Ken Kutaragi Interview by Hiroshige Goto (PC Wach)

[Brad Grenz]

Again, if it's not the lowest common denominator game code won't be written to take advantage of it.

No, I agree with you. I don't think it will have much, if any application in realtime games. But it can do other things. Fold proteins, for example, 24x7. Or what if it could recompress your MPEG2 files from your PVR/TiVo into MPEG4 for long time storage? That way you don't need more expensive hardware to capture HD in MPEG4 in realtime, the quality can be higher cause you can use multipass compression, and you can save a lot more episodes than you would be able to otherwise. Upsampling media from SD into HD is another use that has been suggested. Also, I think I remember Sony talking about software that would analyse media and sort it based on content. Like it takes all the jpgs from your camera, figures out which ones were from the beach and puts them all in a folder regardless of filename. Your PS3 would not only be the portal to this content, but it could combine the processing power of its cell with, say, the 4 SPE cell in your Cell Storage box in the closet.

I don't know if any of this stuff will ever be common or widespread or if Sony will follow up on it this generation, but the ideas are intriguing.

 

[mckmas8808]

Intriging indeed. Consumers will want almost anything if the respect company can make it easy as possible to understand and if there is a need for it. What the last two posters have stated in wanted by consumers on some level, but probably hard to explain to the average joe.

This is where MS excels. They also know what the cosumers want yet they know the best and easiest way to explain and use the application.

 

[ralexand]

Intriging indeed. Consumers will want almost anything if the respect company can make it easy as possible to understand and if there is a need for it. What the last two posters have stated in wanted by consumers on some level, but probably hard to explain to the average joe.

This is where MS excels. They also know what the cosumers want yet they know the best and easiest way to explain and use the application.

It also help that they have a windows xp in alot homes already that they can exploit as a network server device without requiring a new investment. In fact MS focus on that is probably a direct response to what Sony they heard sony is trying to do in a propietary manner with cell etc. That's why they emphasized in their press conference that the 360 can connect to an ipod unlike sony who is only compatible with their own products ie. psp. Their words not mine.

 

[Avon_Implosion]

an optional HDD isn't necessarily good...wont this have a massive affect on dev support for the HDD?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Depends whether Sony can convince people to buy it or not. The EyeToy sold in sufficient numbers for it's features to creep into other games. If the HD were sold in a bundle, at a loss, with a big name game (GTA in the west, FF in the East say), Sony can stagger the cost compared with bundling it with the console at launch and still get lots out there. Once a ffew million are installed there'll be a market for HD specialised games, promoting takeup...

That didn't happen with the PS2 HD because it was a) Extraordinarily late, b) Cost far too much, c) Was dropped with the slimline model. Sony didn't put any effort into it.

Hopefully they'll tackle the PS3 HD differently.

 

[mckmas8808]

Good point Shifty. I've heard people talking about bundles, but I understand the real benefit of it. You're right if (big if) Sony bundles it and sales a lot of them from DAY 1 some devs would program for them even if its not in everyone PS3.

 

[Titanio]

I think undoubtedly they would. Look at the online situation on PS2 - no standard hardware, but ultimately almost as many online games as Xbox, and with a MMORPG to boot. I think the HD may have eventually seen as strong support as Xbox's if they hadn't killed it with slim (Sony probably advised partners of that in advance of happening).

For better or worst, the volumes associated with a Playstation platform allow it some liberties when it comes to optional hardware. That said, there's no telling how a HD may be used if it was included as standard in every Playstation. But that's a comparison with its own potential - and yes, certain things can happen with v. high volumes that otherwise wouldn't - and not that of competitors.

 

[MrSpiggott]

Does anybody know the import TAX savings to Europe Sony would make if the PS3 was designated as a PC? I wonder if it'd compare to the cost of a cheap drive bought in huge quantities?

 

[jvd]

If the hdd isn't packed in from the start it will never get wide spread dev support . Even if they price the hdd at 10$ it wont sell in enough numbers for more than a few devs to take advantage of it and even then it will be the devs that need to use it .


