The old and unwieldy GTA4 thread*

[iceberg187]

Ok, correct me then, I'm all ear:smile:

I'm not saying it's 100% fact. I'm just saying that, it is possible that, the lack of standard HDD in the 360 and the limited DVD format could cause the delay, because the developer might have to take their time to work around those limitation. I'm not bashing the 360, I'm just stating the possibilities

Open world games are one of the ones that are easiest to fit on a disc. The HDD might be an issue, but disc size isn't. GTA:SA last gen game data was 1.5GB, and audio brought the final total to 2.86GB on the Xbox. This generation, Microsoft has even better compression for audio.

 

[-tkf-]

And according to tkf and todd this is just as plausible as the PS3 being behind development (when all that has been shown is X360 builds).

Ehmm i don´t think i said that did i, i said (in other words) PR releases that favor Sony are "lies" while PR releases that are MS postive are "facts".

The 360 version of GTA4 was in no condition to be shipped, and i guess neither was the PS3. Or lets turnit around. How about Rockstar not wanting to show that the PS3 version ran better and looked better and therefore they kept it secret.

We can free form all day, we are guessing, especially when a PR release isn´t worth the bytes it fills on a harddrive.

 

[-tkf-]

And you're wrong.
see!

I guess they are good at making games, not programming them. Are you sure this is a DMA Design guy?

 

[Cheezdoodles]

Ehmm i don´t think i said that did i, i said (in other words) PR releases that favor Sony are "lies" while PR releases that are MS postive are "facts".

I asked you tkf, what PR? What PR have you been refering to that has come out the last 2 days (counting from yesterday?)

All i have seen is some analysts bs, and some completely insane anti-ms blog BS. Your still unable to produce anything else, and you previously in this very thread stated that we only believe one side of the story because it suits us better.

 

[-tkf-]

I asked you tkf, what PR? What PR have you been refering to that has come out the last 2 days (counting from yesterday?)

All i have seen is some analysts bs, and some completely insane anti-ms blog BS. Your still unable to produce anything else, and you previously in this very thread stated that we only believe one side of the story because it suits us better.

A Devloper working on PGR4 mentions space constraints on the XBO 360, a PR is released that says "no" and it quoted here as fact.

A PR regarding GTA4 is released stating that Rockstar needs help from Microsoft and Sony in order to get the game done and running proper. Obvisouly it´s a lie and the reason it´s delayed is that the PS3 version doesn´t run.

 

[Cheezdoodles]

A Devloper working on PGR4 mentions space constraints on the XBO 360, a PR is released that says "no" and it quoted here as fact.

How does this relate at all to GTA? Are PGR4 and GTA4 sharing the same game data?

Are you saying GTA4 is delayed because of space constraints (based on that alien compression technology rumor?) Do you seriously think that an experienced developer like R* actually manages to run out of disc space and this results in a 6month delay?

Come on!! What do you think happend? They made the game and suddenly, WHOOPS!!! Its 18GB big! They aren't retards over at R*, obviously they designed it to fit within the constrains of a DVD9.

A PR regarding GTA4 is released stating that Rockstar needs help from Microsoft and Sony in order to get the game done and running proper. Obvisouly it´s a lie and the reason it´s delayed is that the PS3 version doesn´t run.

Nobody said it was a lie.

 

[iceberg187]

Blimblim said this about Crackdown today

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=7298617&postcount=430

I don't see why it wouldn't be possible. Sandbox game may have a lot of stuff for the actual sandbox, but they also have lots and lots cutscenes/voices that are only used once during the actual story. By having half of these on the first disc and the rest on the second disc, it could definitely work. Like I said before, the world, characters and other 3d models in Crackdown are only 800 MB.

 

[SugarCoat]

I guess they are good at making games, not programming them. Are you sure this is a DMA Design guy?

i made that up... you have to understand that PR for the most part is used to simply smooth over the situation and can easily contain bias, no matter what type, and him posting some random comment out of the official playstation magazine simply struck me as humerous so i responded in kind.

The simple fact is this, there are countless comments praising the development package microsoft is supplying with the 360, and then theres others saying the PS3 is simply harder to work with, and a few games are even suffering because of it, more and more are coming to light as time goes on. So i tend to swim with the stream of where common sense points, not into it as a few here are doing. I still say they were planning to launch something, i've never seen a publisher release the contents package for elaborate CEs then delay the game its for, for over half a year. Lets not forget the engine used was designed first and foremost for the 360 to begin with. Some people just need to relax and realize that it very well problably is the PS3 version holding up development. Then we can get off that, because it doesnt matter. This sorta sucks for everyone, including the developer/publisher missing the holiday sales boost.

