Sony PlayStation cross-platform game strategy

[Metal_Spirit]

Again Insomniac projected Ratchet and Clank to be non profitable. It was a forecast but the game was profitable. They were forecasting only 10.5 millions for Spiderman. It is better to underestimate than overestimate sales projection.

EDIT: And the document about the pillar was made in 2021 and updated in 2022 when MS proposal was only three year of COD on Playstation and this is risk assessment they took the worst case. I am sûre of one thing of COD was exclusive to Xbox they wouldn’t lost all PS plus subscription, a good chunk but not all subscriptions.

Thank you very much for this information. Very helpfull on understanding.
But Miles Morales income Numbers are also wrong... Why?

Also, why is the Pillar document is on a Insomniac slide, and not Sony or PS? Those strategies are not decided by Insomniac!

 

[chris1515]

Thank you very much for this information. Very helpfull on understanding.

But why the Pillar document is on a Insomniac slide, and not Sony or PS? Those strategies are not decided by Insomniac

Probably a presentation coming from information given by Sony.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

Probably a presentation coming from information given by Sony.

And they were showing this to whom? Why not just show the Sony information?
Sorry, I know you do not have the answers to this, but as I sayd, I find it strange that a hotel restaurant is discussing the hotel management. And Insomniac job is to make games, not to discuss Sonys fears or strategies. Why would Sony fears be told to child companies for them to make presentations?

 

[chris1515]

And they were showing this to whom? Why not just show the Sony information?
Sorry, I know you do not have the answers to this, but as I sayd, I find it strange that a hotel restaurant is discussing the hotel management. And Insomniac job is to make games, not to discuss Sonys fears or strategies. Why would Sony fears be told to child companies for them to make presentations?

Because Insomniac began to do a big GAAS game and Ted Price and other Insomniac executive wanted to explain the employee why they were doing a GAAS game because they were a single player studio. After ABK announcement Sont was in panic mode and begin to buy GAAS studios and create GAAS game in many single player studios.

The Spiderverse game is cancelled like the TLOU Online game.

 

[Scott_Arm]

And they were showing this to whom? Why not just show the Sony information?
Sorry, I know you do not have the answers to this, but as I sayd, I find it strange that a hotel restaurant is discussing the hotel management. And Insomniac job is to make games, not to discuss Sonys fears or strategies. Why would Sony fears be told to child companies for them to make presentations?

Have you ever worked for a large corporation? This stuff is totally normal. Executives at the top level (Sony) give presentation to executives at lower level (Insomniac). Lower level executives (Insomniac) give their own presentation to their own reports (Insomniac developers). This kind of stuff happens at all-staff meetings all the time. Usually they'll cover their own place in the industry, industry trends, potential competition in the market etc. Usually sales updates get bundled in etc, so employees can understand how well the company they work for is doing, and any challenges it might face. I've been going to these kinds of meetings for twenty years.

Edit: And the reason it's Insomniac slides and not Sony slides is there's probably "executive level" information that gets removed before it's presented to lower employees. Basically there's always a "need to know" removal of information. There's a lot of protection of information, especially in publicly traded companies.

Edit: I read the Kotaku story on Insomniac and a bunch of the stuff that was leaked seems like it would be information kept at the executive level in Insomniac, because it discusses layoffs etc. But it's still typical that an executive would make their own presentation to tailor information and remove things that have a need to know basis.

What Hacked Files Tell Us About The Studio Behind Spider-Man 2

Internal documents show how a big PlayStation studio plans its future

kotaku.com

Seems like budget and studio cuts are coming across Sony studios.

 

[Scott_Arm]

With regards to the sales figures, the gaming industry looks frighteningly unstable to me. They need to take a page from horror films, which don't rely on stars or big budgets. Horror films are probably the most profitable category of movie. Smaller and more inventive games with smaller budgets would be nice. I don't need 100 hours of gameplay. I just need maybe 10-15 hours, especially if they can bring the price down a little. I'd prefer a $50 game with a short experience to a $70 game with 100 hours of extremely safe no-risk content.

 

[tuna]

Insomniac (and other Sony studios) are built to build big games. Changing that would be very difficult and would not guarantee a better financial result.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

Have you ever worked for a large corporation? This stuff is totally normal. Executives at the top level (Sony) give presentation to executives at lower level (Insomniac). Lower level executives (Insomniac) give their own presentation to their own reports (Insomniac developers). This kind of stuff happens at all-staff meetings all the time. Usually they'll cover their own place in the industry, industry trends, potential competition in the market etc. Usually sales updates get bundled in etc, so employees can understand how well the company they work for is doing, and any challenges it might face. I've been going to these kinds of meetings for twenty years.

Edit: And the reason it's Insomniac slides and not Sony slides is there's probably "executive level" information that gets removed before it's presented to lower employees. Basically there's always a "need to know" removal of information. There's a lot of protection of information, especially in publicly traded companies.

