Minecraft, Rocket League, Fortnite, etc CrossPlay on every Platform but Sony because...

[Deleted member 11852]

How's about instead of being dismissive about how stupid/naive we all are, you actually explain that? I said I don't understand the logic. Explain it to me. Where's the money going/coming from?

How am I supposed to explain Sony's logic? I'm not Sony's accountant. I'm reading the same stuff everybody else is but I'm willing to except it's about money because it makes the most sense.

In case is still requires explanation, what John Smedley is saying is that if you want Fortnite content in your PS4 game then Sony want you to buy that through your PS4 so Sony get a cut. They don't want any option of your being able to obtain content through any channel where Sony doesn't get a cut. It's really that simple.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

How am I supposed to explain Sony's logic? I'm not Sony's accountant. I'm reading the same stuff everybody else is but I'm willing to except it's about money because it makes the most sense.

In case is still requires explanation, what John Smedley is saying is that if you want Fortnite content in your PS4 game then Sony want you to buy that through your PS4 so Sony get a cut. They don't want any option of your being able to obtain content through any channel where Sony doesn't get a cut. It's really that simple.

Except you can also buy it on iOS, Android and PC so that argument falls apart as well.

Or to think of it another way. A PS4 user can use their content purchased on PS4 on iOS, Android, and PC.

Sony only prevents content purchased on PS4 from being used on Switch or XBO. Requiring PS4 users to buy that content again on those platforms if they want to play Fortnite on those platforms.

In terms of making money. I think that actually benefits Nintendo and Microsoft more than it does Sony as far more people would be buying Fortnite content on PS4 than on XBO and Switch even if there weren't any restrictions on crossplay.

IE - More PS4 players buying content yet again on Switch or XBO than XBO/NSW players buying content yet again on PS4.

Regards,
SB

 

[Shifty Geezer]

In case is still requires explanation, what John Smedley is saying is that if you want Fortnite content in your PS4 game then Sony want you to buy that through your PS4 so Sony get a cut. They don't want any option of your being able to obtain content through any channel where Sony doesn't get a cut. It's really that simple.

Which is reason to stop people buying content on XB or NSW and playing with it on PS4, but how is that reason to stop people on PS4 playing with someone else entirely on XB or NSW? And why doesn't that same logic apply to all the other platforms?

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Sure, but again. If X device is the main gaming device of that person, then X device is where they will mainly play that game and where they will likely buy all of the content for said game.

I have no more insight in the economics, market share and player base of Forntite than you because Epic don't publish this. But you can sure that Sony have access to it and it may well have been a factor in their decision.

Which is reason to stop people buying content on XB or NSW and playing with it on PS4, but how is that reason to stop people on PS4 playing with someone else entirely on XB or NSW? And why doesn't that same logic apply to all the other platforms?

On the latter point, my guess is that this is purely about wanting to incentivise people buying PlayStations and dis-incentivising people from buying an Xbox One or Switch. Does it work? Who the hell knows. Probably, if as a purchaser and you're on the fence, then any reason can tip you this way or that. Perhaps Sony believe those PS4 owners who do own other consoles favour PS4 or don't care about this issue.

I'm think your pursuit of understanding the logic is stymied because it's predicated on data that isn't publoished.

Is it somewhat ironic that the only people discussing this are people whoa re not directly impacted by it, which goes back to my point. Who are still pissed at this? Is it 1,000 people? 5,000?

 

[BRiT]

At this point, if consumers want to truly support Epic they would buy everything on Android since the game is sideloaded, so no 30% cut to Google or Apple or Sony or MS. I'm surprised Epic isnt running 5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, or 25% discounts on MTX/DLC via Android just to get more peeps on there so their future purchases are more likely to result in 100% profits.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

At this point, if consumers want to truly support Epic they would buy everything on Android since the game is sideloaded, so no 30% cut to Google or Apple or Sony or MS. I'm surprised Epic isnt running 5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, or 25% discounts on MTX/DLC via Android just to get more peeps on there so their future purchases are more likely to result in 100% profits.

