Star Citizen, Roberts Space Industries - Chris Roberts' life support and retirement fund [2012-]

[Jupiter]

Relatively spoken, the price was too low previously. Other vessels in these price regions would not be as appealing. I mean. You could get a small one seat fighter for 200 USD or that 100m refuel tanker for 195 USD. And this is not even the biggest MISC ship. MISCs Hull E and Endeavor will make the Starfarer look small.

But do not forget. You can earn any ships in the game with ingame money (despite some alien ships which are harder to get). It sounds like your friend has the Retaliator bomber. With his large torpedos, this is one of the biggest threats for ships like the Starfarer .

Btw. The refuel arm is missing in the video/ current hangar version.


____

CIG has now a new character sound system with different sounds per bone or limb. (54:10)

I think it is already in Alpha 2.3.

 

[Malo]

Not impressed by their pricing, I must say. People already paid for the development of that ship, several times over.

What's your assumption on how much it cost to make?

 

[Jupiter]

They said that they had a maximum number of 10 people working on this ship (Starfarer) at the same time. Now they must implenemt many animations, effects, audio, gameplay and HUD functions etc. The ship can also be destroyed into pieces.

It is definitly expensive to produce these ships. Look at the plan. The size is like a smaller Alien: Isolation level. But this is fully modeled from the in- and outside.

The Starfarer is a kind of benchmark for all other spaceships from this manufacturer. They can use some of the materials, assets (like chairs) etc. The other Musashi Industrial & Starflight Concern (MISC) ships will be modeled faster compared to the size. The team will also get more experienced with more vessels. Each Studio from Cloud Imperium Games is working on its manufacturer(s). The studio in the United Kingdom is responsible for the MISC vessels (Starfarer, Freelancer, Hull series, Endeavor). This also guarantees each manufacturer a specific look.

Foundry 42 (the studio in England ) also works on the ships which are needed for Squadron 42 (the single player campaign).

 

[Grall]

What's your assumption on how much it cost to make?

The record-breaking amount of money in financing they've raised so far, maybe?

 

[Jupiter]

The ships are also modular. You will be able to change whole rooms. Or objects like power plants, shield generators, engines, weapons, turrets etc. which are/will be also modeled in- and outside the ship.

Space To Ground: Matters of Scale in Level Design from (Michael Barclay [CIG emplyee]): http://gamasutra.com/blogs/MichaelB...o_Ground_Matters_of_Scale_in_Level_Design.php

 

[eastmen]

Relatively spoken, the price was too low previously. Other vessels in these price regions would not be as appealing. I mean. You could get a small one seat fighter for 200 USD or that 100m refuel tanker for 195 USD. And this is not even the biggest MISC ship. MISCs Hull E and Endeavor will make the Starfarer look small.

But do not forget. You can earn any ships in the game with ingame money (despite some alien ships which are harder to get). It sounds like your friend has the Retaliator bomber. With his large torpedos, this is one of the biggest threats for ships like the Starfarer .

Btw. The refuel arm is missing in the video/ current hangar version.


____

CIG has now a new character sound system with different sounds per bone or limb. (54:10)

I think it is already in Alpha 2.3.

Still pissed that this ship keeps going up for sale. CIG can't even keep their promises after taking peoples money. Its sad as hell.

Its also sad that this ship went from a crew of 1-2 to now 7.

So I can't even use a ship I purchased. Why couldn't they just make the starfarer and then make a new ship for 7 people.

This company really sucks

 

[Malo]

Doesn't that mean you could likely sell your ship for more than it cost you and buy one or more ships more appropriate for what you intended?

 

[Jupiter]

You could upgrade your ship with rare stuff and overclock all systems to the max (maybe you will be the best overclocker in the universe) and get way more ingame money out of it or its components.

You can be a ship seller in the game. So yes. But I hard that base ships will be cheap against highly modified ships. The extra stuff can be much more expensive than the actual ship (hull) itself.

 

[Jupiter]

Still pissed that this ship keeps going up for sale. CIG can't even keep their promises after taking peoples money. Its sad as hell.

Its also sad that this ship went from a crew of 1-2 to now 7.

So I can't even use a ship I purchased. Why couldn't they just make the starfarer and then make a new ship for 7 people.

This company really sucks

This is only the number of persons which can perform usefull activities. Its more time efficient. I think that you need at least 2 people on the Starfarer. The pilot and a person which controls the refual arm on the platform.

But if something breaks the pilot must leave the bridge to repair something (like ship components). The efficiency is lower for two. But you can also hire NPCs.


"Remember: we are offering this pledge ship to help fund Star Citizen’s development. The funding generated by sales such as this is what allows us to include deeper, non-combat oriented features in the Star Citizen world. Concept ships will be available for in-game credits in the final universe, and they are not required to start the game."