The hardrive was bundled with ff this gen and it failed to sell well , i think it sold about a 600k hardrives out of a 80 million installed base .

 

[BlueTsunami]

I think the biggest factor WAS that ONLY Final Fantasy really made use of it (because Sony never really had a widespread release of HDDs). Also the HDD came late in the PS2's life, HDD support wasn't that existent earlier on....so Dev's passed on it. I think if Sony really pushes to get HDDs out (in bundle form with some type of Network Service) they can create a ripple for HDD support.

But I do have to agree, like JVD said...if its not coming with HDD out-of-the-box then Dev's will be more likely to pass on support for it (Even if Sony offers it in some other package).

 

[scooby_dooby]

Either they can count on a harddrive or they can't.

If they can't count on it being there, they'll never be able to use it to it's fullest anyways. And the only games that will support it, are the games that require it.

I think if you looked at the percentage of PS2 games with online, versus the XBOX the xbox would probably have a 3 or 4 times higher ratio. But that's just based on my own guesses. About 1/2 of all xbox games seem to be live aware nowadays.

With the 360 it will be 100% as it's a next-gen requirement. I can really see live taking off this time around, 100% of games support it, with free gold weekends, free silver package all week including video chat(i can chat with my friends across the world for free), then there's the whole tournament/gambling thing. Car races, poker tourney's, I really see it gettin cool.

Now sure what Sony is planning here, but it seems like they don't really have a clear vision, I don't see it being as well set-up, or thought-through as MS's vison.

 

[Titanio]

If the hdd isn't packed in from the start it will never get wide spread dev support . Even if they price the hdd at 10$ it wont sell in enough numbers for more than a few devs to take advantage of it and even then it will be the devs that need to use it .

The hardrive was bundled with ff this gen and it failed to sell well , i think it sold about a 600k hardrives out of a 80 million installed base .

That's one game selling that hardware that required subscription fees

Even if only a small fraction of the userbase buys HDs, it's still a worthwhile market, particularly if the extra content or whatever is already there from other versions on other systems. The market could even be bigger than that of competitors despite it not being standard hardware.

I think if you looked at the percentage of PS2 games with online, versus the XBOX the xbox would probably have a 3 or 4 times higher ratio. But that's just based on my own guesses. About 1/2 of all xbox games seem to be live aware nowadays.

As I mentioned earlier, do a search for PS2 games and Xbox games on Gamespot, tick the online box, and see how many it returns. 155 PS2 games, 170 Xbox games. So standard hardware bought Xbox 15 more online games..

 

[Shifty Geezer]

The hardrive was bundled with ff this gen and it failed to sell well

It costs £100 quid!!! Whenever has any expensive upgrade sold, especially with only one game and no promise of more games? How on EARTH can you say 'if Sony sold an HD for $10 it wouldn't sell'?
Do you REALLY think a $10 HD + GTA-Next Gen bundle wouldn't sell?

Expansions tend not to do well, but there's things Sony could do to promote the medium that they never even glanced at (realistically) with the PS2's pitiful effort.

 

[jvd]

IF sony was really going to make the hardrive 10$ wtf wouldn't they just include it into the box ?

They aren't going to give it away for so little as it would already be in the unit .

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I never said they WOULD, I was pointing out how preposterous your statement was that even at $10 no-one would buy it.

 

[jvd]

I never said they WOULD, I was pointing out how preposterous your statement was that even at $10 no-one would buy it.

Well you should reread because I never said no one would buy it , i said not enough would to make devs support it .


If you have 80 million unit sand 1 million hardrives the devs wont bother with it . IF you have 80million units and 80 million hardrives every dev will support it .


