Sony PlayStation cross-platform game strategy

[chris1515]

My belief is sony is limited to around 100-200 million users if they don't do something differently. That something could be cloud gaming available in any platform, portable console, playstation games coming for phones or pc's,.... It's very logical for sony to test pc market and see if it would make sense to expand there. Those who are not willing to explore, change and grow are bound to become extinct.

They talk about a new strategy for cloud gamins using Azure Server. This is the way to go for them if they want to keep third party on PSN ecosystem. Nintendo will not change a lot and they will live because game sales come mostly from their own titles.

If tomorrow every playstation gamer stop to buy a Playstation or use any new cloud Playstation services and go buy a PC they will be nearly extinct because more than 80% of the revenue will disappear. Hardware(PS4,PS5 and PVR) + third party PSN + third party physical games + is probably around 85% of SIE revenue

 

[manux]

They talk about a new strategy for cloud gamins using Azure Server. This is the way to go for them if they want to keep third party om PSN ecosystem. Nintendo will not change a lot and they will live.

If tomorrow every playstation gamer stop to buy a Playstation or use any new cloud Playstation services and go buy a PC they will be nearly extinct because more than 80% of the revenue will disappear. Hardware(PS4.PS5 and PVR) + third party PSN + third party physical games + is probably around 85% of SIE revenue

I don't think it's a zero sum game. I believe sony can potentially get more paying users by expanding. I believe this is what sony is trying out with the pc releases. Sony could expand psn+/psnow to be gamepass or steam like service running on windows/phones/... Yeah, sony would loose my console purchase but those are sold at loss anyway and cost a fortune in r&d to make. Profit is coming from software and services.

 

[chris1515]

I don't think it's a zero sum game. I believe sony can potentially get more paying users by expanding. I believe this is what sony is trying out with the pc releases. Sony could expand psn+ to be gamepass or steam like service running on windows/phones/... Yeah, sony would loose my console purchase but those are sold at loss anyway. Profit is coming from software and services.

They will not extend because it does not mean you will buy third party title inside PSN ecosystem maybe you will buy them on Steam or GOG or Epic Game Store. This is the thing people seems to not understand, Sony Playstation revenue comes mostly from third party royalites on third party digital sales and add on not from TLOU2 or any other first party titles.

Sony doesn't care so much if it means only loss of a consoles sales, it means loss of third party revenue.

When someone buy a PS or Xbox console most of the player buy all the games on it .

After five year on average the first year PS4 player spend 1800 dollars on software and services and a good part on third party games.

If Sony PSN was the dominant store on PC this would not be a problem.

 

[PSman1700]

My belief is sony is limited to around 100-200 million users if they don't do something differently. That something could be cloud gaming available in any platform, portable console, playstation games coming for phones or pc's,.... It's very logical for sony to test pc market and see if it would make sense to expand there. Those who are not willing to explore, change and grow are bound to become extinct.

It might seem negative to see sony games on pc to some, but if you want Sony to grow outside of their closed box environment, there isnt much of a choice down the line. Yes Sony does very well now and have excellent games. But that doesnt mean they have the potentional to grow even more. Restricting themselfs to just one platform each 7 years isnt all that forward looking.

In the console space, the PC isnt even a direct competitor to playstation to begin with.

 

[manux]

They will not extend because it does not mean you will buy third party title inside PSN ecosystem maybe you will buy them on Steam or GOG or Epic Game Store. This is the thing people seems to not understand, Sony Playstation revenue comes mostly from third party royalites on third party digital sales and add on not from TLOU2 or any other first party titles.

That's a very good point.

 

[Tkumpathenurple]

Depends what you want to catch up on...Nintendo? Sony are doing their thing and doing very well thank you.

I was referring to PSNow and GamePass.

Sony were years ahead with PSNow, but they've been indecisive with it and it's now being overtaken by GamePass. I don't think Sony should put their games on there day 1 or anything, but PSNow was originally available on the PS3, the PSVita, the PS4, and I think even some TV's. That got stripped back to PS4 only a few years before Microsoft have begun their trial of XCloud which they're pushing onto as many platforms as possible.

It's fitting that you should mention Nintendo, because Nintendo's previous failures to read the market properly and respond to it appropriately have resulted in them being outdated in the online realm, and even in terms of development to the extent that they had to partner with Nvidia in order to compete.

Sony shouldn't seek to fall by the wayside like Nintendo did. It wasn't an easy path back to relevance, and they're still somewhat at the mercy of Nvidia.