I don't think people here are really getting the coveting money concept thing.

Hey Epic, would like you like 100% of $10 or 100% of $7? I'm guessing part of it is also to prevent cost disparity between platforms. Earned vbucks transfer, bought vbucks do not.

 

[BRiT]

And here's Jim Sterling's YouTube coverage of the recent bad Sony PR, titled "Sony: No Cross Platform Play Because PS4 Is Better Than Other Consoles" with description of

Sony's arrogance on this issue - and it IS arrogance - continues to astound. Their latest gambit is suggesting cross-platform won't come to Fortnite because the PS4 is better than the other platforms. Yeesh.

 

[Xbat]

Not even a good business one because it's not like people are going to buy PS4 just to play with other PS4 owners - choice of a console will come down to other factors

Of course they are. If all little Tommies friends are playing Fortnite on PS4 he as sure as hell is going to want a PS4 for Christmas or his birthday. Especially in Europe where PlayStation has a much bigger marketshare, it's just cementing there dominate position.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

That's not true. If all Tommie's friends have a PS4, he'll probably want a PS4 to match his peers - lack of cross-platform play doesn't affect that. However, he may want a Switch instead, because it's portable and has Nintendo games, but that's not a problem because it also plays Fortnite so he can still play with this PS4 owning mates... Tommie isn't going to change his purchasing decision and give up on portability and Nintendo exclusives just to enable Fortnite play with his PS4 owning mates, is he? No-one would. No-one would make that choice the deciding factor against the many other important ones like cost, performance, exclusives, services, experience, branding, etc.

"I prefer XBox controllers and Live as a service and want my game catalogue BC, but I'm not going to buy an XB1 - I'm going to buy a PS4 because then I can play with other PS4 owners."

Cross-plat play is a better marketing feature too. MS can start pushing XBox as the ultimate platform. Your game catalogue never expires thanks to BC. You can play with anyone - no console apartheid going on here. It's all round a better image.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

That's not true. If all Tommie's friends have a PS4, he'll probably want a PS4 to match his peers - lack of cross-platform play doesn't affect that. However, he may want a Switch instead, because it's portable and has Nintendo games, but that's not a problem because it also plays Fortnite so he can still play with this PS4 owning mates...

Hang on, there's no crossplay between Switch and PS4 is there? How is that gong to work?

Tommie isn't going to change his purchasing decision and give up on portability and Nintendo exclusives just to enable Fortnite play with his PS4 owning mates, is he? No-one would.

If Tommie's friends socialise a lot through online gaming then picking a Switch over a PS4 could result in Tommie becoming socially isolated. If gaming is a big part of he and his peer's activities, he'll be socially isolated a lot if he is the only one without a PS4. At this point Tommie is thinking of not buying a Switch and getting a PS4 instead or, if he already owns a Switch, selling it to buy a PS4.

Even if there no active peer pressure, as in his fiends are not pressuring him to buy a PS4, not being able to take part of the groups online gaming is going to be pressure.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Hang on, there's no crossplay between Switch and PS4 is there? How is that gong to work?

That's why there's the ellipsis. The assumption would be that there's no problem, but of course there is, and now Tommie finds himself unable to play with his friends.

If Tommie's friends socialise a lot through online gaming then picking a Switch over a PS4 could result in Tommie becoming socially isolated. If gaming is a big part of he and his peer's activities, he'll be socially isolated a lot if he is the only one without a PS4. At this point Tommie is thinking of not buying a Switch and getting a PS4 instead or, if he already owns a Switch, selling it to buy a PS4.

Even if there no active peer pressure, as in his fiends are not pressuring him to buy a PS4, not being able to take part of the groups online gaming is going to be pressure.