Add to that that rockstars contract with sony is up we may see a new gta first on the x360 and if you dont' have to spend extra on a hardrive you can see alot of people flip over to the x360 side . Same thing in japan . If you can get the ff mmorpg with the xbox 360 and not need to buy a hardrive or the more expensive hardrive add on many will buy the x360

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I never said they WOULD, I was pointing out how preposterous your statement was that even at $10 no-one would buy it.

Well you should reread because I never said no one would buy it , i said not enough would to make devs support it .

Okay, so I said no-one. Let's rephrase the question:

Do you REALLY believe that if Sony sold an HD+GTA//FF-Next gen bundle, not enough people would buy it to make a large enough user base to attract further developments (3+ million say)?

 

[scooby_dooby]

That's one game selling that hardware that required subscription fees

Even if only a small fraction of the userbase buys HDs, it's still a worthwhile market, particularly if the extra content or whatever is already there from other versions on other systems. The market could even be bigger than that of competitors despite it not being standard hardware.

Why are you arguiing this? It's a known fact that perohpherals that aren't bundled do not recieve anywhere enar the same level of support that they would if they were included. There's nothing up for debate here, it's always been this way with consoles.

As I mentioned earlier, do a search for PS2 games and Xbox games on Gamespot, tick the online box, and see how many it returns. 155 PS2 games, 170 Xbox games. So standard hardware bought Xbox 15 more online games..

Wow, do you really believe that logic? You have to take into account the PS2 has many more games overall than the XBOX.

According to gamespot XBOX: 1012 Games
PS2: ~1700

So only 9% of PS2 game were online VS. 17% for the XBOX. Also if you look at number of gamers online, having a built in NIC increased by 4 TIMES the percentage of players online.
(2.4mil PS@ user online / 90,000,0000consoles = 2.7%)
(2mill XBOX User / 20,000,000 consoles = 10%)

Shifty, what do you mean, by "devs will support it"? I can see maybe adding support for soundtracks, or maybe adding support for gamesaves on the HD, but they wil never be able to use it for the really meaningful stuff like downloadable content(unless HD is required for that game), memory caching, and any other use for a HD that actually made a game perform better.

They can't take advantage of any of the performance increases a HD offers, because the majority of their fan base won't have it.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

Having now read One's translation (thanks one!), it gets me wondering what the Cell Storage is. It's accesible from anyone KK says. This makes me think it'll have an IP, like the HDIP EyeToy. Your Cell Storage for your house is a terabyte (so KK says) HD (cluster?) linked to the net and your PS3. The Gigabit network is fast enough for full speed access (save latencies of corse). Likewise your EyeToy is connected over the internet with it's own IP.

So you go to your freind's house, with their PS3 (or Cell based TV?) and access your Cell storage over the network, plus access your EyeToy over the network to video call your mum and tell her you'll be home late for tea.

Plus homebrew. He's talking about video editing and photo editing on PS3. KK's really aiming for a slice of the PC market it seems.

This seems to be his approach to HD. An HD isn't needed for gaming (KK seems to think) but it is needed for other things. It takes the form in the Cell Universe of a separate mass storage, comparable to XB360 streaming media off a media PC. But different, in that it's available all round the world. So the HD (first level of Cell Storage) might be sold as a 'PC upgrade', with OS, some graphics/media packages of sorts, and be priced as such? :? Who'll supply the video editing software I wonder?

A big vision. Definitely a dreamer is our Ken. I'm dubious he can pull it off. Didn't really work with PS2...

 

[scooby_dooby]

That CELL storage sure sounds like a cool idea.

My only problem is I can't see it being as open as it should be. It would have to be a closed system to prevent things like file sharing and trading movies etc.

Also, with copying DVD's being illegal, how will sony get around that fact? Will other movie publishers allow sony to back up their dvd on an open storage network?? I mean it will never happen.

So then taht brings me back to actual usage, if you can't back up your DVD's, then what's the appeal for the casual consumer? I mean, personally, I'd love a NAS, it would be awesome and I'd fill it with all kinds of goodies from the PC.

But for the casual consumer, if you can't backup DVD's, then what's alll this space really good for??