Killzone Prerendered E3 Trailer Talk

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Tesselator said:

Well I'm quite certain Jeremy would not put up a hoax as a qualifying
demonstration of his abilities as a CG artist. And since that's what
those images were intended for I would have to deduce that they
are legitimate. I have an extensive background as CG artist myself.
I'm very well versed in Maya, XSI, and Lightwave. Understanding
the process that a 3d piece goes through from the time of its
conception to its commission, delivery, and still yet for inclusion in
the artists own portfolio may be the key in understanding the
discrepancies you see between those still shots and whenever
video you're comparing them to.

Suffice to say regardless - the full video that was presented by Sony
is currently impossible to produce in computational real time by the
PS3 or even the XBox 360 for that matter.
​
Click to expand...

For a guy with 11 post, a join date of 12-27-05, and all his post dealing with this topic, and defending a guy (who you maybe) like he’s your girlfriend seems rather strange. And then the awful hoax pics "missing" from the site all spells Bullsh** in my book. :rolleyes:

Also this Jeremy site seems suspicious also; i.e. Major YNOS suspicious like.
 
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BlueTsunami said:
I think it was more of a *Wink Wink* *Nudge Nudge* type of scenario. It is pretty cool that they integrated it at the end, I also wonder if it means anything.

*shrugs*
Click to expand...
Everything in the mgs4 video was realtime and that was the realtime killzone code shared by sony that you saw at that moment, though no one could tell the difference ;)
 
pso said:
SCEE Executive VP of Development Phil Harrison has stated that some
of the trailers during the presentation were rendered using in-game
assets.
Click to expand...

Well there ya go. There should be no controversy at all here then.
If it can be assumed he was talking about the same trailer we're
discussing here then the case is closed - for at least a major
portion of it.
​

pso said:
Edit: What Jack Tretton said about the Killzone demo is no different
than what MS stated about the Xbox with "Toy Story" graphics. Lies,
PR spin, whatever you want to call it, all the same IMO.
Click to expand...

Agreed.
​
 
I'm sorry but if Lair is possible in Real-Time ( confirmed by Factor 5 to be, detailed on engine ), then Killzone definately was.

11270106911.jpg


vs.

http://ps3media.ign.com/ps3/image/article/614/614722/killzone-next-gen-20050516075937991.jpg[/img]
 
Nerve-Damage said:
For a guy with 11 post, a join date of 12-27-05, and all his post dealing with this topic, and defending a guy (who you maybe) like he’s your girlfriend seems rather strange. And then the awful hoax pics "missing" from the site all spells Bullsh** in my book. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Well you are entitled to your opinion but that's a pretty funny book
yoy have that rates people's credibility levels based on their number
of posts and their join-date.

In all candid honesty wouldn't you agree?

​
 
centerofadmiration said:
What exactly in the Killzone demo was so impossible?
Click to expand...

Tiny strands of facial hair. :)

I think it's more fair to compare killzone with this:
http://www.theautochannel.com/mania/video-games/Features_xbox.html
robot/girl

Although, I think sony made similiar things before with the getaway.
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/adventure/getaway/screenindex.html?page=6

If you ceckout the first images. Mostly better textures and AA. Although getaway black monday seems close to that.
 
Tesselator said:
Suffice to say regardless - the full video that was presented by Sony
is currently impossible to produce in computational real time by the
PS3 or even the XBox 360 for that matter.
[/indent]
Click to expand...
So you expect the XBox 360 to be able to produce better graphics than the PS3?
 
From what I see in the Killzone videos and shots its just really great use of textures. From the wheels of the vehicles to the " tiny stands of hair " ( if they were individual strands with physics introduces in each I'd say its impossible, but from the video no hair is moving around so its just good texturing ) to the look of the soldiers uniforms. The facial expressions were outdone by MGS4 as were the character animations.

I think, in reality, the argument against Killzone is started by Microsoft 360 supporters simply because is Killzone is for real, there is absolutely no argument anymore to which system is more powerful and which system will showcase the better looking games. If the PS3 is capable of Killzone at launch, same goes for Lair ( supposed to be a launch title ) and MGS4 then the 360 is outclassed by a WIDE margin.
 
centerofadmiration said:
What exactly in the Killzone demo was so impossible?
Click to expand...


The number one most impossible feature was the level of volummetrics
included that currently require hundreds of thousands times longer
than PS3 computational real time affords. (maybe millions I didn't do
the math.)

You just can't light, shade, and shadow volumes that well that fast.
Those are render-grade volumetrics and are clearly the product of
Lightwave's HyperVoxell 3 (tm) system found in the Lightwave 8.x
product cycle.

