[PS3] Killzone 2

[the ignoramus]

The AI is pretty sick in this game. I just replayed the Raedec fight. I move a lot between the foremost cover positions to try and control battle arena and not allow the Helghast to flank me on one side or the other.

I noticed that the AI began to consistently predict my pattern of movement. At first it was a few Helghast trying to beat me to my sweet spots. I thought that was cool. However, when that didn't work the Higs began tossing grenades. To my utter amazement that Higs didn't toss the grenades at my current cover position but instead at where it expected me to run next since I stuck to a strict pattern of movement. I died about twice before I noticed what was happening. I would hear a grenade land and move to my next preferred cover position but without seeing where the grenade actually landed I ran right to my death two times in a row. I was simply amazed at that moment. I never expected the AI to set me up like that.

I can attest to this.
I didnt particularly enjoy the Radec fight itself (it was obvious the shooting mechanics dont support a fast moving boss that teleports anywhere and everywhere, then rushes you with knife or bullet), but the build up to that scenario is quite the showcase for the AI, at least on Elite.

Initially,at the start of the fight, I'd rush the exact spots the Higs would jump down from, knife them with a quick swipe, rush to a far corner, then wait for the next batch of Higs to vault over the rails. I died lots, but on the seventh or eighth time of my doing this, one of the Higs sent a grenade about a half dozen steps ahead of me and exactly in the corner of the room I'd headed to the previous 6 or 7 times. Impressive I thought, but maybe a coincidence. But as I continued doing this, I started noticing that I was taking an awful lot of gunfire right from the spots where these guys would jump down from, and I noticed that there was a Hig upstairs (not Radec) firing down at me, while his buddy climbed over the railing..now the previous dozen or so times, nobody had this vaulting Higs back.
He would climb down and be met with a shotgun blast or a knife, then die.
But then all of a sudden, as this guy climbs down, a second Hig joins him and starts laying down suppressing fire to preempt my attack.

And later, as I was fighting Radec, executing the exact same moveset for the eigth or ninth time, he too sent a grenade flying about 7 or 8 steps ahead
of exactly where I was heading.

I also had a couple of crazy "WTF did I just see" moments while I fought the second wave of Higs on the balcony floor.

The first time, two Hig grunts rushed me from the walkway on the far right, (the one that the Hig flamethrower grunt sets ablaze) but as I ran to engage them (with my trusty combat knife..believe me, if you
want to win this fight on Elite, you will learn to use, love and appreciate this knife) one of them caught fire. I continued my Rambo charge, running at the second one with a swipe, and missed. As I began to turn around and look for the bastard, I thought, ``oh shit, I`m a dead man.``
But the expected melee to the back didnt come and to my utter amazement, as I turned around fully, I saw the Hig lift his legs over the balcony railing on the side of us, jump down to the lower floor, then proceed to hide behind cover.

The second time, something similar happened, except this time it was with those knife wielding maniacs; I inadvertently stumbled across one of them, and as I switched to my blade, looking to knife the sucker, he`d already entered his climbing animation and was pulling himself over the side of the railing. As he gathered himself for the jump, I slashed at him, but he was out of my reach
(or the game wasnt allowing me to hit him), because he jumped down safely to the bottom floor and rejoined his other buddies!

 

[Kittonwy]

I love the enemy AI in Killzone 2, they do some really smart and interesting things.

Just got the M4 magnum for MP, it's great, it's great.

 

[RenegadeRocks]

I can attest to this.
I didnt particularly enjoy the Radec fight itself (it was obvious the shooting mechanics dont support a fast moving boss that teleports anywhere and everywhere, then rushes you with knife or bullet), but the build up to that scenario is quite the showcase for the AI, at least on Elite.

Initially,at the start of the fight, I'd rush the exact spots the Higs would jump down from, knife them with a quick swipe, rush to a far corner, then wait for the next batch of Higs to vault over the rails. I died lots, but on the seventh or eighth time of my doing this, one of the Higs sent a grenade about a half dozen steps ahead of me and exactly in the corner of the room I'd headed to the previous 6 or 7 times. Impressive I thought, but maybe a coincidence. But as I continued doing this, I started noticing that I was taking an awful lot of gunfire right from the spots where these guys would jump down from, and I noticed that there was a Hig upstairs (not Radec) firing down at me, while his buddy climbed over the railing..now the previous dozen or so times, nobody had this vaulting Higs back.
He would climb down and be met with a shotgun blast or a knife, then die.
But then all of a sudden, as this guy climbs down, a second Hig joins him and starts laying down suppressing fire to preempt my attack.

And later, as I was fighting Radec, executing the exact same moveset for the eigth or ninth time, he too sent a grenade flying about 7 or 8 steps ahead
of exactly where I was heading.

I also had a couple of crazy "WTF did I just see" moments while I fought the second wave of Higs on the balcony floor.

