So the GDC PS3 dev kits have GF7900's, but will have a GF7600 in the final PS3???

[Barnaby Jones]

Not sure why this is done, but going by these charts, the flop performance of the RSX is at 384 FLOPS per clock.

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/game/docs/20060329/3dps309.jpg

RSX does 368 FLOPS/clock, or half the numbers of GF7800GTX.

The question I have is, why are PS3 dev kits running on a GF7900? By all accounts the RSX is ready, why arent they used in the current dev kits? COuld this perhaps have something to do with the fact that the dev kits didn't have HDMI output?

 

[Barnaby Jones]

I don't understand, the Cell is finalized, the clock speed has been met, all SPU's that should be active, are.


Why are the dev kits(which understandbly are still 50 pounds) running with a pumped up videocard?

ANy idea if the kits still have 1 gig of ram? I'd be curious to see why this is the case, the Cell is finalized, the RSX is finalized. Am I missing something?

 

[The_Standard]

COuld this perhaps have something to do with the fact that the dev kits didn't have HDMI output?

http://www.hothardware.com/default.aspx#news1789

There was at least one dev kit at GDC with HDMI working. TG Daily/Tom's Hardware was wrong on that one.

 

[Barnaby Jones]

http://www.hothardware.com/default.aspx#news1789

There was at least one dev kit at GDC with HDMI working. TG Daily/Tom's Hardware was wrong on that one.

Whether or not that is true is hearsay, and kind of skirts the main question I'm bringing up.

If teh Cell and RSX are done, why arent the kits using RSX's?

 

[Barnaby Jones]

Just to reiterate the GF7800GTX is rated 728 FLOPS/clock, almost twice the rating of RSX.

 

[cho]

why you said the flops number is half of geforce 7800 ?

on geforce 7800, the pixel shader flops per cycle number(FP32) is :

24*2FMADD=24*2*8flop=384flops/cycle.

the RSX pixel shader flops number per cycle is same to the geforce 7800, and if you considering the RSX has higher clock compare with the geforce 7800 256MB (430mz for pixel shader on gf7800 256mb), the RSX the pixel shading power has 27.9% advantage.

 

[rounin]

Vertex counted vs Vertex not ?

 

[Pete]

RSX is a 7800GTX-512 (550MHz) with half the memory bus width. (I'm ignoring the vertex shader question.) 7900 is basically 7800 on 90nm. A 7900 isn't entirely inappropriate, and NV's probably stopped production of 7800s by now.

A 7600 has half the pixel shader power of a 7800/RSX, so it's not really appropriate.

As to why no RSX in dev kits, dunno. Maybe they're not mass-produced yet, or not pin-compatible with 7600/7800 cards and so not simply dropped into an existing card.

 

[Diesel2]

Stupid question, but where was it confirmed that RSX weren't in the dev kits?

 

[Barnaby Jones]

RSX is a 7800GTX-512 (550MHz) with half the memory bus width. (I'm ignoring the vertex shader question.) 7900 is basically 7800 on 90nm. A 7900 isn't entirely inappropriate, and NV's probably stopped production of 7800s by now.

A 7600 has half the pixel shader power of a 7800/RSX, so it's not really appropriate.

As to why no RSX in dev kits, dunno. Maybe they're not mass-produced yet, or not pin-compatible with 7600/7800 cards and so not simply dropped into an existing card.

Another thing to point out, the RSX handles all the audio in the PS3. At GDC there was a separate PC-like box for audio demonstration at GDC.

Unless Nvidia is lying, the RSX is done and has been done for months. It could have handled HDMI output and the audio processing in the GDC kits(which will most likely be the E3 kits)

 

[BlueTsunami]

\Unless Nvidia is lying, the RSX is done and has been done for months. It could have handled HDMI output and the audio processing in the GDC kits(which will most likely be the E3 kits)

Whether or not that is true is hearsay, and kind of skirts the main question I'm bringing up.

You just said the HDMI issue doesn't matter because it pretty much hearsay but you then use it as a point again here.

Like The Standard posted, there was a Dev Kit that was working fine with HDMI at GDC.

