Obligatory iPhone 4 Thread...

[BRiT]

And until the windows ui and all the apps scale correctly toward higher resolutions, no thanks.

This should be true under Windows 7.

 

[RobertR1]

Apple's bullshit explanation.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/02/apple-iphone-4-reception-problems-a-software-issue-fix-coming/

This issue has no bearing on the problem with the iphone4's signal loss. All cell phones endure signal loss when held over their antenna's. However, the I4 tends to drop upto 24DB as can be seen here:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/the-iphone-4-review/2

Apple's plan in no way addresses the issue at hand. Moving the parameter for defining bars does not fix the total loss generated by holding the phone. The net loss remains the same. So how does this compliment the new proposal for moving the bars? Easy, you might have 2 bars but still no service if you're holding it wrong.

I enjoy my I4 but I have no tolerance for apple's bullshit, esp when it's a slap in the face like this. Looking forward to them getting sued to the point of recall or handing out free bumpers. I have one on mine and as the graph in the link shows, it works well.

 

[London Geezer]

Apple's bullshit explanation.

http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/02/apple-iphone-4-reception-problems-a-software-issue-fix-coming/

This issue has no bearing on the problem with the iphone4's signal loss. All cell phones endure signal loss when held over their antenna's. However, the I4 tends to drop upto 24DB as can be seen here:

http://www.anandtech.com/show/3794/the-iphone-4-review/2

Apple's plan in no way addresses the issue at hand. Moving the parameter for defining bars does not fix the total loss generated by holding the phone. The net loss remains the same. So how does this compliment the new proposal for moving the bars? Easy, you might have 2 bars but still no service if you're holding it wrong.

I enjoy my I4 but I have no tolerance for apple's bullshit, esp when it's a slap in the face like this. Looking forward to them getting sued to the point of recall or handing out free bumpers. I have one on mine and as the graph in the link shows, it works well.

Well i don't want a bloody bumper! I want a phone that's supposed to do what it says on the tin. Final nail in the coffin for me, i'll keep my little BBaby which has served me well for years and will do so for many more.
Apple is borderline ridiculous. So they'll fix the software to show 2 or more bars when there is no signal... Then they'll get complaints that people can't use the phone when there are 2 bars, and what will they do then??
So sad, Apple's behaviour has gotten worse as they become more dominant, just like all the other companies which went from super-cool to super-dodgy (Google anyone?).

 

[idsn6]

So how does this compliment the new proposal for moving the bars? Easy, you might have 2 bars but still no service if you're holding it wrong.

Apple is borderline ridiculous. So they'll fix the software to show 2 or more bars when there is no signal... Then they'll get complaints that people can't use the phone when there are 2 bars, and what will they do then??

This is diametrically incorrect. People who currently have two bars with negligible signal will potentially show zero bars after the update.

 

[wco81]

There have been lawsuits filed.

But what's stupid is that all the plaintiffs could return their iPhone 4 for refund so they didn't even wait until the return period was over to file the lawsuit.

If it's a serious problem causing a lot of returns and lost sales, then they'd take more serious action like coating the antenna.

But as it is, it's not clear-cut that even a majority of people are affected -- there are as many people who say they don't have a problem as there are those who claim they've had problems.. This may be just loud wailing on the Internet.

 

[Mize]

Meh...I just picked up a sweet E72. Symbian is hell-all ugly and disorganized, but it does everything (voice commands, FM radio, trapster, wifi hot spot, tethering over usb, roams in every country, standalone third party email client, hard keyboard etc.) so it's perfect for work. Lame for play, but that's what the iPod Touch and PSP are for

 

[Teasy]

I just don't understant how i can see videos of people showing that the signal completely dies when touching the right spot, but when i tried, nothing happened... That's not a design fault then, is it?

EDIT: oh i need to get wet before touching the right spot?? Why would i even get close to an iphone 4 while wet and sweaty??

Its a phone, you should be able to use it in any situation in every day life. If its raining you shouldn't have to change before you can answer the thing. The way you talk about it makes it sound like its something that people should expect to have to treat with kid gloves, again its a phone!

 

[wco81]

Phones can't be used in the rain.

Maybe if your hands are a bit sweaty, phones shouldn't be vulnerable to this reception problem.

But soaking wet hands or even out in the rain? Very few people handle a phone under those conditions.

 

[RudeCurve]

Still waiting for mine but when I receive it I will see if it has the signal loss issue if I hold it normally. Anyway I had always planned on getting a bumper or even a full back case to protect the phone just in case I drop it so this issue doesn't really affect me either way.

You know what's REALLY strange? After I ordered the iPhone4 from ATT online and upgraded my current plan with a data plan, my CURRENT flip phone's 3G signal has been MUCH MUCH better ever since. I usually get around 1-3 bars but now I'm getting 5 bars on a regular basis...

This seems really fishy as if ATT doesn't want their existing customers who don't have a data plan to get a good 3G signal. I can't explain it. Either that or they just coincedentally added a new tower nearby the same time I ordered the iPhone.

 

[London Geezer]

This is diametrically incorrect. People who currently have two bars with negligible signal will potentially show zero bars after the update.

Its a phone, you should be able to use it in any situation in every day life. If its raining you shouldn't have to change before you can answer the thing. The way you talk about it makes it sound like its something that people should expect to have to treat with kid gloves, again its a phone!

I'm confused!

 

[Mize]

Still waiting for mine but when I receive it I will see if it has the signal loss issue if I hold it normally. Anyway I had always planned on getting a bumper or even a full back case to protect the phone just in case I drop it so this issue doesn't really affect me either way.