I don't think it's a zero sum game. I believe sony can potentially get more paying users by expanding. I believe this is what sony is trying out with the pc releases. Sony could expand psn+/psnow to be gamepass or steam like service running on windows/phones/... Yeah, sony would loose my console purchase but those are sold at loss anyway and cost a fortune in r&d to make. Profit is coming from software and services.

There's nothing absolutely wrong with PlayStation having a presence on PC. But as @chris1515 has pointed out a few times, third party content makes up a significant amount of Playstation's revenue. Sony need to keep PlayStation an attractive place for publishers to release games, and an attractive place for customers to keep buying them. If all first party games release on Steam, Sony have to pay Valve 30% per sale, and the reason to buy third party games on PlayStation is diminished.

Fair enough if they want to have more presence on PC, but in my opinion, they need to release their own storefront, and integrate with it both PSNow and Remote Play.

 

[chris1515]

https://www.statista.com/statistics...iscal year of,sales were via digital channels.

Sony sold 338.9 millions games and 58.4 millions were first party from 1rst April 2020 to 31 March 2021. Only 17% of PS games sold were first party games. And this is not taking into account add-on where Sony is not very successful because they produce moslty single player games. Third party revenue is THE heart of Sony revenue and profit.

In the fiscal year of 2020, Sony Corporation sold approximately 58.4 million PlayStation-exclusive first party games for the PS4 and PS5, accounting for a significant amount of the overall 338.9 million full game software unit sales. Over 60 percent of PlayStation game unit sales were via digital channels

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I don't see anything but positives in sony releasing games for pc. If I could I would be only a pc gamer. As it stands now I have to get playstation to get all the content I like to play.

It's all about hooks. Sony is banking on there being a significant number who will buy a PlayStation to access PlayStation exclusive games to hooked on the console experience and will buy more games on PlayStation compared to PC, but where Sony take a 30% cut of all games sold for their console.

Let's be honest, both PS5 and Xbox Series represent good gaming experiences compared to the "average" PC and by average PC I mean by the Steam hardware survey. But I don't have a meaningful better gaming experience on my 32Gb i9 with 3080 PC than I do on modern consoles. Last gen people would raise the load slowing time and mostly 30fps experience eon consoles but that was last gen.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I can see this going a few different ways depending on who is buying their games on Steam.

• Most of the people buying Sony 1st party games on Steam also have a PS4/PS5.
  • If sales are good, then wait a few years before porting a title to PC.
  • If sales aren't good, reconsider whether the investment in PC is good enough.
    • This one is unlikely as Sony are considering increasing their investment in PC.
      • As well, evidence on Steam suggests that Sony titles are selling well there, especially when the port is good (like Day's Gone).
• Most of the people buying Sony 1st party games on Steam do not have a PS4/PS5.
  • Have those people started to buy PlayStation 4/5?
    • Only release limited number of titles to introduce people what the PlayStation has to offer.
  • Very few have transitioned to owning a PlayStation 4/5.
    • Evidence that there is very little overlap between PlayStation and PC.
      • Opportunity to increase revenue by releasing more titles, more often, and closer to release on PC as it's unlikely to impact core PlayStation sales.
      • Slightly increase release cadence and see if PC users continue to not transition to PlayStation.
        • Also, see if PlayStation console and game sales start to suffer. If not, slowly increase the number of titles as well as reduce the lag time between console and PC.
        • Continue slowing increasing releases while decreasing lag time between console and PC as long as it doesn't impact PlayStation hardware or game sales.

We don't have the data for any of this, but Sony does. It'll be interesting to see what happens WRT Sony's plans on PC over the next couple of years.

Something else to consider. Porting their games to PC potentially makes future streaming services offering those games significantly easier and less costly as they can then use existing cloud infrastructure and don't need to take up costly server rack space with PlayStation hardware.

Regards,
SB

 

[manux]

If tomorrow every playstation gamer stop to buy a Playstation or use any new cloud Playstation services and go buy a PC they will be nearly extinct because more than 80% of the revenue will disappear. Hardware(PS4,PS5 and PVR) + third party PSN + third party physical games + is probably around 85% of SIE revenue

I'll give you counter point how things work for me already. I'm buying all cross platform content for pc. It's cheaper and I don't need to worry about BC or fps boost patches or wait for pro model. Only reason for me to buy ps5 is sony exclusives. Sony looses money selling me a console at loss. Sony would make more money out of me if they sold me the playstation games via their own store running in windows(or linux) and skipped selling me subsidized hw.

