Question regarding Viva Pinata graphics *

[vanquish]

As I am unable to PM, I have to start a new thread.

Anyway I have VP, I like VP, I think the art style is fantastic
BUT I do not think its graphics are technically superior to Gears of War (which I also have, and is also a 2006 game).

Now some people on Beyond3D believe the opposite to be true, can someone explain why?

I have always believed that the Unreal Engine 3 as seen in Gow and Bioshock has been the engine that has wrung the most out of the Xbox360. Until perhaps FarCry 2's Dunia hits this year.

If I am wrong, why?

 

[digitalwanderer]

What is "VP"?

 

[AlNom]

Changed the thread title, digi.

 

[digitalwanderer]

Thanks.

And to answer the original poster, because pretty/cute crinkled paper pinatas are a bit harder to render well and they're rendered VERY well in VP.

 

[Zassk]

Has there been a graphical upgrade in VP2 compared to VP1? The game reviews haven't touched on the visuals much.

 

[Malibu]

Has there been a graphical upgrade in VP2 compared to VP1? The game reviews haven't touched on the visuals much.

The biggest thing I have noticed is the addition of HDR.

 

[vanquish]

Thanks.

And to answer the original poster, because pretty/cute crinkled paper pinatas are a bit harder to render well and they're rendered VERY well in VP.

You mean more so than the millions of polygons used in the extremely detailed Gears of War characters? Most of the objects in Viva Pinata are quite simple geometrically, although this is determined by the game's style, but doesn't it also mean they are easier to render?

 

[jandlecack]

You mean more so than the millions of polygons used in the extremely detailed Gears of War characters? Most of the objects in Viva Pinata are quite simple geometrically, although this is determined by the game's style, but doesn't it also mean they are easier to render?

You exaggerating on purpose I hope? Gears 1's most important characters had something around 10k polys. Those are like 4 different ones.

 

[vanquish]

You exaggerating on purpose I hope? Gears 1's most important characters had something around 10k polys. Those are like 4 different ones.

But the original models (used to make normal maps) were like in the million polygon ranges.

So are you saying that the VP engine is more efficient than the UE3 on 360?

 

[jandlecack]

Why no, I'm not saying that. But Gears isn't that amazing at all, specially considering how little they focused on levels but how much (comparably) on characters. I mean, I've seen shots of textures on a helicopter that are 512x512 at best. In any case, the polygon counts, to my knowledge aren't staggeringly high either.

Sure beats Viva Pinata, but there's games on the 360 that I'd say pull a lot more out of the system - i.e. Mass Effect running on the same engine. Then again ME was arguably pulling too much out of the system.

 

[vanquish]

Why no, I'm not saying that. But Gears isn't that amazing at all, specially considering how little they focused on levels but how much (comparably) on characters. I mean, I've seen shots of textures on a helicopter that are 512x512 at best. In any case, the polygon counts, to my knowledge aren't staggeringly high either.

Sure beats Viva Pinata, but there's games on the 360 that I'd say pull a lot more out of the system - i.e. Mass Effect running on the same engine. Then again ME was arguably pulling too much out of the system.

So what engine do you think is getting the most out of the 360?

 

[Cheezdoodles]

Certainly not UE3

 

[jandlecack]

Agreed w/ Ostepop, however I was saying that Mass Effect got a lot out of the 360 as far as UE3 is concerned.

The engine that I find most impressive running on 360 will have to be Dunia I'm afraid, which also runs on PC and PS3.

The problem with 360 is that most or any exclusives don't run on proprietary engines specifically for the console, but they tend to optimize UE3 a little more than they would for a multi platform game. This is why games that previously were on 360 only, with very limited exclusive agreements, are now on PS3 using the same technology. No engine porting needed, see BioShock. I mean of course porting is needed but not to an extent of, say, MGS4 or KZ2 engines, which are MADE for PS3 hardware.

In any case, Dunia is probably my choice for this year.

 

[silhouette]

To date, I think Halo 3 has the best lighting and shading engine (but falls a little short on texturing and a lot on character models and no AA). Texture qualitywise my choice would be Gears still (but I onlt have 12 games, so there might be some other out that bests GEars1).

