Rift, Vive, and Virtual Reality

[cheapchips]

It'd be a real shame of Oculus don't develop the Rift further. It's a much better product than the competion.

There's a timing issue with the state of PC graphics. Mass market cards won't be able to run 4k VR for a few years. Or least the current experiences ressed up, and tbh, I'd want more from next gen VR than that.

Hopefully we'll have PSVR2 and WMR V2 driving the high end market forward.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

Hopefully we'll have PSVR2 and WMR V2 driving the high end market forward.

I wouldn't look for WMR V2 to drive the high end market unless VR takes off in a really big way. Right now, MS is more focused on making VR affordable and accessible enough for the market to grow such that it could eventually support a high end market.

Regards,
SB

 

[eastmen]

I wouldn't look for WMR V2 to drive the high end market unless VR takes off in a really big way. Right now, MS is more focused on making VR affordable and accessible enough for the market to grow such that it could eventually support a high end market.

Regards,
SB

The current WMR headests already hit $200 I don't think droping them further will do much. The odessey + has fixed up some rough spots of the original model like adding a Bluetooth controller into the headset .

I would expect WMR2 to introduce a slightly larger FOV again (120ish as they are at 110 now) Kinect for azure to enable better tracking with a 4 camera array instead of two and larger resolution. My vega 56 has no problem driving the odessey , infact my friend runs it on a 970.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I completely forgot WMR headsets exist. I presume they're selling pretty terribly given a complete lack of noise for them?

 

[Kaotik]

I completely forgot WMR headsets exist. I presume they're selling pretty terribly given a complete lack of noise for them?

No clue, but Samsung just released new Odyssey+ -WMR-headset which has 2x 3.5" 1440x1600 AMOLED-panels and some sort of light diffusing grid on top of them to get rid of screen door -effect (they claim it feels like double the PPI but apparently it just adds slight blur to the image making pixel boundaries next to invisble)

https://www.samsung.com/us/computin...windows-mixed-reality-headset-xe800zba-hc1us/

 

[Silent_Buddha]

The current WMR headests already hit $200 I don't think droping them further will do much. The odessey + has fixed up some rough spots of the original model like adding a Bluetooth controller into the headset .

I would expect WMR2 to introduce a slightly larger FOV again (120ish as they are at 110 now) Kinect for azure to enable better tracking with a 4 camera array instead of two and larger resolution. My vega 56 has no problem driving the odessey , infact my friend runs it on a 970.

Yes, they'll move technology down the scale, but they aren't likely to push high end headsets. Just like the current headsets would have been high end headsets if they'd launched simultaneously with Vive and Rift.

Of course, that doesn't stop OEMs from trying to differentiate themselves with higher end equipment if they feel the market is there for it.

The only ones I see potentially pushing high end headsets are HTC/Valve, Oculus/Facebook, or Samsung (due to their display business) and possibly LG at some point. And then the various smaller players like Pimax.

Regards,
SB

 

[Arwin]

I think the Quest could be really good though. Look forward to seeing how it turns out. I can also understand why a Rift 2 wouldn’t necessarily solve the right problems just yet.

 

[eastmen]

Yes, they'll move technology down the scale, but they aren't likely to push high end headsets. Just like the current headsets would have been high end headsets if they'd launched simultaneously with Vive and Rift.

Of course, that doesn't stop OEMs from trying to differentiate themselves with higher end equipment if they feel the market is there for it.

The only ones I see potentially pushing high end headsets are HTC/Valve, Oculus/Facebook, or Samsung (due to their display business) and possibly LG at some point. And then the various smaller players like Pimax.

Regards,
SB

Looks like Samsung might be tying themselves to MS . Away I think we will see a solid next gen headset from sony around the ps5 and I think with the next xbox ms will jump in

 

[cheapchips]

Since Scorpio will be powerful enough to do VR I'm sure they will either do something themselves or support whatever WMR2 device you want to plug in.

Although the streaming version of Scorpio might be a bit of a spanner in the works for user base compared to PS5.

 

[eastmen]

Since Scorpio will be powerful enough to do VR I'm sure they will either do something themselves or support whatever WMR2 device you want to plug in.

Although the streaming version of Scorpio might be a bit of a spanner in the works for user base compared to PS5.

I don't think scorpio will be in the equation. my thought is that once Xbox two or whatever comes out. the Xbox one family will be dead and buried. Sure it will get newer games due to the fact that it still has a user base like with any generation change. However MS will stop supporting it with its own games . Everything will be Xbox two exclusive.