 

[-tkf-]

How does this relate at all to GTA? Are PGR4 and GTA4 sharing the same game data?

The point was the PR release reagarding the delay was ignored, specifically the part about both versions needing work while a rumour about how it was the PS3 version that was stopping everything got discussed like it was fact.

But you bring up a good point, how does a experienced developer end up delaying a game for 6-9 months, maybe they did really run out of disc space.

 

[Tap In]

But you bring up a good point, how does a experienced developer end up delaying a game for 6-9 months, maybe they did really run out of disc space.

OR... maybe it was running as expected on 360 (albeit not done) but the PS3 version is too choppy so they had to delay both so as not to break their contract.

I'd believe that far easier over some fanboy wish that BluRay is necessary and DVD is the devil this gen. See, works both ways.

 

[-tkf-]

OR... maybe it was running as expected on 360 (albeit not done) but the PS3 version is too choppy so they had to delay both so as not to break their contract.

I'd believe that far easier over some fanboy wish that BluRay is necessary and DVD is the devil this gen. See, works both ways.

Blu-Ray isn´t "needed" neither is 512MB ram or more than a 1Ghz CPU, wireless support? who cares, DVD playback?, hell HD isn´t needed either.

But with Blu-Ray disc space shouldn´t be a big issue in the design phase, one less thing to worry about.

EDIT:
If GTA4 ran as expected on the 360 they should lower their targets, even the trailer looked bad.

 

[Tap In]

But with Blu-Ray disc space shouldn´t be a big issue in the design phase, one less thing to worry about.
....

agreed.

still, more than likely, the odds are that Media size had NOTHING to do with this delay. :smile:

 

[infinity4]

if space is a problem they can always delete something to fit on dvd.

 

[Neb]

if space is a problem they can always delete something to fit on dvd.

I would think that sound and music is what takes up quite some space. Different compression method and/or bitrate as solution perhaps?

 

[Ben-Nice]

OR... maybe it was running as expected on 360 (albeit not done) but the PS3 version is too choppy so they had to delay both so as not to break their contract.

Well considering the only version people have see is the X360 one and it didn't run very well that's not saying much.

 

[djskribbles]

not saying DVD was a limitation (although you never know) even if the 360 version was ahead in development and was the only version shown doesn't rule out DVD being a limiting factor. in this case, the 360 version could have been the lowest common denominator making it the lead platform and also making the PS3 naturally behind. not saying this is the case, but isn't it plausible?

personally, i think both versions were behind schedule. i mean, not much has been shown and the release date was supposed to be Oct. 2007 wasn't it? we've seen far more of MGS4 and thats coming out Q1 2008.

 

[Tap In]

Well considering the only version people have see is the X360 one and it didn't run very well that's not saying much.

"running as expected" does not mean it was perfect (hence the "albeit not done")

but if that's the case, imagine how poorly PS3 must be running considering it's never been shown

 

[iceberg187]

"running as expected" does not mean it was perfect (hence the "albeit not done")

but if that's the case, imagine how poorly PS3 must be running considering it's never been shown

The last time they showed GTA4 to the public, they said that it was a 5 week old build and that the latest build shown substantial gains in frame rate.

http://games.kikizo.com/news/200707/115_p01.asp

And even though this build is five weeks old, we can reveal that frame rate is much improved - certainly more stable since the last build we looked at - so anyone worried about the version shown off at Take 2's conference at E3 two weeks ago can relax. We're almost certain that was precisely the same code that we saw for our first preview, which was already quite old at the time we saw it back in May. When they warn that they are showing unoptimised code, strangely enough, they mean it. Now, the game is graphically a lot more stable, which is why they didn't hesitate to put the game engine through its paces this time with some very fast driving and shooting action around the city, that rarely struggled to keep up, unlike the more, shall we say, 'fragile' old build people have seen.

 

[Xenon]

Rockstar needs to issue a press release and place Michael Pachter is his place. If this analyst had any credibility he'd invest in his own predictions and assumptions.

 

[PSman]

Open world games are one of the ones that are easiest to fit on a disc. The HDD might be an issue, but disc size isn't. GTA:SA last gen game data was 1.5GB, and audio brought the final total to 2.86GB on the Xbox. This generation, Microsoft has even better compression for audio.

But I think they might have to sacrify a few things in order to fit it in a DVD , like repeatitive textures and no different times of day for example.

We'll see how the game turn out