Is Sony losing its publishing moxie?

[Shifty Geezer]

Form The Order game thread...

I agree wholeheartedly with the comments from Eurogamer (or was it IGN?) saying that this game, like the biggest exclusives on PS4 so far such as KZ and ISS lack characterisation. They just don't have the heart that Nathan Drake and others had. Hopefully this is something that will be fixed as the generation goes on. It all feels a bit hollow to me, and I see 1886 is no different.

LBP and Uncharted aside (which is incredibly derivative as well, but also very charming), I think that's been a problem with post PS2 Sony exclusives in general. Sly has been replaced by Cole McBland, who himself got replaced by a generation maybe hipster with a beanie. Team Ico hasn't done a single thing in a decade. Killzone has never quite managed to shake the stigma of a me-too shooter designed first and foremost as a corporate counter measure. And even though I really do like Driveclub, it really took me a while to look past its clinical blandness-meets designed-by-committee social hooks personality. Certainly has none of the effortless cool of Wipeout (probably gone for good as well now) or the whimsical brashness of Motorstorm.

I agree with you. I've associated PS with exotic titles, but I feel it's pretty generic now.

Actually, maybe it isn't, thinking aloud. We have some curios coming like TTC and Wild. And a lot of the colour of previous PlayStations came from Japanese 3rd party exclusives. Someone more knowledgable might want to list Sony first/2nd party IPs from different generations to compare. But it does feel like Sony's lost some of their sheen.

 

[London Geezer]

The discussion actually started from my obviously amazing post, to which Sigfried replied... But I won't hold a grudge. Just saying. It's fine. You just didn't quote it. It's ok. Really, no, it's fine!

 

[Shifty Geezer]

So, London-boy started the vicious, destructive, demoralising criticism first. Discuss...

 

[London Geezer]

I can't wait to see this thread turning into a monster.

 

[eastmen]

Not all games are winners. Uncharted had the charismatic Nathen drake while killzone was a failed ps2 game that they brought back with a cgi trailer for the ps3 that got hammered with bad press and was just an okay shooter. I haven't heard anything since that would make newer ones more than just an okay shooter with pretty graphics.

The order was also delayed and is coming out in Feb but has received very little attention in the press from what I can see. I have yet to see a commercial for it anywhere and its been hit with a lot of negative play throughs. The press was hard on it before it was delayed and now we have news that it can be a very short game.

Then take something like drive club that was delayed a year and still launched with huge problems and you start to paint a picture of sony and its exclusives. Perhaps the order will release and be awesome and change the perspective but if it gets middling reviews I don't think the perspective will change until uncharted hits

 

[Deleted member 11852]

I really liked Infamous Second Son although I much preferred the origin story of the original inFamous and loved Cole's powers in inFamous 2, they were fantastic.

Killzone has never been a mainstream hit, it's no Halo and no Uncharted, and nor has Infamous so the PS4 outings really aren't demonstrable as some kind of decline. The Order 1886 gives the appearance of AAA game but, all respect to Ready of Dawn, they're not a stable AAA developers. At least not yet. What sets AAA developers apart is nailing the gameplay mechanics, nailing the characters, nailing the story and above all, nailing the pacing for the duration of the game. Some flashy technical wizardry doesn't hurt none either.

I don't know if Sony has lost of mojo - actually I'm not sure what Sony HQ's direct involvement was in giving direction or suggestions to any of these studios. Uncharted 4 will be the real test and I think it will disappoint if only because of the unrealistic expectations of Naughty Dog. It must suck to be those guys with that kind of pressure.

 

[BoardBonobo]

We've all just got more jaded as we've got older. It's all still fresh and exciting to the younger generation.

 

[iroboto]

We've all just got more jaded as we've got older. It's all still fresh and exciting to the younger generation.

Sometimes we just gotta accept it, that we're old. Games were amazing when we were kids, but we grew up. That transition into adulthood really does play a factor as much as you don't want it to. I used to be fairly competitive gamer, but I've completely lost my competitive edge, and no game seems to be able to bring it back. Competition in small doses for me is okay, but it's not like before where I could be competitive for a whole year straight and each victory just felt more glorious than the last.

I'm not sure if it's because games have changed in such a way that narrative and emotion is easier to enjoy with less effort or what not. But we're screwed in a way. All the game reviewers are, more or less in their 20s+ and lived through the golden ages of gaming. We might be at a weird spot for gaming, and both MS and Sony failing to put out a definitive title for this gen yet might be proof that we're exhausted as gamers, or that we've run out of ideas.

 

[MrFox]

I ca't wait to see this thread turning into a monster.

Why do you say that?
The topic is perfectly neutral and there's no way this can possibly turn into a sony sucks discussion within a few dozen posts.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

We've all just got more jaded as we've got older. It's all still fresh and exciting to the younger generation.

And perhaps part of the problem was two of the four exclusives - Killzone and Infamous - were sequels so there will be some inevitable fatigue with yet another outing of franchise X rather than something new. The Order 1886 certainly appealed to me, it was the execution that caused it drop off my radar this morning.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Then take something like drive club that was delayed a year and still launched with huge problems and you start to paint a picture of sony and its exclusives.

I would dearly love to know the inside story of Drive Club.