The first time, two Hig grunts rushed me from the walkway on the far right, (the one that the Hig flamethrower grunt sets ablaze) but as I ran to engage them (with my trusty combat knife..believe me, if you
want to win this fight on Elite, you will learn to use, love and appreciate this knife) one of them caught fire. I continued my Rambo charge, running at the second one with a swipe, and missed. As I began to turn around and look for the bastard, I thought, ``oh shit, I`m a dead man.``
But the expected melee to the back didnt come and to my utter amazement, as I turned around fully, I saw the Hig lift his legs over the balcony railing on the side of us, jump down to the lower floor, then proceed to hide behind cover.

The second time, something similar happened, except this time it was with those knife wielding maniacs; I inadvertently stumbled across one of them, and as I switched to my blade, looking to knife the sucker, he`d already entered his climbing animation and was pulling himself over the side of the railing. As he gathered himself for the jump, I slashed at him, but he was out of my reach
(or the game wasnt allowing me to hit him), because he jumped down safely to the bottom floor and rejoined his other buddies!

WOW ! I didn't notice that they were so smart !

 

[Arwin]

Put some more time into this yesterday night and some of the last missions are indeed spectacular as advertised. And it's very hard to stop playing. I'm now at the last mission ... .

 

[DrJay24]

Put some more time into this yesterday night and some of the last missions are indeed spectacular as advertised. And it's very hard to stop playing. I'm now at the last mission ... .

I finished my second play through last night and immediately went into my third. It seems the more you know about the weapons and levels, the more you have fun experimenting with combinations. It was still amazing all the way to the Radec fight how much I missed on the levels. Did anyone else find that you can

Spoiler

run around to the right side, jump the barrier and go right after Radec and his minions up top above the stairs? It made the rocket launcher trooper part much easier, I bum rushed them.

I see people complain about the SP campaign and I just don't know what game they are playing, this is one of the best war based shooter campaigns I've played in many years.

I'm still missing a few doable trophies, the three pistol headshot one is killing me.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I see people complain about the SP campaign and I just don't know what game they are playing, this is one of the best war based shooter campaigns I've played in many years.

If anything I think the MP is the disappointment. A lot of reviews and comments I've read suggest the SP is good and the MP is part that carries the game, but I think its the opposite, which isn't what I was expecting.

 

[patsu]

Put some more time into this yesterday night and some of the last missions are indeed spectacular as advertised. And it's very hard to stop playing. I'm now at the last mission ... .

Yes, the Palace fight is stellar. It conveyed the warzone atmosphere most convincingly. Both the friendly AI and enemy AI did very well for me here.

If anything I think the MP is the disappointment. A lot of reviews and comments I've read suggest the SP is good and the MP is part that carries the game, but I think its the opposite, which isn't what I was expecting.

IMHO, the MP without soldier classes is very enjoyable and addicting. They just need to tweak a few flaws in the soldier classes and add the party system.

 

[hey69]

well on my way singleplayer .what a game

 

[BoardBonobo]

I'm still missing a few doable trophies, the three pistol headshot one is killing me.

Gah! That trophy was a real b*tch to get. In the end I just sat at a point where the H respawned and popped away until I got lucky!

As for playing out of sync, on the

Spoiler

section where you get to take over tank. I basically cleared the bridge, and climbed down the ladder to trigger the next section with the H tank. I then climbed back up the ladder to attack the second wave of troops on the bridge and used the heavy machine guns to lay waste to the H below me. Totally by passed driving the tank.

 

[the ignoramus]

Yes, I've been playing some of the other top shooters extensively, then switching back to KZ2, just to see how it compares.
Suffice it to say, the SP's core gameplay is competitive with the very best in the genre. The storytelling is comparitively weaker, the characterization obnoxious and forgettable, but every firefight (other than Radec) feels well crafted and finely tuned.
I replayed COD4's All Ghillied Up and KZ2's Salamun Bridge this morning, and it's interesting to see the different approaches to game design.

 

[RobertR1]

I replayed COD4's All Ghillied Up and KZ2's Salamun Bridge this morning, and it's interesting to see the different approaches to game design.

If CoD had even respectable AI, All Ghilied Up would easily be the top 3 levels in a FPS game ever. It did everything right except for the non existant AI in CoD games. Such a shame.....

 

[obonicus]

If CoD had even respectable AI, All Ghilied Up would easily be the top 3 levels in a FPS game ever. It did everything right except for the non existant AI in CoD games. Such a shame.....

CoD4 is excellent first time through -- you don't see the seams quite as well.

 

[the ignoramus]

CoD4 is excellent first time through -- you don't see the seams quite as well.

I most certainly did, but that's because I was stupid and decided to play it on Veteran, a difficulty that is home to some of the cheapest, maddening gameplay you'll ever encounter in an fps.
But it is a very cool, immersive and enjoyable game on normal, maybe even hardened too. When COD4 rocks, it fucking rocks (All Ghillied Up, Shock and Awe, No Fighting in the War Room, Mile High Club), I just wasnt able to overlook certain design decisions.
Just like I cant overlook some of the embarrassing storytelling in KZ2: I literally cringed during the scene at the end of Tharsis Refinery.
Why couldnt I just use the medkit on him?!!!
The second time through, I figured maybe it was because of the close proximity to the Petrusite stuff, but I was able to rez Natko in the encounter leading up to that cutscene.
Horrible, horrible storytelling. I also take offense to GG killing off the main protagonist of the previous two games in a completely cold and unceremonious manner. That was kind of a spit in the face. It's nice to know that the developers considered Templar a totally disposable character in KZ plot arc.

