NPD July 2008 *Rules: Post #133
- Thread starter RobertR1
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Err previously the 60 gig was $500 and then the 80 gig was $500. Now the 80 gig is $400 and thus its a price cut.
Yes thats what I meant
Except of course that the current 80GB is not the old 80GB, but it's the 40GB unit - i.e. the one without BC, without memory card slots, and with two USB ports less - with an 80GB HDD.
I think we can officially start calling this the SKU generation.
Right but its still a price cut because of the added value of the hardrive. Esp now that there are more and more games that have mandatory installs on the ps3.
You can say the same with the xbox 360. The 60 gig was a price cut over the 20 gig. However I don't think its going to do all that much as the console just needs to be cheaper with its other two skus .
Well twin snakes came out in 2004 and it was an upgrade of a ps1 game that came out in 1998 which was 6 years earlier. Substance came out in 2002 for the xbox but metal gear solid 2 (which is what substance was ) came out in 2001.
Both of these were exclusive for the playstation and the playstation games were reviewed higher than both of these spin offs.
Yes thank you.
The point is that MGS4 was a huge exclusive game for the ps3. In the same time frame the 360 did not have a huge exclusive.
You were also (and i think still able if you try really hard) able to buy a ps3 80 gig with BC and Metal gear solid 4 with a shock controller bundle for $500 bucks. Sony was able to use that momentum. This fall and early winter in teh states the 360 has a large list of exclusive games. These games coupled with a price drop will easily drive xbox 360 sales.
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It was partly. MGS3 was released only for PS2, MGS1 was released only for PS1 during the 32 bit era.
The MGS although it wasnt fully exclusive for the PS consoles, it was always more associated with the Playstation brand more than anything else.
I do not understand the gloom and doom that floats over Journalism and the internet this gen though with each PS3 exclusive that went multiplatform.
The PS2 also had some if its supposed big exclusive franchises released for competitive consoles as well. MGS2, Soul Edge/Calibur, Silent Hill, Ridge Racer, Colin Mc Rae, Dino Crisis, Resident Evil, Gran Theft Auto just to name a few. Originally PS1 exclusives, that saw a release on competitive consoles during the 128bit era. It wasnt that much of a deal then though
Now people generate giants out of ants even when a rumor appears suggesting that LBP might be released for PC, even though many of the so called PS1 and PS2 exclusives also saw a release on PCs
http://www.product-reviews.net/2008/08/07/has-sony-lost-another-exclusive-in-little-big-planet/
Nesh , I don't think a game released on the pc as well as a single console takes away ist exclusive status. Normaly you need a pretty good pc to play these games and have to wait over the console release date. Thus I think its unfair to take the title away.
Anyway most of those titles may have moved to other consoles or platforms but it would normaly be months or years after the fact. Its the same thing with bioshock on the 360 and ps3. Its been a year and the ps3 finally gets the game , however its been on the 360 for a year and has seen price drops. GTA 3 came out almost a year after the ps2 verison on the xbox , Resident Evil was a weird tale , part 4 was actually a gamecube exclusive that went to the ps2. The other gamecube games were all remakes I believe. Soul caliber was also a dreamcast exclusive until it went under.
however my point really isn't the ps3 loosing exclusives, its simply the fact that the biggest exclusive released so far this year (from last gen or earlier this gen) was on the ps3 and that is metal gear solid 4. It released at a time when the 360 had no recent exlusives released. However no other title released on the ps3 for the rest of the year has that built in fan base and apeal to casual gamers (built up from playing the other games on past consoles). Resistance 2 will sell very well and so will motorstorm 2 , however these are franchises that are currently only known to ps3 owners as ps2 owners have never played them. LBP is new and is unknown and mabye can push systems.
The 360 has yet to have something of this caliber so far this year and dispite that its sales are up over last year. The rumored price drop plus the quality exlcusives coming out this year will surely drive more sales than last year in the august to dec time frame.
That is simply my point.
Anyway most of those titles may have moved to other consoles or platforms but it would normaly be months or years after the fact. Its the same thing with bioshock on the 360 and ps3. Its been a year and the ps3 finally gets the game , however its been on the 360 for a year and has seen price drops. GTA 3 came out almost a year after the ps2 verison on the xbox , Resident Evil was a weird tale , part 4 was actually a gamecube exclusive that went to the ps2. The other gamecube games were all remakes I believe. Soul caliber was also a dreamcast exclusive until it went under.
however my point really isn't the ps3 loosing exclusives, its simply the fact that the biggest exclusive released so far this year (from last gen or earlier this gen) was on the ps3 and that is metal gear solid 4. It released at a time when the 360 had no recent exlusives released. However no other title released on the ps3 for the rest of the year has that built in fan base and apeal to casual gamers (built up from playing the other games on past consoles). Resistance 2 will sell very well and so will motorstorm 2 , however these are franchises that are currently only known to ps3 owners as ps2 owners have never played them. LBP is new and is unknown and mabye can push systems.