You're introducing alternative purchasing decisions rather than looking at the example. Yeah, in this specific example, if Tommie prefers socialising online over Nintendo exclusives and portability, he'll buy PS4. If he wants to watch DVDs more than portable play, he'll buy a PS4. If he wants to play Spider Man more than anything, he'll buy a PS4.

However, if Tommie wants portability and Nintendo exclusives, he'll get a NSW, and if he wants to play cross-platform Fortnite with his PS4 friends which you'd assume is possible given he can play them on his iPhone and his PC, the only thing stopping that option is Sony dragging its feet. But Sony dragging its feet isn't going to make Tommie change his mind about his purchasing decision. I can't think of anyone who swapped console or computer brand due to peer pressure. They'd rather fight in the playground over their preferred brand than swap!

 

[Deleted member 11852]

That's why there's the ellipsis. The assumption would be that there's no problem, but of course there is, and now Tommie finds himself unable to play with his friends.

Not "now". This is not something that was taken away, it was never a thing on PS4 to begin with.

You're introducing alternative purchasing decisions rather than looking at the example. Yeah, in this specific example, if Tommie prefers socialising online over Nintendo exclusives and portability, he'll buy PS4. If he wants to watch DVDs more than portable play, he'll buy a PS4. If he wants to play Spider Man more than anything, he'll buy a PS4.

Its a discussion. What's to be gained for presenting an immovable scenario of your fictional Tommie who has picked Switch over PS4 and is content to face a degree of social isolation from his friends? There are definitely people like this but they don't seem to be the majority. Peer pressure and the need to be part of a social group, along with not feeling excluded from it, are considerable social pressures for kids and young adults alike. Plenty of people 'fall in with the wrong crowd' because this is widely accepted social need. I don't want to get too 'hoki science' (psychology) but I don't see many kids choosing social isolation and Mario over friends.

Plus there is the compelling argument that Sony are still taking crap for this so there is presumably some hard numbers behind it. As there was last gen when Microsoft took the same stance with the 360. It's also why closed ecosystems with their own social integration exist - Apple Messages, What's App, Facebook, whatever failed social platform Google have this week.

 

[Xbat]

That's why there's the ellipsis. The assumption would be that there's no problem, but of course there is, and now Tommie finds himself unable to play with his friends.

No, now Tommie finds himself with a PS4 instead of a Switch. My experience with my own kids and there friends is that it has a big impact on there decision. What shoes or clothes they want, it plays a big part. Obviously there are outliers.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

No, now Tommie finds himself with a PS4 instead of a Switch. My experience with my own kids and there friends is that it has a big impact on there decision. What shoes or clothes they want, it plays a big part. Obviously there are outliers.

Sure, but given the choice between

• The new Mario game
• Playing Fortnite with PS4 players

Many kids will choose Mario over Fortnite with PS4 players. That also applies to being able to play games on the go. Other Nintendo exclusives.

Is a 12 year old going to prefer Nintendo exclusives or Sony exclusives. Or more importantly, is a kid's parents going to be more likely to buy a NSW for their kid for Mario, Zelda, Smash Bros, etc. or a PS4 for their kid for God of War, Detroit, HZD, etc.? And is Fortnite on PS4 being locked away from other platforms going to change that choice?

Which is worse?

• Playing Fortnite with friends on NSW, XBO, Android, iOS, PC
• Playing Fortnite with friends on PS4, Android, iOS, PC

And if one option is worse than the other, how much worse is it? Enough to offset loss of features, whether they be portability, graphics, exclusives, or whatever?

How about for the people on PC, Android, and iOS that want to play with their friends on PS4, NSW, and XBO? They have to choose which ones they can play with.

In all ways, it's just a really shitty thing for everyone but Sony.

Regards,
SB

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Many kids will choose Mario over Fortnite with PS4 players. That also applies to being able to play games on the go. Other Nintendo exclusives.

I don't see it. My experience of kids mirrors that of Xbat. Kids want the sane stuff their friends have. They're communicating all the time and I remember ten years ago everybody had a Blackberry because of BBM. If you weren't on it, you were out of touch with the rest of the group. Then it was Facebook and it's been Whats App and online games for a few years.

