News and Rumours: PS4

[-tkf-]

Sure if you want over 1/3 of the price of the console to be the HDD. Then again that's probably better than an SSD. But...

The best choice for speed + cost would be a 3.5" hybrid drive. Next best would probably be a 2.5" hybrid drive, and that's probably slightly more likely. Initial game load would be slower than an SSD, but once the game is loaded it could start to intelligently fill the flash buffer (say 10-20 GB) with the game data of the game you are playing. Hence once that data needs to be accessed it'll be like accessing it from an SSD.

I have yet to see an asset streaming solution (other than ones that stream in data that is outside of the players view range) that doesn't feature significant texture pop-in with quick movements or changes to view. And most especially when you first enter the game.

Hence I still prefer either full level load at the start, or all visible assets + all assets that might become visible in the next 2+ minutes of gameplay loaded at start with streaming data only being applicable to things that might be coming up in the next 2+ minutes.

It's absolutely ridiculous that we have more texture and object pop-in now than we did 10 years ago (at least on PC which is like a sneak peak of what consoles will be like for the next generation).

Regards,
SB

I would expect them to use a 320-500GB drive, considering i can get a PS3 with a 320GB today and the price difference between a 160 is very low i see no reason for them to go lower than 320. And i expect the speed in 2013 to be just as good.

With most games today having to be playable on a Console with a slow dvd or bluray drive things can only improve if we lose the stupid rule of no hard drive requirement.

 

[Rangers]

Pastebin specs only make sense if Sony's plan is to disrupt the situation by launching a very cheap PS4 even before MS does potentially more expensive unit. Then they can dictate game development to their specs PS2 style because they have the installed base

I agree that would have to be their strategy, and likely Sony execs thinking ( one can imagine: We kicked the crap out of Xbox with weaker PS2, yet lost to Xbox with more powerful PS3).

I dont agree that would work though. It worked for PS2 because MS was starting from scratch while Sony had massive advantages in everything from third party support to mindshare. In 2013, the brands will start from equal footing at worst.

 

[Prophecy2k]

I don't think any of the specs in the pastebin "leak" roll are legit.

I also don't think that "orbis" is the codename for the PS4. I think it's actually a codename for an unannounced software platform (think PS Suite). ;-)

 

[Brad Grenz]

Given those concept images, it does seem like Orbis is probably the name of some kind of social, synergy platform and not the name of a piece of hardware.

 

[Arwin]

Given those concept images, it does seem like Orbis is probably the name of some kind of social, synergy platform and not the name of a piece of hardware.

If we combine it with some of the patent diggings of recent, I would suggest the Orbis is a Kinect like device, that could potentially even release for the PS3.

 

[McHuj]

I don't think any of the specs in the pastebin "leak" roll are legit.

I also don't think that "orbis" is the codename for the PS4. I think it's actually a codename for an unannounced software platform (think PS Suite). ;-)

maybe, but the Kotaku article isn't based on the pastebin post, but their own source, who is saying that Orbis is the working codename for the next console.

If I had to guess, the next playstation will have a revamped PSN and there will be more connectivity among all of Sony's devices.

 

[patsu]

Might be the same source. Then again, they could be talking about different SKUs or products.

 

[Rangers]

Orbis means circle in latin or some shiz. Somewhere I even saw putting it together with Vita=life as circle of life. Meaning Vita+Orbis=happy marriage etc, was the speculation. Think I saw it on IGN.

Kind of reminds me of 360 branding though though, I remember how 360 symbolized a circle "with you at the center". Bunch of baloney. Just kind of weird to see similar branding, though it's only a codename.

 

[Elan Tedronai]

The longer this generation goes, the longer more games are made for the ps3 the more likely Backwards compatibility will be an issue.

Hopefully yoshida, kaz and co do not disappoint loyal sony fans and they allow us to play our games on the new console

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The longer this generation goes, the longer more games are made for the ps3 the more likely Backwards compatibility will be an issue.

Why?

Hopefully yoshida, kaz and co do not disappoint loyal sony fans and they allow us to play our games on the new console

But if adding BC takes away from the PS4 experience, that'll disappoint Sony fans. Further discussion here.

 

[Gitaroo]

is it not possible to have the CELL cpu also on the system to handle all the media encoding etc, and also be used for stuffs like pyhsx for games, running the background OS etc? Cant they achieve hardware + software emulation this way? I mean the cell was cutting edge tech and was very expensive, but the price should have drop significantly by now. I remember when Sony talked about the Vita from last GDC or sometime ago, they said they included the media engine 2 on the Vita because they still want their HW to be a bit unique than standard and they use it to do all the media encoding, kind of like the tegra 3 ninja core power saving. It maybe also be related to the backward compatibility which Sony said is done by a combination of software and hardware. Maybe they will do the same with the PS4 if they can get the PSGL to run on AMD GPU?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Then they'd need XDR2 in their as well, or reengineering Cell with a GDDR5 bus or something. And there'll be board conplexities to worry about, although I don't know how much of an issue they are. It's a nice idea that we've seen before in PS1 emulation on PS2, so it's wokrable. Although if Sony make the switch from nVidia to AMD, it may not be viable.

