You don't understand because you are looking at it differently. I look at it as this: I own a nice Xbox 360 with a Kinect, Wheel, Controllers, etc.
Indeed I sold mine.
The point of a new console is to get an experience you cannot have on the current platform(s). Personally, I think you really overestimate how much faster an HD 7670 is compared to Xenos or Cell+RSX. And while Xenon may be pretty crappy a 2 module / 4 "core" Bulldozer is going to enable much room down the road for new gameplay experiences. As for launch titles? You are looking at mainly up-rezed current software.
I don't find ANYTHING compelling in that.
Rumors of the day has the gpu running at 1GHz so that indeed 960 MFLOPS but that's a 25% increase. We know nothing of the GDDR5 speed again if it turns right.
For the APU, same rumors of the day, could change tomorrow but that's not the point, they speak of a A8-3850, so I don't know who is right (if at all that's it) Kaveri based system or this according to the last noises, that would mean 4 Stars cores no bulldozer modules, higher single thread performances, lesser FP power.
But anyway I think you grossly under estimated what such CPU could do by its own.
Now there are 5 SIMD in this APU + ROPS, at a8-3850 speed so 600 MHz, that's another 400 MFLOPS, another increase in texturing power, more fill rate (even tough it's connected to a slower bus). By it-self it's insufficient but it's not by it-self more on that latter.
A lot of loyalists and those who want/demand the newest gadget will go out and buy the first 5M units of these things. But after that people with current consoles will ask: Why do I get a PS4/Xbox3 when the same 3rd party software is on my Xbox360/PS3? Ok, lower resolution, lower AF and not as nice AA, but what else?
I don't know for loyalists, our gadget lobbyists. I think that there are enough extra eye candy to be pushed by such a system that everybody will notice. Usually the average people don't buy at launch because of the argument you give, not that compelling games, prices, etc. It's partly because most lof the time consoles were either exotic creatures or bleeding edge (like this gen on the multi threading front). If you are speaking of enthusiast problem is that if they cares that much they may be playing on PC and PC specs are as I say bend perceptions and expectations.
My self is not that important but you seems pretty mislead about my consumerist habit, I've no brand loyalty be it, for PC, Ce Devices, consoles, guitar brands, etc. It usually takes me a lot of of time before deciding to buy something especially not that necessary as lets say a console. For the record I waited 2 years before owning a 360, and I may wait longer as I was waiting for even safer revision of the console. I set my choice on this device because mostly of its price vs the ps3 who was for me at the time still too expansive. My wife bought it for Christmas and it was a complete surprise, she bought it for 200 euros, I would not have spend more for a gaming device at this time. Clearly the ps3 stayed for an extended period of time out of bracket.
I usually hate having many redundant stuffs as I know I ended up not using quiet some of it. I've no hoarding habit I got rid of everything I own minus my guitars (that are still for now in france
) when moving here. So clearly I can safely say that I'm not of the above categories of people I'm a super price sensitive picky buyer. As such no matter I may want to buy a console soon, I know I could not buy anything before I know what the other have to offers for sure. Whereas the system the rumors describe is for you underwhelming, useless I'm confident the system would pull thing good enough that it will sell for a premium vs nowadays system, in any case I usually don't buy stuffs at their launch prices. So in any case it would be unsurprisingly me if I jump in one ship before a while as buying during first product year is unlikely for me at least.
We already know how a 7670 GPU performs--and it isn't pretty. It is a small chip with about 3x the shader performance (768GFLOPs vs. 240GFLOPs), 50% more fillrate, and 2.5x the texture performance of Xenos. And with 2GB of total memory you are looking at a very, very modest 4x bump in total memory.
See above rumors, I've no divine power I can't tell if they are true or not, say the GPUs would run at 1 GHz, memroy speed is undisclosed. If watch videos of this card and it's a really efficient parts that runs a lot of games in acceptable quality as long as you don't push resolution too high or AA.
It does so with no specific optimization and pretty terrible overhead.
This "thing" with a athlon X2 is pretty up to the task to run most games for not that regarding gamers. Same here high overhead (API limitations, impact of drivers on CPu load and that only a 2cores system running windows on top of it), lack of optimizations. For something without money it's allow to play games for really cheap. It turns pretty much a cheap htpc into a gaming system performing better than nowadays system. Without windows cost I've things such set-up put together for300$, that's what gaming on a budget is.
This is the standard hd6670 @800Mhz with 512 MB of GDDR5 running at 1GHz so 64GB/s of bandwidth.
Now The thing is not alone it's (supposedly) backed up by an APU, supposedly an A8. Now I've seen vids of this and it gets significantly better. On PC one still suffer of all the usual crossfire/sli issues: micro stuttering, support for not that fashionable game. and lets face AFR is not the most optimal use of two GPUs.
For the RAM we heard Xbox has more ram than the PS4 so I assume 2 vs 4, more accurate or newer rumors may state otherwise, be reassure that I won't cry if that happens and the amount of memory reach 4GB. Be reassured to that I don't fix the specs of neither Sony or MS so clearly the angry feeling I feel in your post is out of place. Whatever they decided neither yours or my preferences will have they say, we will the system that strike the balance the best (subjective) or none, me at least.