 

[Brimstone]

Stupid question, but where was it confirmed that RSX weren't in the dev kits?

This is where the conslusion of RSX not being in the kits is coming from. It's out of date though.

You'll also notice the RAM is doubled from what is currently planned for the final console.

 

[Barnaby Jones]

why you said the flops number is half of geforce 7800 ?

on geforce 7800, the pixel shader flops per cycle number(FP32) is :

24*2FMADD=24*2*8flop=384flops/cycle.

the RSX pixel shader flops number per cycle is same to the geforce 7800, and if you considering the RSX has higher clock compare with the geforce 7800 256MB (430mz for pixel shader on gf7800 256mb), the RSX the pixel shading power has 27.9% advantage.

http://rei-rom.com/gallery/albums/userpics/13423/g70summary.jpg.gif

7800GTX's FLOPS rating according to nVIDIA is 728 FLOPS/clock, twice the level indicated in SCEI slide.

6 Vertex Shaders(10 FLOPS each) + 12 Pixel Shaders(27 FLOPS each) = 384 FLOPS/clock <- As seen on SCEI slide.

 

[_phil_]

Stupid question, but where was it confirmed that RSX weren't in the dev kits?

nowhere ,and RSX is actually in the kits.You're probably the only person of this thread living in a tangible reality
It's said it's bad to wake up sleep walking people...

 

[MrWibble]

I don't usually get dragging into these silly arguments, and I mostly don't like commenting on devkits and stuff anyway because, you know, NDAs and stuff... however the stupidity here is making my head hurt and I'm sure Sony have already mentioned most of this stuff somewhere.

Here goes:

All the "rack-mount" sized devkits have RSX chips in them, and all of these devkits have audio.

There, I've said it. (if no-one hears from me again, can someone pop over and try to find where Sony hid the body?)

Just because someone chose to use a different cable to hook up the TV does not imply some massive conspiracy is going on.

It seems that some of the older kits were used for some GDC demonstrations - perhaps the authors simply didn't have time to update them for the new hardware, or possibly for the audio they didn't have an HDMI setup to use and had to use the old PC sound-card solution with discrete analog outputs... I don't know why Sony set things up like that, but there are many valid reasons they might have chosen those configurations which don't involve the current hardware being in any way imaginary.

Either way, this whole argument seems to be based on equating two sets of marketing presentations, for two different pieces of hardware, containing contrived performance numbers for each without a precise breakdown of how they were worked out... if there is a discrepency, I don't think you have to look too far to see where it may have come from.

 

[j^aws]

http://rei-rom.com/gallery/albums/userpics/13423/g70summary.jpg.gif

7800GTX's FLOPS rating according to nVIDIA is 728 FLOPS/clock, twice the level indicated in SCEI slide.

6 Vertex Shaders(10 FLOPS each) + 12 Pixel Shaders(27 FLOPS each) = 384 FLOPS/clock <- As seen on SCEI slide.

One set of numbers is BS peak and the other is a theoretical peak.

You also conveniently forget 24 Texture lookups/ cycle.

If you have 12 PS units and TWICE as many TMUs, when G7x and NV47 have a 1:1 ratio, then it's not based on them is it?

 

[Alpha_Spartan]

This is where the conslusion of RSX not being in the kits is coming from.
You'll also notice the RAM is doubled from what is currently planned for the final console.

That's the devkits. They always have twice the memory of the actual console.

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

Maybe, just maybe it has a 7900 because RSX has those 7900 improvments that nvidia did to the shader pipe line.???


Just a thought

 

[!eVo!-X Ant UK]

Another thing to point out, the RSX handles all the audio in the PS3. At GDC there was a separate PC-like box for audio demonstration at GDC.

Unless Nvidia is lying, the RSX is done and has been done for months. It could have handled HDMI output and the audio processing in the GDC kits(which will most likely be the E3 kits)

Funny that the specs mension Cell doing all the audio processing...

 

[Soir]

So couldn't it be that Cell handles the Audio but then sends it to RSX so that it can output it through HDMI?