Edit: I read the Kotaku story on Insomniac and a bunch of the stuff that was leaked seems like it would be information kept at the executive level in Insomniac, because it discusses layoffs etc. But it's still typical that an executive would make their own presentation to tailor information and remove things that have a need to know basis.

What Hacked Files Tell Us About The Studio Behind Spider-Man 2

Internal documents show how a big PlayStation studio plans its future

kotaku.com

Seems like budget and studio cuts are coming across Sony studios.

Actually I do work for a large corporation. And here, lower executives are not even aware of company threats or fears. Those are discussed on the top tiers. Each layer has its own function and things do not mix.
If a rival company is doing something that frightens our strategy, we do not go around telling everyone on the company we are threaten and showing what our fears are. The company must remain as calm and far from the threat as possible. Revealing fears and strategy could cause distractions or even panic on the lower tiers, affecting the company's productivity. It's the top layers job to discuss those threats and find strategies to overcome them. But for shure they do not go around revealing their threats and fears to everyone.
Regardless if the company expects good or bad times, the company must stay unaffected, moral at top levels, and productivity at max. Otherwise we are creating worst conditions and damaging ourselfs.

But maybe other large corporations work differently, but for my reality, I find it strange that Sony's fears are being discussed and showed this way. That was why the slide with the insomniac logo called my attention.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Actually I do work for a large corporation. And here, lower executives are not even aware of company threats or fears. Those are discussed on the top tiers. Each layer has its own function and things do not mix.
If a rival company is doing something that frightens our strategy, we do not go around telling everyone on the company we are threaten and showing what our fears are. The company must remain as calm and far from the threat as possible. Revealing fears and strategy could cause distractions or even panic on the lower tiers, affecting the company's productivity. It's the top layers job to discuss those threats and find strategies to overcome them. But for shure they do not go around revealing their threats and fears to everyone.
Regardless if the company expects good or bad times, the company must stay unaffected, moral at top levels, and productivity at max. Otherwise we are creating worst conditions and damaging ourselfs.

But maybe other large corporations work differently, but for my reality, I find it strange that Sony's fears are being discussed and showed this way. That was why the slide with the insomniac logo called my attention.

I mean, I don't see how that could work. People who work at companies have friends at other companies, read industry news. Typically we'd have all staff questions and people will directly ask executives to answer questions about competitors etc. They'll usually sugarcoat their answers, but there's usually an undercurrent of preparing people to face real challenges in the market. Maybe it depends on what you're working on, but it's usually good for people to understand where their competitors are ahead etc. A lot of times executives will selectively share information to get ahead of the questions or rumours that have already started.

There is some stuff in the leaks that doesn't look like it would make its way down to the lowest level people, but I'm sure Insomniac's executives would be briefed on things. The president of Insomniac would probably know more than they'd choose to share with the other executives. You just filter out more info the further you go, which is why they might not share slides that were provided from Sony to the highest level.

 

[see colon]

With regards to the sales figures, the gaming industry looks frighteningly unstable to me. They need to take a page from horror films, which don't rely on stars or big budgets. Horror films are probably the most profitable category of movie. Smaller and more inventive games with smaller budgets would be nice. I don't need 100 hours of gameplay. I just need maybe 10-15 hours, especially if they can bring the price down a little. I'd prefer a $50 game with a short experience to a $70 game with 100 hours of extremely safe no-risk content.

That's why the indie developers are so important. You will find plenty of games in the $50 range with a great amount of content for that price. And sometimes you will find a Vampire Survivors that you can play for hundreds of hours. What we need is to have the larger publishers diversify their portfolios to include more games in this range. From recent memory, something like Hi-Fi Rush, or Pentiment. I wish there was more stuff like this, where you can have a smaller, tighter experiences that are exactly the size and scope that they need to be to be great. A little farther back, I think of Portal. Valve was out there trying to craft these epic games and for me, but Portal was just a shockingly refreshing game. Like a slice of lemon pie.

Insomniac (and other Sony studios) are built to build big games. Changing that would be very difficult and would not guarantee a better financial result.

Insomniac produced many smaller games between 2015 and 2019. Lots of them were VR games, but they did have a modestly successful non-VR title in Song of the Deep. Now that they are a Playstation studio, they make big Marvel games.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

I mean, I don't see how that could work. People who work at companies have friends at other companies, read industry news. Typically we'd have all staff questions and people will directly ask executives to answer questions about competitors etc. They'll usually sugarcoat their answers, but there's usually an undercurrent of preparing people to face real challenges in the market. Maybe it depends on what you're working on, but it's usually good for people to understand where their competitors are ahead etc. A lot of times executives will selectively share information to get ahead of the questions or rumours that have already started.

There is some stuff in the leaks that doesn't look like it would make its way down to the lowest level people, but I'm sure Insomniac's executives would be briefed on things. The president of Insomniac would probably know more than they'd choose to share with the other executives. You just filter out more info the further you go, which is why they might not share slides that were provided from Sony to the highest level.

