IGN, letters page, some PS3 and XB2 speculation

Pugger

Regular
Ivan's reply to a letter.

Do I think PS3 will have the most amazing graphics? Honestly? Not a chance. Just knowing that NVIDIA is supplying Sony with a stock GeForce 6 successor sobers me up quite a bit. If you remember, the Xbox was powered by a sort of GeForce 3. It was impressive, but not revolutionary. I see something similar happening with PS3. I basically hear Cell Processor and think Emotion Engine. Right now PS3 is just a mysterious entity powered by a bunch of dumb as all ass buzzwords that probably won't amount to anything at all. Though, I do sincerely hope to be proven wrong.

Also, ATI has shipped some incredibly impressive graphics cards. From what I understand, the power behind Xbox Next's visuals is said to be leaps ahead of current or even next-generation PC hardware (which means hardware that will release in six months and 12 months, respectively). It's such a robust piece of technology that I've heard Epic's astonishing Unreal 3.0 engine runs maxed out on it without a hitch, and after virtually no work put into the port. Now that's impressive. For those that don't know, the Unreal 3.0 tech features the equivalent of richly detailed Todd McFarlane toys that happen to be capable of moving realistically. It's total insanity. Conversely, I've heard nothing but, "Man is that beast going to be tough and expensive to develop for," from potential PS3 devs.

Still, cross-platform titles are the wave of the future. So, even if one console ekes out the other, most game's will probably be indistinguishable from one another.

Because you mentioned it, Sony did not actually pioneer analog pads. The PSOne controller featured a digital pad, four face buttons, and four shoulders. There were no analog sticks. It wasn't until Nintendo released its N64, which came bundled with an analog capable controller, that Sony rethought its input device strategy and came up with the dual analog configuration we now use. Their design is obviously better (and is now the bar by which all other controllers must live up to), but it was not some brilliant idea they pulled from out of nowhere. It was a brilliant idea they pulled from out of Miyamoto.


Standard GF6, he's got have that wrong, Cutomised next gen GPU would likely have the 7000 notation?
 
Ivan Sulic - Editor, IGN PS2.

Don't know where he's got his information from but a Stock Geforce 6! He needs new contacts in the industry I think.
 
There are so many things that are wrong with that thing (it's not an article, it's not a preview, it's a thing), that it makes the whole... thing... look dumb.

Sony didn't copy the analogue stick with "force feedback" (not real, but that's what they call it) from Nintendo, they copied from Immersion. ;)

Unreal3 wont run like it does on PC unless Xbox (or PS3) has more than 1GB main ram and a lot of VRAM.

Ati has pulled out many great graphic cards lately, but today NVIDIA and ATI are pretty much on par in terms of performance when it comes to the NV4x and the R4xx. So why would the next gen ATI GPU be "so far ahead of the time" while NVIDIA's next gen GPU will be "just a GF6 sequel"?

Sounds like fanboyish talk to me. He could be right, don't get me wrong, but at this point he knows as much as we do, if not less, and his tone is quite one-sided.

Not something i'd base my opinion on.
 
Well it maybe one sided opinion but this is why its making news, He's the PS2 editor and obviously tends to be slightly slanted towards the PS2 cause as his readers would except. As for Unreal running I think we know it will run differnetly on the consoles but if they have the thing up and running at full spec with just a small amount of recoding it does seem quite impressive.
 
There's really no point in discussing the opinion of someone that takes the current PC situation and some rumours he heard as a solid basis to say that platform "x"s graphics won't be amazing...
 
Phil said:
There's really no point in discussing the opinion of someone that takes the current PC situation and some rumours he heard as a solid basis to say that platform "x"s graphics won't be amazing...

I get the feeling he's purposely being pessimistic.
 
Pugger said:
Well it maybe one sided opinion but this is why its making news, He's the PS2 editor and obviously tends to be slightly slanted towards the PS2 cause as his readers would except. As for Unreal running I think we know it will run differnetly on the consoles but if they have the thing up and running at full spec with just a small amount of recoding it does seem quite impressive.

It's IGN. The do in-depth reviews, fuck up the scores according to how convenient it is to them, and know nothing about the technology behind what they review.
Unreal3 will not run *like it does on PC* (note the *like it runs on PC*) on anything that doesn't have a lot of RAM, much more than the new consoles are rumored to have, unless they majorly recode the whole thing to stream most of its contents off optical disc. And even then, it would not be the same.
 
monkey.jpg


Fredi
 
As if we didn't have enough troll posts of our own in these boards, do we really need such posts from other boards to be copied and pasted here.
 
Londonboy,

Yes most of what he said was pure conjecture. However he wasn't far off the mark in everything he said. he's an editor at IGN with lots' of developer contacts. I'm a little baffled why he would post that considering what section of the site he works for.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/editorial/display/ces2005_2.html
This is the next generation GPU, so after the GeForce 6 series this is going to be the next generation. So, this will be everything we have in GeForce 6 + whatever else we bring out.

http://gamesdomain.yahoo.com/preview/28441
Which consoles? Sweeney was cagy. "We can't really announce anything right now -- I shouldn't really use the plural yet. We have the engine running really well on the development kit for one next-generation console." Draw your own conclusions, but thanks to the Unreal engine's strong PC heritage, we'd speculate it's Microsoft's Xbox successor.

Sure things can be open to interpretation, but I think you'd be more foolish to compeletly blow off everything he says without you/yourself knowing more than him.
 