Btw, the engine improvements are always an ongoing process. Many multiplatform games up the bar recently. Take Pure for example, it has very clean, very nice, very beautiful graphics with very long draw distance. I think it has AA too (though I cannot tell if it is 2 or 4). And, it is multi-platform game. Gears2 also seems to best Gears in almost all departments.

360 and PS3 GPU are not very far from each other in terms of performance and features. So, it is not unexpected to see similar quality graphics on both platforms.

 

[vanquish]

Agreed w/ Ostepop, however I was saying that Mass Effect got a lot out of the 360 as far as UE3 is concerned.

The engine that I find most impressive running on 360 will have to be Dunia I'm afraid, which also runs on PC and PS3.

The problem with 360 is that most or any exclusives don't run on proprietary engines specifically for the console, but they tend to optimize UE3 a little more than they would for a multi platform game. This is why games that previously were on 360 only, with very limited exclusive agreements, are now on PS3 using the same technology. No engine porting needed, see BioShock. I mean of course porting is needed but not to an extent of, say, MGS4 or KZ2 engines, which are MADE for PS3 hardware.

In any case, Dunia is probably my choice for this year.

From what I've seen of Far Cry 2, I would have to agree. Wonder whether the PS3 or 360 version will look better, apparently the team doing th PS3 port is significantly larger than the Xbox 360 team.

But people really think Halo 3 is the best engine based on shaders? While the sand in maps such as Sandtrap is pretty good, the water effects are quite lacking.
I would think maybe VP2/BK3 or the new Prince of Persia are better.

 

[pipo]

But people really think Halo 3 is the best engine based on shaders? While the sand in maps such as Sandtrap is pretty good, the water effects are quite lacking.

I would think maybe VP2/BK3 or the new Prince of Persia are better.

One of the problems is the time frame. You really can't compare a new engine with one from last year in this case...

 

[liolio]

To date, I think Halo 3 has the best lighting and shading engine (but falls a little short on texturing and a lot on character models and no AA). Texture qualitywise my choice would be Gears still (but I onlt have 12 games, so there might be some other out that bests GEars1).

Btw, the engine improvements are always an ongoing process. Many multiplatform games up the bar recently. Take Pure for example, it has very clean, very nice, very beautiful graphics with very long draw distance. I think it has AA too (though I cannot tell if it is 2 or 4). And, it is multi-platform game. Gears2 also seems to best Gears in almost all departments.

360 and PS3 GPU are not very far from each other in terms of performance and features. So, it is not unexpected to see similar quality graphics on both platforms.

Yes it's clear tha multi platfrom engine have gone a long way.
AC engine, UE III, ID5, Capcom MT's Framework and others are pretty impressive.

I agree Pure is impressive, it doesn't have the hype it should because it's a multi-platform game.

 

[homerdog]

But people really think Halo 3 is the best engine based on shaders? While the sand in maps such as Sandtrap is pretty good, the water effects are quite lacking.

Halo 3 has the best water effects of any game I've ever seen. I am not joking.

http://www.breakitdownblog.com/evolution-of-water-in-games-best-is-halo-3/

Back on topic, isn't Viva Pinata one of the only games that uses the tessellator?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

We only know which games use the tesselator based on which devs tell us. More games could without anyone spilling the beans.

 

[Extra411]

however I was saying that Mass Effect got a lot out of the 360 as far as UE3 is concerned.

In what respect? Mass Effect had poorer framerate, extremely poor loading, and the overall visual experience is just worse than Gears for me (although that's also partly due to art direction). I'm also finding it really hard to agree with the consensus here regarding UE3, as I find it to be one of the best engines this gen for overall appearance and speed. Are there really that many games that can compete with Unreal Tournament 3 in overall appearance and its solid framerate? Frankly I don't find a game like Halo 3 to be near the same league, HDR or not.

But Gears isn't that amazing at all, specially considering how little they focused on levels but how much (comparably) on characters. I mean, I've seen shots of textures on a helicopter that are 512x512 at best.

Have you seen the texture sizes they used on MGS4? Yet a lot of people (including myself) consider it to be one of the better looking games this gen. I'm kind of in the same boat as the TC; it's a bit confusing to me as I consistently see UE3/Gears being downplayed yet I've hardly seen any retail games elipsing it (I own close to 50 games on 360/PS3).