality.

For 2 reasons.

1) There is a pop if you pay attention to his gun holster from the back.

2) You can clearly see it's not the same kind of rendering when he's moving around. Look at the environments and how it's rendered. One looks almost CG-quality. The other looks like a videogame.

 

[GuestLV]

www.dualshockers.com/2014/12/15/uncharted-4-developer-explains-differences-between-e3-trailer-and-gameplay-teases-new-levels-and-more

 

[Nesh]

very interesting

 

[London Geezer]

As many had already said... Common sense.