I do not know whether they have said it would ever be offered again.
But I know that hundreds of thousands of new people who did not had the opportunity to buy one have been joined since then. Early supporters got he ships cheaper.

 

[eastmen]

This is only the number of persons which can perform usefull activities. Its more time efficient. I think that you need at least 2 people on the Starfarer. The pilot and a person which controls the refual arm on the platform.

But if something breaks the pilot must leave the bridge to repair something (like ship components). The efficiency is lower for two. But you can also hire NPCs.


"Remember: we are offering this pledge ship to help fund Star Citizen’s development. The funding generated by sales such as this is what allows us to include deeper, non-combat oriented features in the Star Citizen world. Concept ships will be available for in-game credits in the final universe, and they are not required to start the game."

I do not know whether they have said it would ever be offered again.
But I know that hundreds of thousands of new people who did not had the opportunity to buy one have been joined since then. Early supporters got he ships cheaper.

Yea so you basicly have to use 7 people to play with the starfarer , anything else puts you at a disadvantage. Which is why its BS
The ship was supposed to be limited to the end of kickstarter live stream. Then at the 1 year anniversary they offered it again and said that be it. Then they did it again when they offered the gemini model of it.

They just lie a lot. The price difference was only $10 bucks. They should have raised it to $300 when they put it out the third time.

Anyway the game was funded many times over. Its at 110m which is a 105m more than they wanted at kickstarter and the game still is no where near done

 

[eastmen]

Doesn't that mean you could likely sell your ship for more than it cost you and buy one or more ships more appropriate for what you intended?

No Chris made sure that the ships are worthless in resale value by constantly reselling them and by giving everyone LTI .

You know breaking promises

 

[Grall]

@eastmen
LTI?

 

[Otto Dafe]

@eastmen
LTI?

Lifetime Insurance.

 

[Jupiter]

Early backers will get the second single player game for free. They said at first it would just be an Add On. But now we will get a second full 20+ hours camgaign instead. Your package includes an MMO and two single player campaigns. Now new players have to pay 60 USD for one the single player campaign and the MMO. People who dont want the singleplayer can get the MMO for 45 USD. Both together costs 60 USD now.
The free campaign is another side that is often forgotten .

Before the third price increase the Starfarer cost 195USD.

There is no longer LTI with old ships since 2013 or 2014. Only concept sales have it. Unless you evaluate your ship with LTI. In my point of view, every ship could get LTI. I do not mind if others get it.

Anyway the game was funded many times over. Its at 110m which is a 105m more than they wanted at kickstarter and the game still is no where near done

They have 300 employees who "just" work at two games at the moment (Star Citizen and Squadron 42). It is not overfunded.

The five million would never have been enough. He made this clear since the beginning. The crowdfuning campaign served to attract investors. Now they can work without restrictions and can offer a versatile universe. Without compromises.

FALLOUT 4 took 6 years to build and this is only a FALLOUT 3.1 with very old tech and a much smaller scope in my opinion. While they had already a Studio and an engine. CIG had to be built first.

I think that I'll will set you on the ignore list again. Just like the last 3/4 year where I enabled only sometimes ignored comments.

 

[Jupiter]

My Starfarer screenshots (UHD plus TAA)

It's massive
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (1) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (2) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

More screens

Spoiler

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (3) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (4) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

First deck
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (5) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

More screens

Spoiler

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (6) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (8) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

 

[Jupiter]

Second deck

Bridge
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (12) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Decompression area
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (14) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Maybe you will work here while a battle takes place next to you
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (15) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Welcome to the third deck
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (16) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Some escape pods
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (17) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

EVA room
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (20) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

More screenshots

Spoiler

Gravity generator
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (19) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Engine room, where is Scotty?
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (18) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Some windows
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (21) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Small corridors
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (22) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Welcome to the fourth deck (you can enter it via 3 differemt ledders and two lifts)
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (23) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Personal area
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (24) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

More screenshots

Spoiler

Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (26) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Main upper turret
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (25) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Captains room
Starfarer_Hangar_Alpha_2.3 (29) by X-RAY-89, auf Flickr

Full gallery with more pictures: https://flic.kr/s/aHskxikd14

 

[eastmen]

Early backers will get the second single player game for free. They said at first it would just be an Add On. But now we will get a second full 20+ hours camgaign instead. Your package includes an MMO and two single player campaigns. Now new players have to pay 60 USD for one the single player campaign and the MMO. People who dont want the singleplayer can get the MMO for 45 USD. Both together costs 60 USD now.
The free campaign is another side that is often forgotten .

Before the third price increase the Starfarer cost 195USD.

