Toshiba Cell Based Console?

[groper]

off-topic

First of all, you did not mention good settings before.

Maybe i didn't express my self clearly before. I mean that if all i want is just good settings i dont need to spend money to build a gaming PC at all. I can stay with my console instead.

And further, that rig that you showed right there, it wont run games at "good" settings, it will run everything more or less maxed until atleast mid 2008 maybe as far as 2009.
(The 8800GTX runs Crysis maxed with all DX10 settings on at 30+ fps at high resolutions).

I dont think so. This is a very early dx10 pc. If you build a pc like this(with a 1st gen dx10 card) you will find very soon , actually from the first demanding dx10 games , that you have to turn down some of the graphical features in order to keep a decent framerate ( about 80-90% of the graphical features enabled for 2007 games and 70-80% for 2008games)
As for the dx10 graphical features of Crysis:

IGN: Are there any disadvantages or aspects more difficult to deal with than DX9? In addition to prettier visuals, does DX10 improve performance (framerate) as well, or have you found your game takes a hit?
Cevat Yerli: We will deliver quite a few options for the user to decide what they will be able to achieve with DX10, but enabling all areas to be improved is somewhat not possible currently. But we are adding future scalability for the sake of longevity - in any case, you will get a top notch DX10 experience.

But if you only need to play games to medium\high settings (note : high is not the same as highest), you do not need a system remotely close to that.

As i said in my first post if i want to play dx10 games with what you call good settings i dont need to spend a cent . I will stay with my console.

Further, alot of the prices your putting up in your cute little is is total BS prices. You do not need to pay 100 euros for casing, you can get a proper one for $50. You do not need 320GB of harddrive space to run new games. You do not need a 70 euro sound car. You can find a adequate mobo for $80.. You can find good enough power supply's for $70...

100 bucks is just for a good PC case , not a very good or one of the best. Surely i could pay 15 bucks for a wooden box...
The same goes for the power supply.
For the mobo , An Asus P5B mobo cost 139 euros and in a technical comparison it was No 14 to a total of 24 mobos for Intel Core Duo. I mean its just a good mobo not among the best.
70euros was the cheaper sound card (bulk with EAX 4.0 support) that i could find searching in the two biggest retailers of my country.
As for the hard drive you dont build a 2007 pc with a hard drive smaller than 200gb.
A 200GB SATA2 with 16 MB buffer cost aproximatelly from 80euros and up and we dont even speak for a 10000 rpm hard disk.

 

[tongue_of_colicab]

I dont think so. This is a very early dx10 pc. If you build a pc like this(with a 1st gen dx10 card) you will find very soon , actually from the first demanding dx10 games , that you have to turn down some of the graphical features in order to keep a decent framerate ( about 80-90% of the graphical features enabled for 2007 games and 70-80% for 2008games)
As for the dx10 graphical features of Crysis:

I dont see why having a early dx10 card will force you to upgrade earlier. The radeon 9700pro was the firt dx9 card and its still usable in current games. Sure not at high settings but you can still play games with it a decent settings. And that card is already more than 3 years old?

 

[Cheezdoodles]

I dont think so. This is a very early dx10 pc. If you build a pc like this(with a 1st gen dx10 card) you will find very soon , actually from the first demanding dx10 games , that you have to turn down some of the graphical features in order to keep a decent framerate ( about 80-90% of the graphical features enabled for 2007 games and 70-80% for 2008games)

8800GTX runs Crysis maxed...

100 bucks is just for a good PC case , not a very good or one of the best. Surely i could pay 15 bucks for a wooden box...
The same goes for the power supply.
For the mobo , An Asus P5B mobo cost 139 euros and in a technical comparison it was No 14 to a total of 24 mobos for Intel Core Duo. I mean its just a good mobo not among the best.
70euros was the cheaper sound card (bulk with EAX 4.0 support) that i could find searching in the two biggest retailers of my country. .

Thats irrelevant, wether the case is the best or not. It doesnt matter. As long as it runs properly and lets you run the games you want at the settings you want its IRRELEVANT wether you got a $2000 case or a $20 one.. So please stop embarasing yourself. You do not need to spend $2000 every 2 years to play pc games at high graphical settings. Its a myth.

You think you you will notice a performance decrease\increase from buying a $200 mobo to a $80 mobo if they both support the exact same things?

I can tell you right now, that the differences will not be something you would notice.

Do you even own a gaming pc? Because it seems like your just trying to run around and proove that PC's costs more than consoles.

And please, dont give me some BS argument, thats something similar to "yeah but you cannot run every game that comes out in 2 years on max settings", because fact is, if i go and spend $1000 on a new PC right now, im going to have better graphics than any of the consoles untill the next generation begins, sometime in the next decade..

 

[groper]

8800GTX runs Crysis maxed...

Where is the benchmark / link ?

 

[Cheezdoodles]

Where is the benchmark / link ?