You know what's REALLY strange? After I ordered the iPhone4 from ATT online and upgraded my current plan with a data plan, my CURRENT flip phone's 3G signal has been MUCH MUCH better ever since. I usually get around 1-3 bars but now I'm getting 5 bars on a regular basis...

This seems really fishy as if ATT doesn't want their existing customers who don't have a data plan to get a good 3G signal. I can't explain it. Either that or they just coincedentally added a new tower nearby the same time I ordered the iPhone.

meh.

I've had AT&T since I started traveling internationally quite a bit back in 2003 and had to jettison the far superior services of Verizon Wireless. I haven't noticed any changes in AT&T reception and coverage for voice or data. I don't base this on "bars" because I have several phones that report differently. I base it on call quality, dropped calls and missed calls. AT&T sucks, but they're a necessity if you travel to the far east and Europe and want one number.

 

[RudeCurve]

I've been pretty happy with ATT's overall signal strength but for whatever reason my current place of residence seems to have really low 3G reception strength when I'm inside of the house. It's fine when I go outside of the house. I doubt it's my phone because other ATT phones used inside this house have the same problem. I did a little research and the newest 3G cell site that was added in my area was just a couple months ago which doesn't explain why my 3G reception got a boost just a few days ago. I'm thinking maybe they recently upgraded something at these cell sites to keep up with all the new iPhones being used around here.

 

[ltcommander.data]

While Anand's did a thorough numerical analysis, I think someone needs to do a thorough usability analysis between the iPhone 3GS and the iPhone 4. For example, in the end, what does the 24dB drop mean for the ability to place calls between the 2 phones? What is needed is a comparison of signal strength (dBm) between the iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4 at multiple spots in a city.

Is the iPhone 4 consistently higher? Are there cases where the iPhone 3GS has a higher signal than the iPhone 4 and if so, does cupping the iPhone 4 cause a dropped call. If yes, than the 24dB drop does effect usability and is a legitimate regression over the iPhone 3GS. If no, than the 24dB drop is visually disconcerting in terms of signal bars, but doesn't actually effect usability.

Also, are there cases where the iPhone 4 is able to get a signal where the iPhone 3GS isn't? And in these presumably low signal situations, does cupping the iPhone 4 cause a dropped call? If yes, then is this what many people are seeing? Ie. the iPhone 4 is getting a weak signal where the iPhone 3GS previously couldn't, but even for the iPhone 4, the signal is tentative and so is easily dropped, which isn't ideal but is still an improvement.

Also, are there any steps that Apple can take to maintain usability even at low signal, -113dBm conditions? Like can they reduce call quality and increase compression to make the most out of what signal they have without dropping the call? Can they scan, hopefully find a stronger frequency, and quickly switch over while a call is in progress? Can they switch to EDGE while the call is in progress, assuming EDGE may have better signal/coverage? Or as a last resort, can they increase the delay before a call is dropped, so in low signal/intermittent signal conditions, you might get lag or stuttering, but your call won't be dropped? These could all presumably be done in a software update even if the antennae hardware isn't ideal.

 

[RudeCurve]

itcommander brought up some very good points.

 

[MfA]

But what's stupid is that all the plaintiffs could return their iPhone 4 for refund so they didn't even wait until the return period was over to file the lawsuit.

How does that work with bundles?

PS. when Tycho from Penny Arcade finds the time to note it doesn't function as a phone I personally believe there is a real problem, just someone I personally trust to not bullshit.

 

[Arun]

RudeCurve: Few cell sites are added nowadays in existing coverage areas, but what is very frequent are additional carriers in places where traffic is growing but there remains unused licensed wireless spectrum (nearly everywhere but key urban hotspots where more small cells are the only remaining option excluding new developments like 6 sectors/cell instead of 3). AT&T nearly certainly added a 850MHz carrier if your wall penetration improved. On the other hand, it's not impossible it was always there but they're limiting its access to certain subscriber plans - I'm just not certain that's technically possible.

Regarding the iPhone death grip issue, I can also only assume it's worse at 1900MHz than 850MHz but probably still very bad in the latter case. Ironically, iOS 4.0 is said to select the frequency band based on a more complex algorithm taking into consideration more than signal strength. This would probably make it both more likely to go on the weaker signal band for interference/overloading reasons etc. which would make the death grip issue slightly worse - and it would also make it more likely to be on the 1900MHz band, also slightly worse.

There is one thing I do not understand though: why does Apple need 'a few weeks' to fix bar visualization? Unless they want to try to improve the issue at the same time... But I'm not sure how. The best idea I've got is to prioritize signal strength for voice calls at the expense of other factors, possibly even more aggressively than in iOS 3, but keep the iOS 4 frequency selection algorithm for data. It won't do miracles (and wouldn't be completely free in terms of basestation signalling I suppose) but it certainly couldn't hurt either.

 

[wco81]

Maybe they want to roll out other issues at once instead of just this one.

Also you would think they want to make sure to test this more thoroughly, because if they roll out the fix and it's still a problem for some people, the PR hit would be worse.

 

[Teasy]

I'm confused!

I'm confused, at what my response to you has to do with that other post.

 

[Teasy]

Phones can't be used in the rain.

Maybe if your hands are a bit sweaty, phones shouldn't be vulnerable to this reception problem.

But soaking wet hands or even out in the rain? Very few people handle a phone under those conditions.

Of course they can, if they couldn't it'd be pointless to even sell mobile phones in the UK

Seriously, the idea of "Oh its raining, I better ignore that call" is just bizarre to me, I'd never ever buy a phone that couldn't handle some rain.

 

[wco81]

Dripping wet?

They're not water-resistant watches.

Now if you're talking about finding some cover and then taking it out of your pocket to use, or under an umbrella, that's something else.

But there's no indication that iPhone 4 can't be used under those conditions either.