We can see, right now, how Crysis 2, Battlefield 3, Skryim, etc look like on a PS3/Xbox 360 and how well it looks and performs on a 7670. Most consumers won't be able to tell the difference visually, so that isn't a sales point. It also isn't fast enough to open new visual avenues (re: look at developers asking for 8GB of memory and multiple TFLOPs of GPU performance). And the CPU is a LOT better at poor code but it doesn't offer any legroom for doing anything new.
OoO engine execute more than poor code better, it's foremost a way to maximize utilization of pretty wide processor leveraging ILP. Those processor are
wide three arythmetic units for example in a Star core, the SIMD the integer units. They also have good branch predictors, prefetchers, etc.
An athlon x2 completely destroy xenon, with two thread, running windows, heavy drivers and with no specific optimizations (that's not always the case for Intel CPU cf picky compiler).
Another thing I find relevant is that APU are the closest heir of something like Cell at this time in history. You have 4 CPU cores and 5 SIMD arrays backed by a command processor, ultra thread thingy, dispatcher, etc. The difference with the cell is that they can really do any kind of graphic related task in parallel of the main GPU with higher efficiency. They are also way more potent for computing that Xenos, and on xenos run some database transversal for kinect (
the heavy lifting), pretty impressive particules system for Halo reach, crown instancing for I don't remember which zomby that has big craon, etc. That's Xenos this generation (not the newest I conceed) can do so much more! They support integer to begin with.
THey are perceived as less exotic as Cell because this GPU part of the APU share the same architecture as the plain one connect to the fast memory pool, but for how it could be used, it offers a lot options. OPen CL runs on both the CPU and the GPU, thing like bullet physic will get port, etc. Don't dismiss the thing before having a proper example of what it could if it sucks I won't buy it, a lot of other would do the same, in the end, lets assume (if rumors have some grounds) that Sony is not a bunch of fool, nor some of the best studio around that advice them.
Look at the APU like a fullblown Cell (8 SPUs), with 4 PPU performing twice as fast (or more) and twice number crushing power (400 MFLOPS vs 200MFLOPS between 125 and 150 for the PS3 cell) + a lot of support from various fixed function hardware.
Basically those excited for a 4core x86 chip, 2GB RAM, and 7670 are probably those who like new gadgets for the sake of the gadget and would do anything to move off this generation. The joke would be on them: those kind of specs are going to churn out a LOT more software that is just like this generation.
What do you know about that? Say both Sony and MS underwhelm you, what do you do? I mean not buying is an serious option for me and you but not amount of hatred from you or me would changed what Sony and/or MS may have decided. If one comes with significantly better system than the other, hell the market will make its choice on perfs, price, online policies,etc. there might reasons for those companies choices, circumstances that limited their choices, etc. Still the market will have the last word. But I don't see how this relate to those who like gadgets, they are usually a blessing for companies, they have high buying power usually or bigger budget than what it would be wize for them to have, basically they buy and sale, rinse repeat. They keep the stuffs they like the most but they are compulsive buyers.,, By the way credit cards are naughty invention I hate them my wife is crazy tht I refuse to use them for the sake of my "credit rating"... My credit rating is perfect as it is I always pay what is due without having to use credit.
And the haha is that a 118mm^2 GPU. As for the APU, you have an 228mm^2 CPU hooked to slow memory, neutering any GPU performance but also a severly overkill die-budget for a mere 4 cores. Seriously, Cell was 8 usable cores on ~ 235mm^2 on 90nm and a PS4 is going to have 4 cores in 228mm^2 on 32nm?
That a poor way to put thing together imo. Any tasks the SPUs were assigned, lot of graphics, will be swallowed in no time by the APU, It can do so much more.
You said you thought such a system, "But speaking of graphic the thing should provide quiet a step for the ps360" and all I can say is that being stuck with 2-4x the total performance for 7 more years hardly enables any headroom for visual improvement. Nothing worthy $300 + new peripherals for IMO.
But you are already sick of this gen and don't want a PC so I can see where you are happy if they throw you a bone
And I say it again, Cell concept of two vector units working parallel either of graphic taks or other tasks was pretty flexible, an APU + GPU push the idea so much further in many.
I believe it can be a good design, way better than you despict it.
But to be clear if it turns out there are more power of some form paced in the system... all the better that's pretty obvious.
PS:
you sounds pretty pissed off against me whereas I don't remember having tough relations with you, did I said something that offense you? I don't think so I did but if I did send me a PM so we settle this.
I don't think I deserve this tone but I read
all the forum here so I won't insist for the sake of understanding but clearly if you have an issue with PM as I'm not aware of it, and I've none with you.
EDIT
regarding PC I don't like the idea because it's not the optimal way I envisioned to spend on money, as it turns it will most likely be my platform of choice for a while there is no alternative. As I'm picky and think to much before buying the process of buying one getting used to idea, etc. may take months... then there are new products launchs hesitations... Well I may have one by Cristmas... that's how fast I am
