I have seen the PS2 light!

Marc,
Rygar looks like a shimmering mess compared to DOA3. Only when you summon the beast and you have that motion blurring, does the image looks MUCH better.

As i said it in my previous post, Motion blur everything PS2 and it will be fine. :D

You heard that Faf? Fafracer to use high quality PS2 hardware specific motion blur! :oops:
 
Only when you summon the beast and you have that motion blurring, does the image looks MUCH better.
Well, that's your opinion, that I apparently don't share in Rygar's case. Although, Sly Cooper indeed looks nice with it's slight blurring.
 
oh no, not this again!

Go play Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance or Mortal Kombat V or even SSX for some examples of jaggies free/high image quality PS2 games.
 
It's something noticeable in a lot of games exhibiting fairly monotone color schemes, from an early title like Ridge Racer V to later games like MGS2 and Baldur's Gate, to even recent good-lookers like The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers. Generally, looking into dark areas or out towards the horizon can reveal some 16-bit like banding at times
I think you're mixing up image dithering with a bunch of other things that aren't necesserily related.
Neither MGS2 or R5 ran in 16bit to begin with(they certainly aren't dithered at any rate). BG I've only seen very little off, so I couldn't say.
Two Towers does have it apparent in parts, but again, I don't know if we're talking about the same thing. I'd note that TT appears to predominantly use 4bit textures, and coupled with low color tones which are already banding prone even in 24bit, that's probably more of what you noticed. Though the color tones they chose do work to expose screen dither matrix pattern more as well.


Chap said:
You heard that Faf? Fafracer to use high quality PS2 hardware specific motion blur!
Eh, no thanks, one Type-S was quite enough (no offense to Archie ;)).
 
LOTR:TTT is the only game that comes to mind that has visible dithering (and it's really apparent only in some parts of few levels) I could swear Baldur's Gate: DA had nothing of that problem, and MGS2 most certainly didn't, except very minor banding on some lens flares (but if we are to include such instances, there are many games on other consoles that exibit such miniscule problems like transparent surfaces in Halo for example) Point in case, MGS2 more than likely uses 24 bit buffers. If it used only 16bit, given it's color palete and contrast range, there would be banding and dithering everywhere, while mostly there's none.
 
Go play Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance or Mortal Kombat V or even SSX for some examples of jaggies free/high image quality PS2 games.

Yes, BGDA and SSX look good(have not seen MKDA) but they only constitute a very very small proportion of clean looking PS2 games. Even high profile PS2 games like MGS2, FFX, DMC, GT3, Kingdom Hearts all suffer from unstable picture image problems. :cry:

Blur filter is the cheap AA hack in which all PS2 games should have IMO. :!:
 
With a little blur filter....ahh so beautiful. :oops:
thebouncer_18.jpg
 
C'mon, over excessive motion-blur was the in thing in those early days!
Which of course wouldn't have anything to do with the fact you could enable it with as little as setting two register values? ;)

At any rate, I'm rather content with our IQ as it is - although Sony still forced me to make 3 different settings for flicker filter :? ... so much for all people wanting the same thing.
 
Which of course wouldn't have anything to do with the fact you could enable it with as little as setting two register values?

At any rate, I'm rather content with our IQ as it is - although Sony still forced me to make 3 different settings for FF ... so much for all people wanting the same thing.

So motion blurring is easy to turn on? All the more for teh motion blur!
Send me a demo of AI and lemme be the judge for the IQ. It is for the better IMO. :D
WTF is FF? Force Feedback? Final Fantasy Impact? :oops:
 
And yes, it is still present in the latest games, go check out Rygar or Shinobi and even R&C.


2 Titles from dev.s who haven't worked much on the ps2, and a game that probably uses the Jak&Daxter engine....


Then how come some newer games still have absolutely horrendous aliasing, like Virtua Fighter 4. If that games problems aren’t due to half height frame buffer, is it simply running at a lower resolution?

Wasn't that one of AM2's first games on ps2...

Motion blur everything PS2 and it will be fine.

NO!!! Vice city looks better without the filter.