When dubert gets back online perhaps he can supply you with more
in-depth technical insights into the various impossibilities as there
are several.
​
 
Tesselator said:

Well you are entitled to your opinion but that's a pretty funny book
yoy have that rates people's credibility levels based on their number
of posts and their join-date.

In all candid honesty wouldn't you agree?

​
Click to expand...


No what I find funny is that dubert stops posting, then all of suddenly you join, then take over where he left off. Defending a possible fake site (i.e. Major YNOS) and this dude work who you can’t vouch for (unless your him Jeremy>Dubert>Tesselator).

What’s funny is that dubert writing/typing (posting) was down right sloppy looking (done on purpose), yet your posting is so clean looking. Humm….

One troll with multiple accounts!?!

Japan thing really took the cake..... ;)
 
Well, take a gander at this then. A rather simple game, being produced on the PC and PS3, both right now using the PC code, un-optimized for the PS3 yet the PS3 can handle it at 720p with a solid 49FPS framerate.

ingame3.jpg


Compared even to Killzone, the vehicular detail, the character detail, the floor and environment textures are very much comparable to Killzone.
 
Hmmm, the screens seem to be back up.


http://jeremy.lwidof.net/demoreel/images/shotlist/shotlist_004.jpg
Look at that environment and tell me that ain't doable in realtime.

http://jeremy.lwidof.net/demoreel/images/shotlist/shotlist_003.jpg
The smoke here looks like stacks of traditional realtime particles, definitely doable in my book.

http://jeremy.lwidof.net/demoreel/images/shotlist/shotlist_001.jpg
Look at the fire in front of the gun nozzle, it's definitely doable too.

http://www.gizmodo.com/gadgets/images/killzone_ps3.jpg
Quite IMPRESSIVE GROUND TEXTURES, we sure haven't seen better in realtime;)

Lot's of things within that trailer are either to spec or lazily done below what's possible even in realtime games. BTW, I'm amazed that guy dares post this as some impressive cg, mate you know they mistook it for a realtime application, impressive for a realtime deal, that is pathetic for cg work.

SanGreal said:
Why do you keep saying the still shots are gone? They are still there.

Also, this post may interest you: http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=killzone&message.id=73473#M73473
Click to expand...


It was created to the specs of the PS3 and represents what we feel is achievable on PS3.- Ferret7
Killzone Dev Team
Click to expand...
Interesting indeed, to spec means pretty much with assets limited to what they believe would be usable ingame given the ps3 specs. Touch up here or there, or a few added effects/improved lighting isn't out of the question. I mean we've seen games that look like night and day different, and that's due to the ridiculous IQ enhancements most games go through nowadays.

centerofadmiration said:
Well, take a gander at this then. A rather simple game, being produced on the PC and PS3, both right now using the PC code, un-optimized for the PS3 yet the PS3 can handle it at 720p with a solid 49FPS framerate.

ingame3.jpg


Compared even to Killzone, the vehicular detail, the character detail, the floor and environment textures are very much comparable to Killzone.
Click to expand...

Alas that's not even the ps3, but the much weaker ps3 dev. kits from months ago*(given it's a mag.).
 
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Nerve-Damage said:
No what I find funny is that dubert stops posting, then all of suddenly you join, then take over where he left off. Defending a possible fake site (i.e. Major YNOS) and this dude work who you can’t vouch for (unless your him Jeremy>Dubert>Tesselator).

What’s funny is that dubert writing/typing (posting) was down right sloppy looking (done on purpose), yet your posting is so clean looking. Humm….

One troll with multiple accounts!?!

Japan thing really took the cake..... ;)
Click to expand...


Well thanks I think. But I'm sure the moderator here can vouch for
the fact that I am indeed in Japan and that dubert is indeed not in
Japan. Additionally with a little time in a search engine you will
find that J.H. is in yet a different country from either of us two.

Now faking all those IPs for years in advance of this thread would
be what I call "very elaborate".

​

Anyway I have to go now. dubert will likly be back before I return
(If I return) adding yet more fuel to your elaborate paranoia.

Have fun all...
 
Nerve-Damage said:
No what I find funny is that dubert stops posting, then all of suddenly you join, then take over where he left off. Defending a possible fake site (i.e. Major YNOS) and this dude work who you can’t vouch for (unless your him Jeremy>Dubert>Tesselator).

What’s funny is that dubert writing/typing (posting) was down right sloppy looking (done on purpose), yet your posting is so clean looking. Humm….

One troll with multiple accounts!?!

Japan thing really took the cake..... ;)
Click to expand...
You think the site is a fake? Are you kidding me... do a search on the guys name. Very VERY hard to miss or misinterpret what he does.

Also, the still shots haven't gone anywhere, they're still on his site. Drop the conspiracy theory.
 
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