You're bringing the rationality from an adult perspective to this, there isn't a lot of that in these groups.

Is a 12 year old going to prefer Nintendo exclusives or Sony exclusives.

Nintendo isn't cool in the school yard, PlayStation and Xbox are. Kids/young adults aren't carrying a Nintendo Switch around because most places they go you can't use it, or you just don't want to be carrying around what is, let's be honest, a massive device. Kids prefer what is popular with their friends. That is 100% my experience of my kids, and my friends kids and other kids the see in my role as a parent.

Kids hate giving up their communications devices just for dinner and you expect them to select chose a device that none of their friends have? Good luck with that.

 

[Xbat]

Nintendo isn't cool in the school yard, PlayStation and Xbox are.

This is also true in my experience. It's more the older guys going gaga about Nintendo franchises.
Don't know how it is in America but here it's the hardcore types that are into Nintendo.

 

[Silent_Buddha]

I don't see it. My experience of kids mirrors that of Xbat. Kids want the sane stuff their friends have. They're communicating all the time and I remember ten years ago everybody had a Blackberry because of BBM. If you weren't on it, you were out of touch with the rest of the group. Then it was Facebook and it's been Whats App and online games for a few years.

You're bringing the rationality from an adult perspective to this, there isn't a lot of that in these groups.



Nintendo isn't cool in the school yard, PlayStation and Xbox are. Kids/young adults aren't carrying a Nintendo Switch around because most places they go you can't use it, or you just don't want to be carrying around what is, let's be honest, a massive device. Kids prefer what is popular with their friends. That is 100% my experience of my kids, and my friends kids and other kids the see in my role as a parent.

Kids hate giving up their communications devices just for dinner and you expect them to select chose a device that none of their friends have? Good luck with that.

Certainly a different experience from me. My friend's children and my cousins and nieces children pretty much all chose the NSW or Wii-U when given a choice between that and a PS4. That starts to change around High School, but Nintendo remains a strong choice.

Back during the X360/PS3 era many also chose the Nintendo console over the X360 when the X360 was hugely popular. Granted the Wii was even more popular for a brief time than the NSW is now or the X360 was back then.

Perhaps children are different in Europe than they are in the US and Japan.

Regards,
SB

 

[Deleted member 11852]

This is also true in my experience. It's more the older guys going gaga about Nintendo franchises.

And if you look at Nintendo's ads (they're all on YouTube) while there are kids in them, the ads are mostly adults in their 20s. Adults at the laundrette, at the coffee shop, in a bar - oh here's some kids, 2.5 seconds - adults in a lecture, adults at a party.

 

[Xbat]

Certainly a different experience from me. My friend's children and my cousins and nieces children pretty much all chose the NSW or Wii-U when given a choice between that and a PS4. That starts to change around High School, but Nintendo remains a strong choice.

Nintendo is definitely a strong choice but your experience kind backs up what Dsoup and I are saying. In your case that your niece's and nephews chose Nintendo even during the wii-u generation shows that they are outliers otherwise the Wii-U would of been much more successful.

 

[Nesh]

And here's Jim Sterling's YouTube coverage of the recent bad Sony PR, titled "Sony: No Cross Platform Play Because PS4 Is Better Than Other Consoles" with description of

Not even cross platform with PC?

edit: Sony obviously understands the power of their brand and their huge userbase this generation. They suspect that their leading position will motivate people to remain or choose Playstation if the option to play with their Playstation friends is available only through the Playstation platform. Play the best exclusives? Playstation. Play with the majority of console users? Playstation. It is the most popular platform.
Last generation things were different. Sony supported cross play and MS didn't. MS had the highest online paticipation I suspect. Sony saw that they had more chances to gain by allowing it. Now MS sees it as a "benefit" they can adverdise to gain some extra users.

It sucks. This is why the free market conditions that allow for true free market fail.