I will keep buying the sony exclusives as games like gran turismo, ratchet&clank, horizon zero dawn, uncharted etc etc.are my all time favorite games. I wouldn't mind getting them for pc and skipping the console hw.

 

[goonergaz]

I was referring to PSNow and GamePass.

Sony were years ahead with PSNow, but they've been indecisive with it and it's now being overtaken by GamePass. I don't think Sony should put their games on there day 1 or anything, but PSNow was originally available on the PS3, the PSVita, the PS4, and I think even some TV's. That got stripped back to PS4 only a few years before Microsoft have begun their trial of XCloud which they're pushing onto as many platforms as possible.

It's fitting that you should mention Nintendo, because Nintendo's previous failures to read the market properly and respond to it appropriately have resulted in them being outdated in the online realm, and even in terms of development to the extent that they had to partner with Nvidia in order to compete.

Sony shouldn't seek to fall by the wayside like Nintendo did. It wasn't an easy path back to relevance, and they're still somewhat at the mercy of Nvidia.



There's nothing absolutely wrong with PlayStation having a presence on PC. But as @chris1515 has pointed out a few times, third party content makes up a significant amount of Playstation's revenue. Sony need to keep PlayStation an attractive place for publishers to release games, and an attractive place for customers to keep buying them. If all first party games release on Steam, Sony have to pay Valve 30% per sale, and the reason to buy third party games on PlayStation is diminished.

Fair enough if they want to have more presence on PC, but in my opinion, they need to release their own storefront, and integrate with it both PSNow and Remote Play.

Again though, how much does MS make from GP?

Sony don’t have the bottomless pit nor an appetite for PS3#2 - they obviously don’t want to be left behind, but are staying within touching distance of GP whilst also doing quite well with their own model thanks very much.

Likewise Nintendo print money, they make money on hardware and always have I believe, and with their IP and current formula seem to be doing ok.

 

[chris1515]

I'll give you counter point how things work for me already. I'm buying all cross platform content for pc. It's cheaper and I don't need to worry about BC or fps boost patches or wait for pro model. Only reason for me to buy ps5 is sony exclusives. Sony looses money selling me a console at loss. Sony would make more money out of me if they sold me the playstation games via their own store running in windows(or linux) and skipped selling me subsidized hw.

I will keep buying the sony exclusives as games like gran turismo, ratchet&clank, horizon zero dawn, uncharted etc etc.are my all time favorite games. I wouldn't mind getting them for pc and skipping the console hw.

You aren't like the majority of player, most players play on one machine PC or consoles. And they don't lost hundreds of dollars too per console, this is not the PS3 situation.

And they make more profit on first party games you buy on PS4 or PS5 than on PC.

 

[PSman1700]

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1202227/global-playstation-game-unit-sales-annual/#:~:text=In the fiscal year of,sales were via digital channels.

Sony sold 338.9 millions games and 58.4 millions were first party from 1rst April 2020 to 31 March 2021. Only 17% of PS games sold were first party games. And this is not taking into account add-on where Sony is not very successful because they produce moslty single player games. Third party revenue is THE heart of Sony revenue and profit.

Kinda unexpected (from me) how little Sony makes on their first party exclusives. But then, thats we on hype forums only see the big hitters like HZD, GoW etc.

Let's be honest, both PS5 and Xbox Series represent good gaming experiences compared to the "average" PC and by average PC I mean by the Steam hardware survey. But I don't have a meaningful better gaming experience on my 32Gb i9 with 3080 PC than I do on modern consoles. Last gen people would raise the load slowing time and mostly 30fps experience eon consoles but that was last gen.

Not my experience, so it seems very individual there. Im getting a substantional better experience using my 2080Ti/3900x pc, higher settings, framerates, resolutions and performance, all while ray tracing where possible does lift all those things even more. The gap is only going to widen during the generation aswell. Also, 30fps aint going anywhere for graphically intensive exclusives like rift apart, unless theres sacrifces to be made to achieve 60fps. Or a performance mode down the line for a mid gen refresh (which likely wont happen this time around).

Steam surveys aint the best way to gauge the average pc gamer who plays these kind of titles anyway. Consoles are basically mid range 2019 products, a serious pc gamer has atleast a 5700XT (ps5 performance) i can imagine.

 

[Tkumpathenurple]

Again though, how much does MS make from GP?

That's not the point I'm making. Microsoft are aggressively pursuing other platforms for GamePass. Sony have had the technology to do so for ~7 years, and yet we've seen its platform availability shrink rather than grow.

If they rest on their laurels, they'll be left behind, clutching an empty bag.