The 360 has yet to have something of this caliber so far this year and dispite that its sales are up over last year. The rumored price drop plus the quality exlcusives coming out this year will surely drive more sales than last year in the august to dec time frame.
That is simply my point.
Unless there is some real evidence for this I vote we stop posting it in every reply, at this point the rumor is coming from people like yourself. Stick to facts, not predictions.
There really aren't many facts are there , isn't the whole article we are talking about based on opinion and future events that may or may not happen.
And lets not forget that a fujitsu 40 GB harddrive Model MHY2040BH , on newegg, costs $55.99 (and lets note that this is actually the ONLY 2.5 inch HDD that you can find)
while a fujitsu 80 GB harddrive Model MHY2080BH, also on newegg, costs $59.99.
I think 40 GB 2.5 inch harddrives are becoming out of date and manufacturers simply are telling Sony "40 GB harddrives and 80 GB harddrives cost essentially the same, so why don't you double your console harddrive capacity and we can stop making a model that we really don't want to?"
I don't really see a $5 price cut on the consumers end as a real "price cut".
I see it as manufacturers refraining from making low-end products that are a waste of resources and value.
Given the sales of the Xbox1, I highly doubt anyone at MS or anyone in general would describe the 360's as faltering in terms of current sales. The 360's sales have been relatively stable over the last three years during this time period. Im not sure why we as some of the most knowledgable gamers in regard to the game market still naively see this as a race to the most console sold. Its not.
MS ended up second last generation with 25 million consoles. They are likely to end up third with a userbase of 35-40 million. What do you consider the more desirable scenario? Regardless of how well the 360 sells in relation to the Wii or PS3, the xbox1 is the ultimate measuring stick. It will take three years for the 360 to replicate what the Xbox1 did in five years. Align the launches and compare price differential and its practically amazing that the 360 maintains the pace it has. In the UK the 360 Pro 60Gb goes for £179.99 and thats still a £20 premium over the cost of the Xbox1 just 6 months after the UK launch. The fazed out 20Gb sold at $299 a price the Xbox1 could only pratically hold for 3 months.
You make it sound so easy for the average consumer to buy a hardrive , clone thier current data to the new one and then install the new one.
These are people who don't even have the time programed on their vhs players. For the casual consumers who want to pick it up and play and not have to worry about managing space or opening up a port on the console and replacing a hardrive this is a price drop for them. If there is no value diffrence to the casual market why doesn't sony just chop of $50 bucks from the ps3 cost and just direct everyone to newegg.com and have them buy whatever drive size they want and have them install it themselves.
...The PS3 is still outselling the 360 despite being more expensive than both Arcade and Pro, so MS is losing out on extra cash, but not seeing big benefits in terms of marketshare. That mostly came from its early launch.
As for Gameinformer...well I'm not too sure what that has to do with the NPD.
The original Xbox was essentially a failure. I'm sure MS was reasonably happy with the marketshare it drew, but it lost a ton of money. Last time round MS were basically 2nd after beating Nintendo. This time, every hardare seller looks like it should end up in the black, but MS could still end moving down to third. Thats why the US is so important for MS. Continental Europe and Japanese performance is poor so they need a result in the US. Its more valid comparing 360 with its current competition, rather than the Xbox, because that is the here and now.
You missed an xbox 360 sku there buddy. You might want to fix your whole point.
MS is seeing the benfits of launching early , it has the market share advantage in the US and worldwide its still ahead of sony (though barely ) last round MS was already what 10m behind sony by the time they launched.
Game informer is the highest selling game magazine in the United States , it is where a large portion of the player base gets its news.
At the end of teh day the xbox 360 will have grown its market share compared to the xbox 1 and should actually make a profit when all is said and done. Compared to the ps3 in the NPD results area the xbox 360 is still at a higher installed base than the ps3. Even though its outsold the xbox 360 for the majority of the xbox 360 it has yet to make any real head way on the xbox 360s lead here in the states. I believe the xbox 360 still has a large lead now than it did before the ps3 launched.
It´s not the 80GB model that has been reduced in price. It´s closest match is the 40GB PS3. The only thing added was 40GB at no extra cost for both Sony and the Consumer. Sony has got a strong hand here, they can easily and cheap add more perceived value to an already nice package without getting it´s customers angry.
Microsoft on the other hand has priced their harddrives so high that any quick movements will get them angry customers and the "net" on their back.
You try to explain everything with price instead of looking at value. If a $250 360 isn´t selling like hotcakes compared to a PS3 then price isn´t everything you have to acknowledge that there is more in play here.
In that case i hope they will learn from Sony´s total screwup
Obviously Elite is more expensive in the US, but therein lies the rub. We know that the majority of 360 sales are Pro anyway. So no need to change the point.