 

[Barbarian]

I think all this "if there's no BC I'm not buying PS4" is just grand posturing.
If you're a hardcore gamer you know you're getting a launch unit no matter what.
If you're not, then you were going to wait anyway and by the time "the price is right" there will be so many amazing next gen games, BC would be pointless.
And let's not forget that just because PS4 is for sale, doesn't mean your existing PS3 will suddenly stop working. Keep them both plugged in, it's not such a difficult concept.
Plus I have a feeling even launch titles this time around might be pretty damn amazing

 

[liolio]

I think all this "if there's no BC I'm not buying PS4" is just grand posturing.
If you're a hardcore gamer you know you're getting a launch unit no matter what.
If you're not, then you were going to wait anyway and by the time "the price is right" there will be so many amazing next gen games, BC would be pointless.
And let's not forget that just because PS4 is for sale, doesn't mean your existing PS3 will suddenly stop working. Keep them both plugged in, it's not such a difficult concept.
Plus I have a feeling even launch titles this time around might be pretty damn amazing

Some optimism at last

I'm optimistic my self with the choice made by Sony, I believe that even a pretty much off the shelves Kaveri (and I would be surprised if it is ) in the hand of of the one as media molecule, Naughty dogs, Polyphony would/will do marvels. They should get awesome result way faster than they did on the ps3.

There is also something I wonder about, with the PS4 (supposedly) using a X86 cpu and a GPU based on AMD GCN I wonder if some of the good games that did not make it to the console this gens could be ported especially if they include some form of device that allows touch inputs (better match to emulate kb+m). I could also see a lot more "hd remake".
Think for example of Mass effect. Selling a the revamped trilogy using high quality assets, etc. should not be that hard ? require that much of an investment.
That is just an example, I believe that there are quiet some games this gen the ps360 did not do justice (the CoD serie to me looks ugly, a remake of the sp campaigns could imho sell in sane quantity it's a matter of pricing), I believe quiet some people here could come with their own list.

EDIT
THen there is Sony policies with regard to online, if they are open enough we may see some mmo coming to consoles. I could also see BLizzard jumping on the guns and porting Diablo3 for a fraction of the money they would make by releasing the game.
Sony is in a situation (assuming x86+GCN) to leverage pc gaming development and not only up coming game, I hope that they weight those opportunities to grow the system library faster.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If you're a hardcore gamer you know you're getting a launch unit no matter what.
If you're not, then you were going to wait anyway and by the time "the price is right" there will be so many amazing next gen games, BC would be pointless.

I think that view is fairly well held up with each new entrant into the market. People bought XBoxes without them playing old games. People bought iPads without them playing old games. People bought original PlayStations without them playing old games. Perhaps one reason to change from a number based name is to make people think of it as a new product rather than an iteration in a series?

Sony certainly aren't going to lose PS3 owners to Durango because PS4 isn't BC. At worst, some people who would have bought PS4 straight away may defect to Durango if they wait and see and decide Durango offers a better experience for them, but that has got to be a very small amount. And is it one worth bothering with? Those playing old games aren't buying new games when the platform is most costly for the platform holder, so perhaps they're better off without them? It's not as good to say "900,000 sold in the first week" as "1 million sold in the first week", but then the actual economics may be better.

 

[Arwin]

I wonder if they'd really need XDR for BC. I'd expect a bunch of SPEs with their local store can be fitted in without XDR, for at least a Vita like BC. They'd only need five of them, and they have a low enough power budget at least.

Not saying that will happen, but it is possible. And they can always drop it again for the inevitable 'Slim'

 

[Shifty Geezer]

If dropping in Cell, XDR would be needed. Integrating SPUs on the CPU is another kettle of fish altogether. Can't say I'm opposed to the idea. but then I'm not programming the thing, and devs may not want another heterogenous architecture again. They'll alreeady have GPGPU to contend with. Then again, maybe SPEs would mitigate some of that GPGPU requirement early on? Then again, if GPGPU will have to feature for the other platforms, maybe having an easier path for existing codebases (PhysX/Havok type thing) won't be any benefit?

 

[Arwin]

GPUs often have a video and audio decoding component for video playback and surround mixing and such. Perhaps they can have SPEs double for this task as well as BC? They have a lot of optimised high quality code for these things in there already.

 

[RobertR1]

I think all this "if there's no BC I'm not buying PS4" is just grand posturing.
If you're a hardcore gamer you know you're getting a launch unit no matter what.
If you're not, then you were going to wait anyway and by the time "the price is right" there will be so many amazing next gen games, BC would be pointless.
And let's not forget that just because PS4 is for sale, doesn't mean your existing PS3 will suddenly stop working. Keep them both plugged in, it's not such a difficult concept.
Plus I have a feeling even launch titles this time around might be pretty damn amazing

Maybe it's just me but I don't like the idea of having multiple devices if I don't need to and get rid of things when I'm done with them. The chances of me buying a PS4 are slim already but if they remove all backwards compatibility I'll be much less inclined. The same goes for Microsoft.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I wonder if they'd really need XDR for BC. I'd expect a bunch of SPEs with their local store can be fitted in without XDR, for at least a Vita like BC. They'd only need five of them, and they have a low enough power budget at least.

Not saying that will happen, but it is possible. And they can always drop it again for the inevitable 'Slim'

I don't think it'd be all "that" easy. Not impossible certainly, but with how specialized the hardware was for PS3, I'd imagine the potentially different memory latency and bandwidth might play havoc without a significant re-design investment.

And I'm not sure that investment is worth it only for BC.

A software emulator could potentially be far more useful as you could in theory leverage that on a next gen PSP in addition to the next gen. Playstation. Of course, software emulation would require a significant investment as well. But at least an emulator could potentially see use through multiple generations of hardware thus leveraging that initial investment cost better than a redesign of Cell which would only be beneficial for that single next gen. Playstation console.

A software emulator also wouldn't increase the hardware BOM of a console. Although there may be ongoing costs associated with making sure all games work or as many as possible work.

Regards,
SB