The head developer from Crytek showed it off at the 8800GTX launch, and said "this is what crysis looks maxed, and this is how it runs on a G80", then he started playing.. You will probably find it at Gamespot if you search for cysis and look at the movies..

 

[groper]

The head developer from Crytek showed it off at the 8800GTX launch, and said "this is what crysis looks maxed, and this is how it runs on a G80", then he started playing.. You will probably find it at Gamespot if you search for cysis and look at the movies..

He was C.Yerli . He showcase a multiplayer part of the game at the Nvidia 8800 release show and he played on words as it happens in any event like this.
I mean , what did you expect in a PR event ?
I already show you what he said for the DX10 features of Crysis in his latest interview a few days ago and this time it wasnt PR talk but the truth.
Not only you need aproximatelly 2.000 euros to build a pc capable to play games like crysis but also you will be able to play those games with the 90% of their feautures enabled and not totaly maxed out.
Of cousrse someone may be miser enough to try save 100-150 euros bying a shoddy mobo and case but i cant see how this change the fact that you need more or less this amount of money to build this kind of gaming pc.

Do you even own a gaming pc? Because it seems like your just trying to run around and proove that PC's costs more than consoles

Yes i own one but i m not a pc f@nboy to run around and try proove that you can play crysis maxed out with a 1000 bucks when , as a matter of fact , It will not be possible even with a 2000 pc.

 

[Almasy]

I don't get the point of the PC advocates here. Having read the most optimistic of scenarios (this one)

I thought people at beyond 3d knew better than saying that a you have to buy a new pc for 2,000 every 2 years in order to play games..

For $1000 bucks you can easly build a pc that will run any game out there at good settings. If you countinously upgrade, you can keep playing every game out there without paying 2k every 2 years.
500 a year would easly keep you PC in the High end area, being able to play all the new games pretty much maxed. You can go as low as 500 every 2 years and still keep up.

I just don't get it. You need AT LEAST $1000 Euros just to get started, without the most advanced components, and you still need to invest $500 Euros or so per year to keep up?? That's the equivalent of buying a PS3 every single year, to me that's ridiculously expensive and only people with too much cash in their wallets and not enough gray matter would engage in that kind of activity. The value just isn't there, unless of course one loves to get a couple of extra frames per second for their $500.

 

[Cheezdoodles]

im not recommending people to do it. im just saying that for an initial investment of 1k and 500k per year you would be able to play pretty much everything more or less maxed, at all times.

 

[AntShaw]

I think it's somewhat funny that only one of the examples in the OP include an HD DVD drive while the others include DVD-9. Surely Toshiba, the developer of HD DVD, wouldn't put anything less than HD DVD in if they ever did develop a game console?

Which stupid company would put an old gen drive in a next gen system?

Oh, wait....

Oh wait, don't some of these ring any bells (In No Particluar order

BetaMax
ATRAC (minidisc)
UMD
SDDS (Granted it was never released for consumers, I find it vastly inferior to DTS)
MMCD
SACD
Blu-Ray

Just because a next gen device releases it with a next gen format, doesn't make it an automatic genius busniess decision.

Sadly in many of the instances, us consumers get burnt on many of this. Especially us 'early adopters/innovators' While we make up a smalr percent of the overall market, we are the ones that have a huge impact on how succesful devices/formats end up being.

To also note, Sony has moved the other formats after theirs had proven to be unsuccesful in the marketplace.

To bring us back to the OP, just dismissing a DVD-9 device in a Toshiba based system is pointless at this time in the game. Who knows, 6-12 months from now, either Blu-ray or HD-DVD could be obsolete in the market.

I find it amusing that everyone automatically assumes Sony will win out with its Blu-Ray format. Their track record has not been impressive regardless of how much support they have had, nor how much 'superiror' their format appeared.

 

[inefficient]

Oh wait, don't some of these ring any bells (In No Particluar order

BetaMax
ATRAC (minidisc)
UMD
SDDS (Granted it was never released for consumers, I find it vastly inferior to DTS)
MMCD
SACD
Blu-Ray

I find it amusing that everyone automatically assumes Sony will win out with its Blu-Ray format. Their track record has not been impressive regardless of how much support they have had, nor how much 'superiror' their format appeared.

Minidisc was a huge success in Japan. And BetaMax managed to carve out it's niche even though it didn't win in the consumer space.

Anyway you can't hit everytime when inventing cutting edge products. And you don't list Sony's inventions that did take off with consumers. For example CDs. The Compact Disc was a Sony/Philips creation. So was the S/PDIF interface that is seen all over the place in consumer devices. There was the Video8 format Sony created that took off for camcorders etc etc.

Fact is Sony leveraged their CD technology for the first PS - smashing sucess. Then they leveraged DVD technology for the PS2 - smashing success for both DVD and PS2. Now they are leveraging BlurRay for the PS3 - and you find it "amusing" people expect it to be a win.