In the UK, the price difference between the 360 and PS3 is even greater. Pro is £199, and Elite £250. PS3 is £300 and the suggestions are that PS3 is still outselling it:http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/04/18/xbox_360_european_sales_double/
Then you have Chart Track showing that GTA 4 sold 56% of its units in the first on the 360 (much less than expected).
IMO, this is why MS was so keen to emphasise Europe as a key market last year, but thus far it seems the US is their best bet for market leadership.
In the UK, the price difference between the 360 and PS3 is even greater. Pro is £199, and Elite £250. PS3 is £300 and the suggestions are that PS3 is still outselling it:http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/04/18/xbox_360_european_sales_double/
Then you have Chart Track showing that GTA 4 sold 56% of its units in the first on the 360 (much less than expected).
IMO, this is why MS was so keen to emphasise Europe as a key market last year, but thus far it seems the US is their best bet for market leadership.
I have said many times that the ps3 falls between the premium and elite. The point changes as the ps3 is not more expensive than the ps3. Your forgeting that the two most popular skus are the elite and pro. Ignoring a fact (that there is a more expensive xbox 360) to prove your opinion doesn't make it a fact.
For the uk i'd like to see offical numbers from press releases before I comment , what that article shows is that a price drop will greatly enhance xbox 360s sales. If they double here in the states they would shoot past the ps3s sales easily. I doubt htat will happen but a drop should put them on par or ahead of the ps3 again.
Why wouldn't they. 1) The euro and pound are extremely strong and it would be profitable to target that area 2) they are dead last in japan and wont ever catch up to sony there 3) The line up on the 360 is extremely strong for NA and while both NA and europe share similar tastes there are some diffrences. However this isn't a Europe sales thread , its a NPD thread. It would be interesting to see if any big xbox 360 games came out in Europe that weren't 3rd part multi platform games.
That is the one thing that has affected the 360 each and every year. They simply don't have any strong early year releases in any market. I think the last exclusive we got was in december of 2007. However as I've said before MS is going to be releasing about 12 exclusive games in the next few months leading up to the holiday buying season. We will see what happens and who outsells who when MS releases big guns like gears of war , fable 2 , left for dead , etc...
For the uk i'd like to see offical numbers from press releases before I comment , what that article shows is that a price drop will greatly enhance xbox 360s sales. If they double here in the states they would shoot past the ps3s sales easily. I doubt htat will happen but a drop should put them on par or ahead of the ps3 again.
Sorry I do not understand.
Why wouldn't they. 1) The euro and pound are extremely strong and it would be profitable to target that area 2) they are dead last in japan and wont ever catch up to sony there 3) The line up on the 360 is extremely strong for NA and while both NA and europe share similar tastes there are some diffrences. However this isn't a Europe sales thread , its a NPD thread. It would be interesting to see if any big xbox 360 games came out in Europe that weren't 3rd part multi platform games.
That is the one thing that has affected the 360 each and every year. They simply don't have any strong early year releases in any market. I think the last exclusive we got was in december of 2007. However as I've said before MS is going to be releasing about 12 exclusive games in the next few months leading up to the holiday buying season. We will see what happens and who outsells who when MS releases big guns like gears of war , fable 2 , left for dead , etc...
??
Sorry mate, but I dont think you're getting the point. The single most popular 360 SKU is Pro. Not sure why you narrowed it down to the two most popular SKU's. That makes no sense. In any case, you have repeatedly stressed how good it is that MS has the price advantage over the PS3. I say good for them, but even though there are two 360 SKU's in the US that are cheaper than the PS3, the PS3 has still outsold the 360 in 2008, in all but one month, albeit by relatively small margins. In the UK, all three 360 SKU's are cheaper than the PS3, but Chart Track seem to suggest that the PS3 is still outselling the 360 in the UK and continental Europe also.
The fact that GTA 4 only sold 56% of its units on the 360 in its first week is telling. It would suggest that the installed base in the UK, of the 360 and the PS3 has narrowed. Either that or PS3 owners like GTA 4 way more than 360 owners.
As far as the US goes, IMO Sony has the stronger line-up IMO, because I would expect R2, SOCOM, LBP, Wipeout HD and Motorstorm to all do well there. KZ2 should also clean up in February, partly because of hype, and partly because it will pretty much have this period to itself.
In any case, it will be pretty vital that MS does well this winter, but they way its going, I think parity with the PS3 may be the best they can hope for. Time will tell.
I think you've totally missed my point.
My point is that changing from 40 GB to 80 GB is probably not a "price cut" decision
but rather a "We want to scrap the 40 GB model production line and change it into a larger capacity model since it makes more sense.
While we are at it, since the 80GB one that we are going to still manufacture costs essentially the same, why don't you put the larger harddrive in it and everyone can be happy." decision made by the manufacturers.
Using the 80 GB harddrives makes so much much more sense than the 40 GB ones since 40 GB platters are most probably not used in any other model, but 80 GB platters are probably used in a variety of models.
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