Yes, BGDA and SSX look good(have not seen MKDA) but they only constitute a very very small proportion of clean looking PS2 games. Even high profile PS2 games like MGS2, FFX, DMC, GT3, Kingdom Hearts all suffer from unstable picture image problems.

Nice those titles came out when most dev.s where beginning to understand the ps2 architecture. Give it sometime and what appears in few titles will spread accross the entire library of most future titles.

Games like onimusha 3 are said to be rendered entirely in realtime and are said to approach the previous cg titles. Japanesse rpgs are to come in great quantities, and they can render even to just half of the screen(FF7 style...), most of the time they have one char on screen, can run at 30fps, and many of the battle effects are likely to be as low on h/w demand as cutscenes....(hint: IQ will ...)

I wouldn't be surprised if by the end of this gen. RR7 came with a copy of RR5 running at least internally at 120FPS with HDTV resolution, and no IQ problems...(ala RR4 with RR1 running at high rez 60fps last gen.)
 
chap:
WTF is FF?
Flicker filtering I presume.

Wait... he changed it in his message.

I understand they're the publisher and all, but it seems they're a little uptight about the whole "jaggiez" issue. They must have done their fair share of scouring internet messageboards!
 
Even high profile PS2 games like MGS2, FFX, DMC, GT3, Kingdom Hearts all suffer from unstable picture image problems
MGS2 has some of the most stable image quality I've ever seen on an interlaced TV. Really, have you even played it? FFX and KH, as far as I know are 30FPS games and have none of the flickering or interlacing problems of any kind. They do, however, exhibit some mipmapping problems.

Are you sure you are not just trolling (again)?


At any rate, I'm rather content with our IQ as it is - although Sony still forced me to make 3 different settings for flicker filter ... so much for all people wanting the same thing.
Whoa... How is that even done? Is there some kind of flicker fixer setting in the options dialog in the game? What are the differences between the three?
 
motion blur is good if used very subtlely. I honestly hate excessive motion blur.

A lot of games use motion blur. I have a feeling that The Bouncer is using something different than your average motion blurred game.
 
Ugh... I've finally got to play the full version of Rygar, and I see what Chap is talking about. So far, I only tried the demo of the first level and was very satisfied with how it looked. Indeed, first level in the game looks really nice, but all that goes out of the window on the second level, which has to be the single most flickering and shimmering mess I ever did see. If the rest of the game is like this, forget everything I've said about it looking better than R&C. Shame, really, as the game is actually so pretty otherwise :(
 
It may not serve well for topical evaluations, but please do note that even quality within different levels of a single game can vary wildly. FWIW, even Turok on the PS2 had some fairly decent looking levels farther into the game, but you could never tell that just by looking at the intro levels. Dead to Rights may look merely mediocre on average, but I've found 1 or 2 levels that seemed unusually "better worked" than the rest. Same thing with Red Faction2. Maybe different developers/artists get involved on different game levels?
 
Marc,
Whoa... How is that even done? Is there some kind of flicker fixer setting in the options dialog in the game? What are the differences between the three?
Pretty much like in T4 options you have two settings(sharp/soft), you get three here... Not my idea mind you, I'd personally just leave it at one (highest) setting, but it's just something that was decided so... :p

On the subject of art varying across levels, it's entirely possible different stages are made by completely different artists at times, so variations are kinda to be expected (although art directors usually try to make sure they are kept to minimum).
 
You guys want to see some serious image quality, pop in RE0 and Metroid Prime. And speaking of transparancies..MP has some of the best I've seen on my 50" big screen.
 
Fafalada said:
Pretty much like in T4 options you have two settings(sharp/soft), you get three here... Not my idea mind you, I'd personally just leave it at one (highest) setting, but it's just something that was decided so... :p

What's the third setting for? Sharp/Soft/????
 
I am not trolling. :cry:
Go play your PS2 on a bigger TV and all the image problems are magnified. Sony just totally fucked up PS2 video out quality.

I remember ninge from GA saying the same thing too and that Sony recommend developers to use the odd 525 x 'something' resolution for their games. Which might explain the 'lowres PS2 look' :cry:
 
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