 

[vanquish]

Storytelling is often a problem with Euro titles.

I hated the respawning enemy AI in COD4, and their ridiculous propensity to throw grenades absolutely everywhere. However the die very easily, even on Veteran which is good.

And it does force you to advance quickly, and not just sit there taking potshots all day.

 

[obonicus]

I most certainly did, but that's because I was stupid and decided to play it on Veteran, a difficulty that is home to some of the cheapest, maddening gameplay you'll ever encounter in an fps.

Yeah, I forgot about that. That's been true about CoD since 1, too.

Horrible, horrible storytelling. I also take offense to GG killing off the main protagonist of the previous two games in a completely cold and unceremonious manner. That was kind of a spit in the face. It's nice to know that the developers considered Templar a totally disposable character in KZ plot arc.

Actually, that wasn't so bad, though maybe it was too little, too late. Making it so no one has script immunity would have been interesting... and going the CoD4 route of having important NPCs be utterly indestructible until they're not (which is also a pretty cheap way to go, also thanks to their arbitrary nature) might've been a better choice than the defibrillator gun.

 

[Scott_Arm]

I played some more KZ2 tonight ... I don't know. I was enjoying the SP more at first. That sidekick REALLY REALLY SUCKS and he's annoying as hell. He never ever shuts up. Is there a way to mute him and his horrible dialog?

Tonight I ran into so many invisible walls, saw so many weird grenade rebounds and saw so much stupid AI behavior ... I feel like the game was rushed, despite the length of time it was in development. The levels really aren't that good early on. I'm just gettin through the Saluman bridge.

The game is pretty good, but it isn't anywhere in my favorites. About the only thing it does really well is graphics, and it does sound well too. Everything else is leaving me with something to be desired.

I tried to fire a flame thrower through an open window, but the flames caught an invisible wall and bounced back at me. I tried to throw a grenade at some hellgast and the grenade rode along a wall, and then flew out off the wall at a 90 degree angle and landed the equivalent of 30 ft away.

My idiot teammate cannot stay alive for more than 20 seconds in a gun fight because he lacks AI anywhere near the level of the enemy, which is basically to take cover and pop some shots out or throw grenades. He can't even do that. He's completely useless. He's so insanely annoying with his constant whining. And if you get too far away, he'll even whine over the intercom at you. What a dick. Maybe it's because I'm playing on the hard setting on my first play, but he shouldn't even be in the game. He does absolutely nothing, and adds absolutely nothing to the game.

What's with the invincible hands when the hellgast blind fire over barriers? Is it just me, or are their hands not hittable?

Why do they mute the sound and turn the screen black when you're hurt? Why? They may as well just kill you right off. I can see distorting the vision, but why mute the sound? All it does is making dieing unexciting. You should always hear those guns roaring. On top of that, why are the corners of the screen always faded out?

Twice tonight I turned to run from firefights and ran into walls that were invisible. About a second after I hit them they popped. Not a big deal, but a little annoying when you're trying to get away from a grenade.

I dunno ... The action is not good enough to make up for some of the annoyances yet. Right now, I'm going to say it's a pretty average single player.

 

[patsu]

What difficulty level are you playing ? and which level are you at now ?

My idiot teammate cannot stay alive for more than 20 seconds in a gun fight because he lacks AI anywhere near the level of the enemy, which is basically to take cover and pop some shots out or throw grenades. He can't even do that. He's completely useless. He's so insanely annoying with his constant whining. And if you get too far away, he'll even whine over the intercom at you. What a dick. Maybe it's because I'm playing on the hard setting on my first play, but he shouldn't even be in the game. He does absolutely nothing, and adds absolutely nothing to the game.

The AI could execute stop and pop move, or throw grenades. I have seen Rico done that before. Generally, I leave the AI alone. If they fall, I only revive them at the end of the skirmish unless I need a decoy or run out of ammo. I remember they were pretty good at preventing enemies from overrunning your position (e.g., the level where there were 2 Heavies, the bridge, outside the Palace, inside the Palace with Rico).

If you rush out to knife the soldiers, you may appreciate the friendly forces in the open more (because they take fire away from you). If you stop and pop, then you probably prefer them to fire from cover to cover. I can see why they may die more easily in higher difficulty though.

My only major gripe is they may block a narrow pathway if you're not careful.

 

[DrJay24]

I'm going to say it's a pretty average single player.

If anything I think the MP is the disappointment.

We get it, trade it in already.

 

[betan]

Rico's AI is pretty terrible especially after the balcony, but you have to try really hard to get him killed in 20 secs, I would think.

 

[patsu]

You mean the second floor balcony in the last fight ?

He was pretty useful to me on the first floor (first wave). Once we reached second floor, I would abandon him to look for another spot. If I stay near him, it's because I need him to warn me about a nearby enemy... in case one managed to flank me.