 

[cheapchips]

Doh. I didn't mean to write Scorpio. I meant Scarlett/XB2

 

[eastmen]

Doh. I didn't mean to write Scorpio. I meant Scarlett/XB2

is that what they are calling it ?

Anyway yes I expect XB2 to be over 12tflops so It should be more than powerful enough for a decent headset. Hopefully MS will have the new Kinect (or even newer version) integrated for tracking along with a 4 camera set up for larger volume and it would be great if they would have a WMR spec that works on both xb2 and pc at the time.

 

[Ike Turner]

is that what they are calling it ?

Anyway yes I expect XB2 to be over 12tflops so It should be more than powerful enough for a decent headset. Hopefully MS will have the new Kinect (or even newer version) integrated for tracking along with a 4 camera set up for larger volume and it would be great if they would have a WMR spec that works on both xb2 and pc at the time.

Console power was never really the issue. Microsoft has already stated that they won't do console VR unless it's wireless and so far we haven't see any robust technology that would painlessly enabled this.

 

[eastmen]

Console power was never really the issue. Microsoft has already stated that they won't do console VR unless it's wireless and so far we haven't see any robust technology that would painlessly enabled this.

Qualcomm announced a new 60gbps wifi chip today. I would assume whenever MS launches their headset they would use the newest version available. If they go USB 3 to a dedicated wifi direct set up they would just need to sell a cord to a small box that would sit in front off your TV to enable line of sight with the headset. WMR already has inside out tracking for 6dof so at that point there really isn't to much missing. I would expect them to want to work on the compression for the data being transmitted since comparing the vive to the vive pro shows issues. For even better tracking MS can add a camera to that small box to increase tracking volume. Since the back of the head is the worse tracked area for inside out tracking they can simply tell you to face the opposite direction of the tv when playing. That way the back of you is mostly facing the extra camera.


https://www.engadget.com/2018/10/16/qualcomm-60ghz-chips/ 300meters sounds pretty good for a vr solution in a home. Much better than the current solutions

 

[cheapchips]

I wonder how inside out tracking copes on a 60ghz network, if you have to send the camera images to be processed on the host machine.

Since you need hardware decode the transmitted video, I guess it's not too much of an overhead to be tracking locally on the headset anyway. Oculus Quest suggests that it's pretty cheap, even without a dedicated chip like MS's HPU.

 

[eastmen]

I wonder how inside out tracking copes on a 60ghz network, if you have to send the camera images to be processed on the host machine.

Since you need hardware decode the transmitted video, I guess it's not too much of an overhead to be tracking locally on the headset anyway. Oculus Quest suggests that it's pretty cheap, even without a dedicated chip like MS's HPU.

I don't believe the HPU does tracking , I believe its the cherry trail

 

[cheapchips]

The HPU processes all the sensor data and bundles it up. It creates the 3d map of the enviroment and does gesture recognition. Cherry trail isn't being sent a camera feed.

 

[manux]

This is bad. No wonder oculus is not making pc a focus

Road to VR
ran the figure against the most recent Hardware & Software Survey (September), and found the following counts for headsets connected to users’ computers over the course of the month.

Oculus Rift 306,000
HTC Vive 274,000
Windows Mixed Reality 47,000
HTC Vive Pro 13,000
Oculus Rift DK2 7,000
Total 647,000
It’s worth noting that the Steam Hardware & Software Survey counts how many users have headsets attached to their computers; even if the user didn’t actually use the headset to play a game in the given month, it would still be counted.

https://www.roadtovr.com/new-valve-data-suggests-648000-active-vr-headsets-on-steam/

 

[Ike Turner]

This is bad.

This was expect by anyone who was not a VC di@head or in it to make a quick buck (which is what the VR "industry" is made of since Oculus sold to Facebook). Nothing new to see here. For anyone who has been in it for this past few years, who knows about technology and who doesn't have any chips in it, the whole damn thing always looked like a money laundering scheme for Silicon Valley VCs (on a smaller scale compared to last year's Crypto currency asshatery though). Trust me, the level of stupidity and shadiness I witnessed was staggering.

 

[Picao84]

This is bad. No wonder oculus is not making pc a focus



https://www.roadtovr.com/new-valve-data-suggests-648000-active-vr-headsets-on-steam/

1) Not everyone has the VR headset connected to the PC at all times
2) Not everyone allows Steam to get their data.
3) Oculus users probably use Oculus Home more than Steam.

These numbers cannot be taken as being representative of actual sales/users.