Screen grab of the nextgen Madden football.

[jvd]

I"ve said it many many times , you guys are all reading into the hype way to much and to many of you guys are going to be highly disapointed in the outcome .


100x an increase in power may only equal a 10x leap in visual quality .

Then there are otehr things like increased a.i better physics .

I for one will be extremely happy with unreal 3 engine games as few of you have seen the game in action

 

[Qroach]

If the above shot is a render, as your sources state, then it appears that there is a good chance that the new shots are also renders.

Well i guess you can't see the difference in quality between the old renders and the new shots? I can see a difference. The new shots look good, but lack all teh motion blurring amd some small lighitng changes.

 

[Megadrive1988]

newest realtime nextgen Madden picture

 

[Raqia]

newest realtime nextgen Madden picture

Those models look like instanced versions of one model w/ a different jersey texture. But still damned nice.

 

[jvd]

Those models look like instanced versions of one model w/ a different jersey texture. But still damned nice.

could just be at this point in time they only have one finished model

 

[DemoCoder]

Given that Unreal3 has been demoed on a 6600GT and today's CPUs, I don't buy it. UE3's lighting still leaves alot to be designed (too shiny, poor ambient/diffuse) One could make a level that looks alot better than UE3's simply by using light probes.

Aren't light probes sampled from realworld locations? If so, how useful would they be when you're not trying to replicate the environment you sampled from? If you're trying to recreate a Martian environment, wouldn't you have to use a light probe on Mars?

No, light probes can be created artificially via offline rendering. What you do is render your level using whatever super-realistic offline ambient/diffuse lighting system you want (radiosity, etc) and stick light probes in the level to record the lighting at various points in the scene. Then later, in realtime, you can use those lightprobes to augment whatever shading system you want (even combine them with spherical harmonics) This differs from the way radiosity was used in Quake et al, because it records the emissive properties of the scene, rather than computing shadow maps.

of course even better would be to model your level on the real world. For example, if you're recreating Laguna Seca for Gran Turismo 5, you'd model the race track on real world geometry, and drive a car around the track with a lightprobe attached recording the real world HDR lighting at various points. This looks TONS better than the best Unreal3 level you've seen.

It is the technique used in Debevec's Image Based Rendering, and it was used in The Matrix movies.

 

[jvd]

Given that Unreal3 has been demoed on a 6600GT and today's CPUs, I don't buy it. UE3's lighting still leaves alot to be designed (too shiny, poor ambient/diffuse) One could make a level that looks alot better than UE3's simply by using light probes.

when was it demoed on a 6600gt ?

Last i heard at e3 they were run on 6800ultras and x800xt pe and the highest end cpus of the time and only managed 15fps


WHere did u read else where

 

[DemoCoder]

Epic VP Mark Rein said so. Do a google search for "Mark Rein" and 6600gt. Doesn't mean it will run great, but he indicated it would probably run ok at 800x600 on a 6600GT.

In anycase, UE3 is not a quantum leap in render quality. It uses parallax mapping, soft shadows, lots of geometry/polybump, "baked in" radiosity/raytracing, but from a global illumination point of view, its barely scratched the surface.

If you want photorealism, you've got to use more IBR techniques. We learned that if you want great textures, you've got to sample them from the real world and at high res, instead of paint them in an editor. Likewise, if you want realistic ambient lighting, you need to model real world locations or artificial scenes with global illumination.

 

[jvd]

Epic VP Mark Rein said so. Do a google search for "Mark Rein" and 6600gt. Doesn't mean it will run great, but he indicated it would probably run ok at 800x600 on a 6600GT.

I have to look , wonder what was turned off to run it .

 

[Megadrive1988]

ok lets get all of the Madden shots (CGI and Real-Time) together in one place.


probably real-time

.....................................................................................................


real-time or CG renders? to me, these 2 look similar to the confirmed CG render

.....................................................................................................

confirmed CG render

 

[pegisys]

I don't know what all the fuss is about everyone knows gameshot are touched up some kind of way looking pass that I can see this being realtime if they are using displacement mapping they can focus more polygon on parts that need it to give it a more realistic look that and console players don't complain when there games are running at 30fps so they can pile on the details

 

[rabidrabbit]

. . , . , , .

 

[wco81]

Some people are claiming Madden will rup at 60fps.

Would be interesting since they've never done that before.

 

[BOOMEXPLODE]

IMO those football players look kind of like plastic rubber dolls when compared to the UE3 images I've seen. That might just be because it's easier to create a "realistic" looking alien freak than it is to create a realistic looking human being. Although alot of Nvidias demos are more impressive too, running on "old" hardware no less.

 

[London Geezer]

IMO those football players look kind of like plastic rubber dolls when compared to the UE3 images I've seen. That might just be because it's easier to create a "realistic" looking alien freak than it is to create a realistic looking human being. Although alot of Nvidias demos are more impressive too, running on "old" hardware no less.

To be honest i still have to see something rendered in realtime (UE3 or not) that doesn't look like a freaking rubber doll. Things are getting better, but until we get much much better surface lighting techniques that are not based on the Phong model, things are not going to change much. They'll just look like higher res rubber dolls.

Subsurface scattering helps a lot i must say but it's still a big no-no in games for obvious reasons.

 

[marconelly!]

Last i heard at e3 they were run on 6800ultras and x800xt pe and the highest end cpus of the time and only managed 15fps

THe videos I've seen definitely run quite smoothly, which would not be the case if they were only 15FPS :\

newest realtime nextgen Madden picture

Keep in mind that even these 'realtime' pictures are tagged as "target visuals" on EA's site. They definitely look more realtime than picture of those two guys on the ground, though.

 

[ERP]

THe videos I've seen definitely run quite smoothly, which would not be the case if they were only 15FPS :\

Hate to break it to you, but I've commonly recorded video running at a constant 30/60 whatever you want framerate from in progress games that don't manage much more than 20 at the time.

As a developer all you have to do is lock the time step to whatever then capture individual frames at whatever rate you can produce them.

 

[DemoCoder]

I saw UE3 in person running realtime and it didn't look like 15fps to me, althought there was some areas of slowdown.

 

[jvd]

there was a huge thread about it running behind doors at last years e3 at 15 fps on the x800xt pes and the 6800ultras .

 

[Paul]

The new shots look very very good, 360 will have a great launch that's for sure.

The finished game will probably look even better, though not much, probably coming close to rivaling the concept CG render.