Qroach said:
Londonboy,

Yes most of what he said was pure conjecture. However he wasn't far off the mark in eveyrting he said.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/editorial/display/ces2005_2.html
This is the next generation GPU, so after the GeForce 6 series this is going to be the next generation. So, this will be everything we have in GeForce 6 + whatever else we bring out.

http://gamesdomain.yahoo.com/preview/28441
Which consoles? Sweeney was cagy. "We can't really announce anything right now -- I shouldn't really use the plural yet. We have the engine running really well on the development kit for one next-generation console." Draw your own conclusions, but thanks to the Unreal engine's strong PC heritage, we'd speculate it's Microsoft's Xbox successor.

Sure things can be open to interpretation, but I think you'd be more foolish to compeletly blow off everything he says without you/yourself knowing more than him.


I was commenting on the fact that according to him, the next gen ATI chip will be far above anything else, while NVIDIA's one will be "just a sequel to NV40". Why? Is the R5xx not "just a R4xx sequel"?

Things can be open to interpratation, yes, but when an engine requires some ridiculous amount of Ram like Unreal3 engine will, no matter what computing power the next consoles have, it will look different. The fact that "i know little" doesn't change that.
 
Isn't it a bit unfair to judge next gen consoles by a single game, especially a game that has it's roots in PC and Microsoft DIrectX tech?
 
Like I said, most of what he said was pure conjecture.

when an engine requires some ridiculous amount of Ram like Unreal3 engine will, no matter what computing power the next consoles have, it will look different.

Do you know how much ram Xbox 2 (or PS3) has? No... Or for that matter how much RAM Ue3 needs? I'd say no again. Sure we heard sweeny talk about ram numbers last year, but who knows what that is now.

The fact that "i know little" doesn't change that.
if you say so, but I strongly disagree...
 
Ati has pulled out many great graphic cards lately, but today NVIDIA and ATI are pretty much on par in terms of performance when it comes to the NV4x and the R4xx. So why would the next gen ATI GPU be "so far ahead of the time" while NVIDIA's next gen GPU will be "just a GF6 sequel"?

OF course they are on par.

But you forget the r420 is a modified r300 core.


The nv40 is a brand new core .

So ati is actually ahead as they've had more time for r&d on thier next parts

Esp when u take the r520 which is just an sm 3.0 r420 .

This could actually give them a leap above nvidia like they had with the r300 and nv30
 
Ivan said:
Right now PS3 is just a mysterious entity powered by a bunch of dumb as all ass buzzwords that probably won't amount to anything at all. Though, I do sincerely hope to be proven wrong.

Seems to me he's kind of pissed for not getting any inside information.


Also, ATI has shipped some incredibly impressive graphics cards. From what I understand, the power behind Xbox Next's visuals is said to be leaps ahead of current or even next-generation PC hardware (which means hardware that will release in six months and 12 months, respectively).

Is there any source available to suggest that next gen ATI will be "DA BOMB" while next gen nVIDIA will be just an enhanced 6800? If there is please show me.

It's such a robust piece of technology that I've heard Epic's astonishing Unreal 3.0 engine runs maxed out on it without a hitch, and after virtually no work put into the port. Now that's impressive. For those that don't know, the Unreal 3.0 tech features the equivalent of richly detailed Todd McFarlane toys that happen to be capable of moving realistically. It's total insanity.

That's awesome! But still, I don't expect less from either consoles.


Conversely, I've heard nothing but, "Man is that beast going to be tough and expensive to develop for," from potential PS3 devs.

This makes sense. IMO, it's possible that the first gen Xbox2 games may have a lead. But I also think that once developers get proficient in programming the in the CELL architecture, the PS3 games may take a good lead over the Xbox2 ones. If CELL is everything they say, there's simply no comparison in raw processing power. Even if 3D rendering continues at the same level between both consoles, think of what would it mean for PS3 games to have all that extra power for AI, Physics, character animation and so on...
 
Is there any source available to suggest that next gen ATI will be "DA BOMB" while next gen nVIDIA will be just an enhanced 6800? If there is please show me.

well from the info and rumors we have , we find this

nv50 cancelled .

Reasons why this could be true

this was going to be a dx next or wgf 1.0 chip or at least support some of the features for it . But since wgf 1.0 wont be out for at least another year there is no reason to bring it to the market

another reason is that since there is no wgf a faster nv40 with some small modifications on 90nm will clock faster than the nv50 would have and offred more performance on the dx 9 games that will be the driving force for the next 2 years .


Secondly .

r520 . not very impressive. Its basicly going to be an sm3.0 version of the r420 with perhaps (Doubtfull ) 24 pipelines or a hundred or two hundred mhz more on the clock .

THirdly

Sli . If nvidia had another part 12 months down the line from the nv40 that was much faster than the nv40 they wouldn't have brought out sli as it would eat into the market of this faster chip


What we do know is for the dx 9 generation ati has had the fastest graphics card .

The 9700pro was faster than the 5800ultra fx , 9800xt was faster than the 5950ultra fx , x80xt pe is faster than the geforce 6800 ultra extreme .

If this trend continues we might see a faster gpu in xenon than the ps3 .

After all sony has traditionaly put its main focus into its cpu .
 
ninelven said:
jvd said:
LOL. That's akin to saying nvidia was ahead when their FX cards were out, but I digress...

No thats like saying nvidia had the potential to still be ahead with thier fx cards .


Based on the past track record of both ati and nvidia at that time nvidia was in the lead . But do to mistakes on thier part (xbox contract , nforce , trying to make dx9 into what they wanted , being to agressive with processes ) they fumbled the ball .

I only pointed out possible reasons why ati could still have the tech advantage .
 
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