There is no longer LTI with old ships since 2013 or 2014. Only concept sales have it. Unless you evaluate your ship with LTI. In my point of view, every ship could get LTI. I do not mind if others get it.

You can get LTI on any ship just buy a cheap concept ship and cross chasis upgrade it. The LTI stays. They built that loop hole in to give everyone LTI . A once promised feature that you had to back before kickstarter to get.

One of the stretch goals was getting the second single player expansion free. Your really not helping them if you don't go and see what was promised and what they took back after having the money for years

They have 300 employees who "just" work at two games at the moment (Star Citizen and Squadron 42). It is not overfunded.

The five million would never have been enough. He made this clear since the beginning. The crowdfuning campaign served to attract investors. Now they can work without restrictions and can offer a versatile universe. Without compromises.

He has said that multiple times during development. At 20m we were fully funded and no longer needed outside investors. ITs all just Chris Roberts BS. Meanwhile the game gets delayed and delayed and exclusive perks to kickstarters get taken away.

FALLOUT 4 took 6 years to build and this is only a FALLOUT 3.1 with very old tech and a much smaller scope in my opinion. While they had already a Studio and an engine. CIG had to be built first.

I think that I'll will set you on the ignore list again. Just like the last 3/4 year where I enabled only sometimes ignored comments.

I don't care how long Fallout 4 took. They did not take my money and promise milestones to me and a release and then push it back and push it back and push it back and take more money and give away more things they promised were exclusive to me.

Nov 2014 was the promise. We are in march of 2016 and the game is not close to being done. Original ships still aren't complete , but they've rushed new ships to gain new money.

The original Goal was 500 thousand dollars. We are now at 110m +

 

[homerdog]

The Fallout 4 analogy is a good example of how Star Citizen will never be finished in the way it was described. I still enjoy looking at these ships and stuff but Derek Smart was right and that's been obvious to me for a while now. They don't even have the systems to build the systems that will run the game yet! (at least they're honest about that) Everything is subject to change etc. this does not look like something that will be finished before my hair turns grey and then falls out.

 

[Jupiter]

The most things Derek Smart talked were bullshit. He even said that CIG will run out of money in the first quarter of 2016.

We saw a lot of progress. They build the background tech which will made this game possible.

We have/ we can
- 64bit positioning (CRYENGINE maps were 4*4km in size before, now the map can be as large as the half of our sun system)
- local Physical Grid (a spaceship is a map inside a map where you can walk inside)
- Multicrew Ships
- Flying -> EVA/FPS -> Flying
- Planetary Landings with no loading screens (they showed this tech and it will be there in this year)

The most importend thing they have to solve in my opinion are the frame rate issues. They need to decouple the server fps from the client fps

I think VR is for now the most far away topic I have no problem with that.


Quote from Michael Barclay
"So yeah, size matters in Star Citizen. But it's also a game about agency. We’re interested in the stories players can create themselves. Our goal is to provide systems and a set of core level design principals that enables players to experience awesome emergent gameplay.

So what does space to ground mean for us? Well it’s more than just a core feature. It means providing a means for the player to seamlessly explore all facets of our universe, at every scale, from the jumping between solar systems in the galaxy…"


"..So, Star Citizen has many playgrounds, and it falls to the level designers to lay them out and fill them with stuff to do regardless of their scale. However, at every level the philosophy remains the same. The core pillars of what we are aiming for are always focused around autonomy for the player and immersion in the world building. Where the player can jump between multiple locations in the sandbox universe of star citizen, they can also find multiple ways to complete ground objectives..."

"The goal is to allow the player to achieve enormous amounts of agency in an epic sandbox combat arena.

Which brings us to a final point regarding scales or tiers of drama and level design. How do we make each tier important? How do we make items important? What drives the player?

Well one such element that can help drive player’s motivation is simply “vulnerability”.

Look at movies such as Gravity, Sunshine and The Martian. Space is a dangerous place! I don’t think there's an experience quite like the one where you could be stranded in space, lightyears from civilization and the only thing keeping you alive is a tiny med pack, or an O2 container."

"To me, that’s the true nature of what space to ground means for Star Citizen. It’s being able to put the player in the isolated, dark, infinite abyss of space and say "go adventure", knowing they have the tools and we've provided the structure for them to start putting together their own plans and goals. We know the drama will unfold all by itself because we established these structures.

Even if that drama is as intimate as "I need to find this tin of beans"."


eeastmen
I read it but I know that we could never stop he discussion. So I will no more talk about this. I think that they will show/release a lot this year.

 

[Malo]

Those Starfarer shots are amazing. It's so exciting to know we're finally at a place in gaming history where we can even possibly do the amount of detail they're achieving and having multi-crew large ships fulfilling various purposes. So much potential and I'm perfectly fine waiting for it as long as it takes.