Sony don’t have the bottomless pit nor an appetite for PS3#2 - they obviously don’t want to be left behind, but are staying within touching distance of GP whilst also doing quite well with their own model

In terms of content, they're doing just fine. I've subscribed to PSNow here and there, and I've always found it to be worthwhile. But it should be available on my phone. At the very least, it should still be available on my PSVita.

And while Microsoft are making strides with a service that you can play anywhere you have an adequate data connection, Sony are blithely wandering around and whistling with their finger up their arse.

They've had Remote Play technology since the PS3. It's been solidly functional since the PS4. PSNow has had 7 years to get where GamePass is right now. Microsoft has had just over 1. It's inexcusable.

Just to reiterate, I'm not talking about the content on either service. I'm talking about functionality and availability.

thanks very much.

You're welcome.

Likewise Nintendo print money, they make money on hardware and always have I believe, and with their IP and current formula seem to be doing ok.

I think you're right. But the GameCube underperformed. The Wii did brilliantly, but was sorely lacking in online and OS functionality compared to the PS3/X360, as well as generally failing to capture the core gamer audience. The WiiU was a disaster and still failed to match the online and OS functionality of the PS3/X360. None of them have been hailed as great devices on which to develop.

It took them buying old, underpowered SoC's from Nvidia - along with Nvidia's development tools - in order to be a viable platform for developers. They're doing fine, but that's a precarious position. It would be like Sony being entirely reliant on AMD to provide them not only with whatever hardware they have laying around, but also with the tools to utilise it.

PSNow needs to evolve, and massively so along with many aspects of PlayStation if Sony want an increased presence on PC. But given the way that they've trotted out the ports of Horizon Zero Dawn and Days Gone - leaving PlayStation gamers with inferior versions - and given the recent anemic effort to trial something unusual with PS+ I'm not convinced the people in charge of strategy at PlayStation have any sort of vision.

Maybe it's time to bring back Ken Kuturagi.

 

[eastmen]

I posted this in the days gone pc post but figured it should go here too

https://in.ign.com/days-gone/159155/news/days-gone-pc-data-collection-policy-is-a-privacy-nightmare

I think sony is going to face a lot of issues if they put keyloggers into their games going forward.

 

[iroboto]

yikes

 

[pjbliverpool]

I posted this in the days gone pc post but figured it should go here too

https://in.ign.com/days-gone/159155/news/days-gone-pc-data-collection-policy-is-a-privacy-nightmare

I think sony is going to face a lot of issues if they put keyloggers into their games going forward.

WTF? A keylogger built into the game? I'm not usually too bothered by a lot of the privacy concerns that get brought up but that's a step way too far. And their excuse is that it's to prevent hacking and cheating... in a single player game?!?!

 

[Karamazov]

Kinda unexpected (from me) how little Sony makes on their first party exclusives. But then, thats we on hype forums only see the big hitters like HZD, GoW etc.



Not my experience, so it seems very individual there. Im getting a substantional better experience using my 2080Ti/3900x pc, higher settings, framerates, resolutions and performance, all while ray tracing where possible does lift all those things even more. The gap is only going to widen during the generation aswell. Also, 30fps aint going anywhere for graphically intensive exclusives like rift apart, unless theres sacrifces to be made to achieve 60fps. Or a performance mode down the line for a mid gen refresh (which likely wont happen this time around).

Steam surveys aint the best way to gauge the average pc gamer who plays these kind of titles anyway. Consoles are basically mid range 2019 products, a serious pc gamer has atleast a 5700XT (ps5 performance) i can imagine.

Don't know where you live but here in France just for you gpu+cpu it'll cost double the price of the ps5, then add the motherboard, and ssd...ps5/xsx are very competitive price wise this time.

 

[Rurouni]

Don't know where you live but here in France just for you gpu+cpu it'll cost double the price of the ps5, then add the motherboard, and ssd...ps5/xsx are very competitive price wise this time.

This is OT, but related to this conversation.

I agree with this. Like I've said before, some people in this forum are really out of touch with reality.
I've build my current PC mid last year (thus prices are still reasonable). I spend more money to build my PC vs what the PS5 cost in my country. I ended up with a 2nd hand RX580 and 3600. If I went with a new GPU I would end up with something like below RX570.

 

[chris1515]

Don't know where you live but here in France just for you gpu+cpu it'll cost double the price of the ps5, then add the motherboard, and ssd...ps5/xsx are very competitive price wise this time.

In Europe PC are much more expensive than in US.