Off course rumors do go around, there are leaks, and people read news. What I'm talking about is confirmations from the top, and even less, slides showing our threats.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Off course rumors do go around, there are leaks, and people read news. What I'm talking about is confirmations from the top, and even less, slides showing our threats.

That's the purpose of these type of internal comms. If employees are just discussing rumours that can result in anxiety, reducing morale and productivity and even people wondering if they would be better off being employed elsewhere etc. Most large organisations exist in a competitive environment and refusing to acknowledging commercial threats will not reassure employees that seniors have a robust strategy, nor does it inspire the type of people who thrive on that competitive spirit.

It just makes senior management look like they have their oblivious head in the sand.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

That's the purpose of these type of internal comms. If employees are just discussing rumours that can result in anxiety, reducing morale and productivity and even people wondering if they would be better off being employed elsewhere etc. Most large organisations exist in a competitive environment and refusing to acknowledging commercial threats will not reassure employees that seniors have a robust strategy, nor does it inspire the type of people who thrive on that competitive spirit.

It just makes senior management look like they have their oblivious head in the sand.

There are always rumours... Some are true, others are not! Some may seem awful and worthy of discussion and concern and have simple solutions, other may seem simple and not even worth bothering, but be a real problem. Concerning with the reality of stuff, for us, it´s a matter of the board of diretors! Only them have all the data.
If a rumour is spreading and concerning people, the board will adress the entire company with an internal memo comming directly from above. It will not use any middle man! That is how we do it!

 

[Deleted member 11852]

There are always rumours... Some are true, others are not! Some may seem awful and worthy of discussion and concern and have simple solutions, other may seem simple and not even worth bothering, but be a real problem. Concerning with the reality of stuff, for us, it´s a matter of the board of diretors! Only them have all the data.

It sounds like your work in an organisation where the seniors really don't care much about what those down the ranks think or care about.

 

[Metal_Spirit]

It sounds like your work in an organisation where the seniors really don't care much about what those down the ranks think or care about.

Nope... on the contrary! They are always listening, and peopla even have persons to talk about for complaints. They get info of needs from bellow, execute at the top, and implement bellow. As it should be!
It´s just that executive discussions are made at the executive level only. As I said on a figure of speech, I have problems undertanding why the cook has to know about the problems the hotel has with other hotels. It´s not is job to solve those problems.

PS: I'll keep it here... This is becoming way off topic, and we must respect the moderation!
PS2: From what I read, they have Nukes

 

[RobertR1]

With regards to the sales figures, the gaming industry looks frighteningly unstable to me. They need to take a page from horror films, which don't rely on stars or big budgets. Horror films are probably the most profitable category of movie. Smaller and more inventive games with smaller budgets would be nice. I don't need 100 hours of gameplay. I just need maybe 10-15 hours, especially if they can bring the price down a little. I'd prefer a $50 game with a short experience to a $70 game with 100 hours of extremely safe no-risk content.

As my free time is limited, the idea of picking up a 50hr+ game is just a turn off. esp if it’s a collect-a-thon or fetch central. Give me good 15hrs and I’m way more interested.

The industry has done well to make itself unattractive to mid life gamers.

 

[pjbliverpool]

As my free time is limited, the idea of picking up a 50hr+ game is just a turn off. esp if it’s a collect-a-thon or fetch central. Give me good 15hrs and I’m way more interested.

The industry has done well to make itself unattractive to mid life gamers.

Yeah it takes me about 6 months to finish an Assassins creed game playing it exclusively and not going for 100%.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The industry has done well to make itself unattractive to mid life gamers.

I wonder if anyone's thinking specifically of them? Or is the thinking that younger people have more disposable income? Or is the thinking just a bit stuck with the status quo and no-one's considering particular demographic targets beyond kids/young adults/girls? Maybe it's driven by seeing what 'influencers' are and do??

Perhaps the 15 hour polished experience for the more discerning gamer is a robust market to tap?

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I wonder if anyone's thinking specifically of them? Or is the thinking that younger people have more disposable income? Or is the thinking just a bit stuck with the status quo and no-one's considering particular demographic targets beyond kids/young adults/girls? Maybe it's driven by seeing what 'influencers' are and do??

Do young people gave a lot of disposal income? I see a lot of young people drowning in educational loans, paying through the nose to rent accommodation because mortgages are an impossible dream with property prices so high. Contrast that to those in the 40s and up, who managed to dodge the worst of the last 10--15 years of economic decline, and who have had time to progress in their chosen careers.

For me time, is the most precious commodity and games have to be really special for me to find time to play a 30-40 campaign. 12-25 hours is my sweet spot these days and I have a lot of disposal income to drop on games.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I agree but the marketing rarely aims at those growing up with video games and constantly targets the 20 somethings. I guess the theory is they can't afford a full life so have an extended childhood of fun and frolics outside work hours. Meanwhile the older folk have kids sapping all their disposable income! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I feel only Nintendo targets the older gamer with their advertising and 99 times out of a hundred, that's as a family.