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I don't know if Sony has lost of mojo - actually I'm not sure what Sony HQ's direct involvement was in giving direction or suggestions to any of these studios.

Twofold. Firstly, they find and sign talent like Media Molecule. They also have to manage that talent and (sadly) kick out studios that aren't delivering. Secondly, we know they bring some pressure to bare because Sony told ND to make a realistic shooter and that's where Uncharted as is was born. Whether Sony has backed off or not, I don't know. It's certainly a case that the first and second party content is Sony's responsibility though, whether directly or indirectly. They have ultimate say to veto a project.

Which they use. Whatever happened to the Agency?! That sounded awesome!

 

[DuckThor Evil]

I thought Second Son was pretty good, little small but good anyway. They have been dropping the ball quite often imo. Their biggest tumble was releasing Gran Turismo 6 for PS3 at such a late timeframe, it should have been a PS4 game, even if with limited content.

 

[function]

Budgets are bigger, and so risks are reduced forcing limitations on the creative folks.

Wipeout was edgy. It felt new and futuristic, probably because it was. There was no committee around at the time that could have made it.

If you're going to look at Sony exclusives, also take a look at MS exclusives like Halo 4. It's the same kind of thing. It's trying desperately not to be edgy, or take chances, while wanting the appearance of being new and edgy.

People that everyone likes and nobody finds offensive are as boring as fuck.

 

[Deleted member 11852]

Secondly, we know they bring some pressure to bare because Sony told ND to make a realistic shooter and that's where Uncharted as is was born. Whether Sony has backed off or not, I don't know.

Interesting article and I think this was probably a necessary direction to push studios for PS3. We know that Sony most certainly have backed off some because Bruce Straley and Neil Druckmann have said in many interviews that Sony have given them much freedom in choosing to continue with Uncharted or not (The Last of Us). And I'm sure I read a similar sentiment from Sucker Punch. The guys from Evolution Studios said on stage that Drive Club was the game they've wanted to make for years (the trademark has been around for almost a decade) so there is some creative freedom but whether they extends to everybody is unclear. I would guess probably not, Sony must be aware of market trends and some studios will have to produce software to suit those trends regardless of whether or not they'd rather do their own pet projects.

But actually what I meant was is Sony's hand guiding and steering the structure, tone and story of games once in development. Were Sony pushing for a cutscene heavy game or not? RAD are third party so the dynamic is probably different. I wonder it they were more or less hands on. Ditto Bloodborne with is a collaboration with From Software.

I'm not worried about Sony, they have a few dozen studios and not everything can be great, particularly when there is the distraction of learning new hardware. I liked the first Uncharted but it wasn't any kind of blockbuster game - mostly it was clocking 80% scores with the odd 90% and a few 70% scores.

 

[Scott_Arm]

Sony, for me, has had a lot more misses than hits over PS3 and PS4. Naughty Dog has consistently been a hit, but at best the other franchises have had mixed success. Infamous has been a pretty good success. Resistance did very well as a launch title, but then faded under competition. Ratchet and Clank died off, though I'd argue some of those games were quite good. Motorstorm did not live up to the hype and eventually fizzled out. Killzone was hit and miss, never really hitting huge highs, but now seems to have no real excitement about it. Little Big Planet had absolutely huge hype, never lived up to expectations and is now pretty much ignored. Heavy Rain is footnote. Beyond: Two Souls floundered. Drive Club has only excelled at generating screenshot arguments on forums. Gran Turismo has lost its lustre. God of War 3 was a hit, and Ascension seems to have run the series out of gas. Demon's Souls was a great exclusive. The Twisted Metal reboot was a joke. Warhawk and Starhawk didn't take off. Last Guardian is vapourware and now The Order: 1886 may not live up to expectations.

I'm not talking about cheap games. These were all heavy promoted titles with presumably large budgets. I'm not saying they all lost money, or tanked, but I don't think the hit machine is there with the exception of Naughty Dog. Sony seems to have done better when they've snagged exclusive indie games and small titles.

Edit: I forgot to include MAG, and you could also include the Sony Online Entertainment stuff. Also, MGS4 was an exclusive and did very well early for PS3.

 

[DrJay24]

They are green lighting new IPs, that is always a risk. Games are always hit and miss, just like movies. The few hits fund the misses. There is no formula that guarantees success. I guess they could be more like Nintendo and release the same few games and mascots over and over?

 

[Shifty Geezer]

I disagree with LBP. It's sold 8.5 million across 3 titles and is extremely popular with some. LBP3 just hasn't been enough to see people make the transition. So 3 is pretty much ignored, but 1 and 2 weren't/aren't. Other than that, I think you generally make a fair assessment, except I don't think critical and commercial success are what made Sony a special publisher. It was diversity. Not two or three 10 million sellers, but a dozen 2 million sellers. I'm not seeing the diversity I thought I saw with PS1 and 2. Again, that may be more due to Japanese platform exclusives than Sony.

 

[Scott_Arm]

That's fair. I think they've succeeded when they've gone out for small innovative titles, like the PixelJunk stuff, Flower and whatnot. If they want to get back to having a diverse library, that's probably the way to go.

 

[babybumb]

I would shutdown everything but ND. The rest arent competitive in todays market.

Their job is to sell consoles and that job is done more efficiently with 3rd party timed exclusives or full exclusives