 

[MasaC]

AntShaw:

Failed, you have.

 

[Naboomagnoli]

im just saying that for an initial investment of 1k and 500k per year you would be able to play pretty much everything more or less maxed, at all times.

At 500k per year?!? I should bloody hope so!

 

[Gubbi]

Minidisc was a huge success in Japan. And BetaMax managed to carve out it's niche even though it didn't win in the consumer space.

Anyway you can't hit everytime when inventing cutting edge products. And you don't list Sony's inventions that did take off with consumers. For example CDs. The Compact Disc was a Sony/Philips creation. So was the S/PDIF interface that is seen all over the place in consumer devices. There was the Video8 format Sony created that took off for camcorders etc etc.

Fact is Sony leveraged their CD technology for the first PS - smashing sucess. Then they leveraged DVD technology for the PS2 - smashing success for both DVD and PS2. Now they are leveraging BlurRay for the PS3 - and you find it "amusing" people expect it to be a win.

I don't think it is amusing, but you have to consider why MiniDisc and BetaMax failed, and CD and DVD succeeded. MiniDisc and BetaMax were both technical superior than any other technology at the time. However Sony royalty policies prevented wide spread adoption.
BetaMax lost out to a direct competitor, VHS, whose originator, JVC, had a VHS everywhere policy.
MiniDisc failed to gain critical mass until solid state players entered the market.

If Sony tries to force a format on the CE/media industry, it will fail. What they should do is make sure that Korean and Chinese (and Taiwanese) producers can ramp production of cheap good quality BluRay products. If they fail to do that, BluRay might not reach critical mass and will end up being a net cost for Sony.

Time is a factor here. If Sony drags their feet, the Chinese will make their own standard, and you can bet it will be very cost-conscious which will ensure massive adoption.

Cheers

 

[London Geezer]

I don't think it is amusing, but you have to consider why MiniDisc and BetaMax failed, and CD and DVD succeeded. MiniDisc and BetaMax were both technical superior than any other technology at the time. However Sony royalty policies prevented wide spread adoption.
BetaMax lost out to a direct competitor, VHS, whose originator, JVC, had a VHS everywhere policy.
MiniDisc failed to gain critical mass until solid state players entered the market.

How is that relevant to Bluray? If anything, it looks like Bluray is in the position of VHS now (if you compare it to that format generation), and to CD/DVD if you look at the console support...

VHS comparison: You can buy Panasonic, Sony, Samsung, LG and Philips Bluray players now, with more coming, and with more potential content available for it, but can only buy Toshiba HDDVD players.

CD/DVD: Bluray is standard in one console which will sell millions of units. HDDVD is "optional".

If Sony tries to force a format on the CE/media industry, it will fail. What they should do is make sure that Korean and Chinese (and Taiwanese) producers can ramp production of cheap good quality BluRay products.

Well at the moment, with the problems with blue diodes, both Bluray and HDDVD have their manufacturing slowed down by a whole lot - HDDVD has been delayed in Europe till March because of it, and second generation HDDVD players have been delayed worldwide. And to be honest, seen how many manufacturers are already manufacturing Bluray players compared to HDDVD, i expect the Chinese to start following the masses. Heck, i actually expect them to start manufacturing cheap hybrid players before anyone else anyway.

If they fail to do that, BluRay might not reach critical mass and will end up being a net cost for Sony.

Time is a factor here. If Sony drags their feet, the Chinese will make their own standard, and you can bet it will be very cost-conscious which will ensure massive adoption.

What "own standard"? Another one, different from Bluray and HDDVD? Yeah that will be successful... If Bluray or HDDVD aren't "successful", nothing else will and things will just move to downloads, like i've thought they would for a long time.

 

[Gubbi]

VHS comparison: You can buy Panasonic, Sony, Samsung, LG and Philips Bluray players now, with more coming, and with more potential content available for it, but can only buy Toshiba HDDVD players.

Completely irrelevant. If the cost of BluRay is set so high that it bars wide spread adoption it will fail. Either because people will stick with regular DVDs, or the hypothetical chinese player.

First with a player to $100 wins.

What "own standard"? Another one, different from Bluray and HDDVD? Yeah that will be successful... If Bluray or HDDVD aren't "successful", nothing else will and things will just move to downloads, like i've thought they would for a long time.

Yeah it will be succesful if they can make HD players with an ASP at ~$100. Part of cutting cost is avoiding roalties for codecs.

Cheers

 

[_phil_]

I 'm not sure the chinese HD format will have anything but chinese made movies on it...

 

[ban25]

Time is a factor here. If Sony drags their feet, the Chinese will make their own standard, and you can bet it will be very cost-conscious which will ensure massive adoption.

Do you honestly believe Hollywood will adopt a Chinese standard, or that consumers will flock to CCP propaganda films?